IB vs. A-levels

Reply 100

Siddd

Chemistry, Bio and Geography, for instance, are not of the same difficulty as their A-Level counterparts are.

Wrong. I have no idea about Geography, but HL Biology and Chemistry are certainly as difficult, if not more so, than their A Level counterparts. It depends how you determine the 'difficulty'.

IB HL Chemistry has very slightly less advanced content in some areas, depending on which options are taken (for example, A Level has greater depth in Organic unless the Further Organic Chemistry option is taken at IB). However, the IB course contains some content that is left out of the A Level (I think one of these topics is hybridization). Regardless, my Chemistry teacher said that the way the IB course is assessed more than makes up for the fact that the content might be slightly easier. 3 final exams, 2 of which are completely synoptic and 1 on the options, are much more challenging than a modular system. (I know that most A Level specifications have one synoptic paper, but the WHOLE IB assessment is entirely synoptic.)

In terms of Biology, A Level and IB HL are pretty much on par in terms of difficulty in content, the depth just varies in different areas. Some of the content on nucleic acids was not covered by some of our teachers until they got to university, and from my own experience as a Biology undergraduate, the option in Evolution put me far ahead of A Level students in that area. However, A Level goes deeper into some other aspects, for example I think slightly more detail is needed in the A Level course when learning about respiration and plant biology. However, again, the method of assessment makes IB HL Biology arguably a more challenging course. It is notoriously difficult to get a 7 simply because the amount of material is huge, and the assessment is completely synoptic.

Reply 101

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

13

In all seriousness, IB sounds like a qualification someone might want to do in their spare time, if they wanted to learn loads about a particular topic. A levels don't cover as much because they don't need too; I hardly want to learn everything there is to know about the English language, just enough to help me with my progression on to university where I can learn a particular subject I enjoy in depth (same with Music, Fine Art etc.) From what everyone says here, A levels seem to not have as much breadth but go into more depth with smaller parts of particular subjects. There certainly seems to be a bigger work load when it comes to coursework anyway; 4000 words is absolutely nothing if that's what all you IB students have to do.

A levels are sufficient enough to help you progress to more challenging university study. You're certainly not spoon fed anything, it's just a lot less is covered within subject areas. If they truly were as easy and useless as people here claim, then universities wouldn't have them as their primary admission criteria.

The TSR IB population seriously need to get down of their high horses and realise they aren't better or more intellectual than everyone else because they're studying a different type of qualification. (I didn't have the choice anyway!)

Reply 102

Izzen

7

Siddd

Class discussion aren't exactly oral commentaries. We had class discussions when we did our GCSEs. Oral commentary is when you stand up in front of a judging body and deliver a speech, in essence, about your area of interest in a literary piece you have studied.

... Aka a presentation? Standard practice in the classroom.

Reply 103

thepieofpie

7

Siddd

Just to clear matters up. I spoke to my counselor and he explicitly said that IB HL Maths is more advanced than A-Level Maths.

A level maths is probaly the most dumbed down of all the A levels. I think this is due to the poor quality teaching of the subject in the UK, less than half of the high school maths teachers are maths grads and as they needed kids to choose to do maths they dumbed it down. I mean just look at the maths course, P1-3 is now C1-4, no new material added so students have to do one less application. Even further maths has been dumbed down a bit, intrinsic co-ordinates are removed (most people I've asked say that is the hardest bit of maths at A level).

Reply 104

Jasper.Paterson

fizzicsfiend

Without trying to sound too juvenile, I think you're missing the point really.
And is it the word you disagree with, or the idea? Maybe 'spoonfed' is too strong? It's not particularly helpful just saying 'I disagree'..

I didn't know I was supposed to spoonfeed you! :smile:

I meant in reference to IB people becoming independent learners whereas people who do A Levels are just spoonfed.

Since you do the IB, surely you can't really make that assumption. Also as you've only been doing it for 6 months.

Reply 105

gozatron

16

gingerbread_traveller

I highly doubt that. Which subject was it? How long did you have to write it?

English - Was Magwitch a Criminal or a victim of society
6,000 words (great expectations)
- Who was responsible for Macbeths downfall
5,800 words (Macbeth)
- Compare the poems, how do the writers
Present the trouble faced by the light
brigade (Tennyson/Kipling) 5,200 Words

Science - Rate of reactions (Mg + Hcl)
8,000 words

Geography - Norwich + Wells-next-the-sea case study
(Also, comparason to Mexico city)
10,300 words

History - Was Al Capone public enemy number one
7,000 words

These were all courseworks for GCSE, that i had around two-three weeks to write each. A 4,000 word essay wouldnt have been a tall order after this lot.

Reply 106

Lifeisnice

9

thepieofpie

A level maths is probaly the most dumbed down of all the A levels. I think this is due to the poor quality teaching of the subject in the UK, less than half of the high school maths teachers are maths grads and as they needed kids to choose to do maths they dumbed it down. I mean just look at the maths course, P1-3 is now C1-4, no new material added so students have to do one less application. Even further maths has been dumbed down a bit, intrinsic co-ordinates are removed (most people I've asked say that is the hardest bit of maths at A level).

That's why you should choose to do Cambridge Pre-Us if possible. Its like the classic A levels, except possibly even more difficult.

Reply 107

fizzicsfiend

Jasper.Paterson

I meant in reference to IB people becoming independent learners whereas people who do A Levels are just spoonfed.
Since you do the IB, surely you can't really make that assumption. Also as you've only been doing it for 6 months.

Why ever not? I'm certainly in a better position than you are to say that IB kids become independent learners. Search for something called the IB learner profile - it's one of the aim's of the programme, not merely my opinion. If what I have seen with my own eyes counts for evidence as well... To be honest you're taking it out of context. The main idea that keeps being reiterated is that the IB focuses on teaching you HOW to learn as well as sticking it all in your head.

Reply 108

fizzicsfiend

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

In all seriousness, IB sounds like a qualification someone might want to do in their spare time

This made me laugh :woo:

The 4000 word extended essay is not coursework at all but something that has to be juggled around all other class subjects and is primarily a research project. Roughly, (very roughly) each individual subject at IB has around 24% coursework. The exams that comprise the rest are all taken at one point in the year (may or nov) and they aren't modular so if you screw up once it's all over. Someone listed (Gozatron I think?) word counts for a bunch of essays they did at GCSE. What exam board did you do, and do they have no word limits or something? I highly doubt the examiners read 10000 word essays from every person entering the exams. :s-smilie:

The oral commentaries mentioned earlier by someone are actually taped, marked, and sent off for moderation so can't be compared to a bog-standard presentation in class. They have extremely subjective marking criteria and you only get one shot at it.

Another thing about coursework for example is that for second languages, not all the coursework is sent off. The IB selects a few from a range of marks in the class, and then if they feel the teacher has been too lenient they tend to mark the WHOLE class down by a few marks, without even looking at the rest of the work. Fair or what? Cases like this explain why the IB hasn't been subject to grade inflation.

TOK seems to not have been mentioned at all, and you lucky people don't have to do CAS either. Check out the wiki on the diploma program, before making ridiculous statements like suggesting you could do IB in your free time.

Reply 109

Jasper.Paterson

fizzicsfiend

Why ever not? I'm certainly in a better position than you are to say that IB kids become independent learners. Search for something called the IB learner profile - it's one of the aim's of the programme, not merely my opinion. If what I have seen with my own eyes counts for evidence as well... To be honest you're taking it out of context. The main idea that keeps being reiterated is that the IB focuses on teaching you HOW to learn as well as sticking it all in your head.

Yes, but that makes me in a better position than you are to say A Level kids become independent learners?!

Reply 110

fizzicsfiend

Jasper.Paterson

Yes, but that makes me in a better position than you are to say A Level kids become independent learners?!

Gosh you're stubborn... well yes, but frankly I've given oodles of points to back me up and you haven't. Again, what exactly is the basis of your argument?? Cutting across other people's points with no counterclaims and a 'you've no place to say that!' type of attitude isn't helping.
This whole thread is a comparison hence the title "IB vs. A-Levels".

If you genuinely think the average A level student is more of an independent learner than the average IB student, convince me.

Reply 111

TheNamelessGrace

OP

6

I love how my thread has turned into some hate war between IBists and Alevelists :smile:

But on a serious note, would you say that doing the IB makes you stand out when applying for the Russell Group Unis? I wouldn't like to think that I would be doing all that work and not get any recognition for it when applying to university

Oh, and thanks for all your opinions so far :biggrin:

Reply 112

gingerbread_traveller

1

gozatron

English - Was Magwitch a Criminal or a victim of society
6,000 words (great expectations)
- Who was responsible for Macbeths downfall
5,800 words (Macbeth)
- Compare the poems, how do the writers
Present the trouble faced by the light
brigade (Tennyson/Kipling) 5,200 Words

Science - Rate of reactions (Mg + Hcl)
8,000 words

Geography - Norwich + Wells-next-the-sea case study
(Also, comparason to Mexico city)
10,300 words

History - Was Al Capone public enemy number one
7,000 words

These were all courseworks for GCSE, that i had around two-three weeks to write each. A 4,000 word essay wouldnt have been a tall order after this lot.

No, but if you had another 2 subjects and had to write it at the same time, then I'm sure it would be. And that's at GCSE.

I hate how A-level people think we "over-exaggerate" about the IB. Yes A levels are easier because you take (usually) half the subjects we do. I'm sure if in IB you took 3 subjects only and they were your best subjects then it would be a similar type of thing to A levels.

Reply 113

Scherzando225

9

TheNamelessGrace

I love how my thread has turned into some hate war between IBists and Alevelists :smile:

But on a serious note, would you say that doing the IB makes you stand out when applying for the Russell Group Unis? I wouldn't like to think that I would be doing all that work and not get any recognition for it when applying to university

Oh, and thanks for all your opinions so far :biggrin:

yep it was inevitable to resort to some IB Alevel beef!

well it depends on what course you want to do, but your last point basically sums up the main disadvantage of IB - all the extra work won't usually get recognised by unis.

Reply 114

Ray_Han

11

gingerbread_traveller

I highly doubt that. Which subject was it? How long did you have to write it?

My history c/w (GCSE) currently stands at 5800 words, and its not completely finished. My other history coursework and my 2 R/S coursework pieces all exceed 4000 words. I appreciate that the level of difficulty of the IB work will be much greater, but 4000 words is not that much. Even with the rest of the work, it should only take a few hours.

Reply 115

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

13

TheNamelessGrace

I love how my thread has turned into some hate war between IBists and Alevelists :smile:

But on a serious note, would you say that doing the IB makes you stand out when applying for the Russell Group Unis? I wouldn't like to think that I would be doing all that work and not get any recognition for it when applying to university

Oh, and thanks for all your opinions so far :biggrin:

No, it most definitely doesn't make you stand out. Maybe it will in the future, who knows, but you'll get no special recognition for doing IB instead of A levels; the majority of students don't get the choice so obviously that wouldn't be justified.

Reply 116

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

13

gingerbread_traveller

No, but if you had another 2 subjects and had to write it at the same time, then I'm sure it would be. And that's at GCSE.

I hate how A-level people think we "over-exaggerate" about the IB. Yes A levels are easier because you take (usually) half the subjects we do. I'm sure if in IB you took 3 subjects only and they were your best subjects then it would be a similar type of thing to A levels.

Whoop-de-f*cking do, congratulations! If you're going to keep complaining about the work load then why on Earth did you take the qualification in the first place? Sorry, but that's completely illogical and this isn't a competition to prove who does the most work. Please don't give me any crap like it's fueling your independence skills either.

At the end of the day, IB gives you no advantages over A levels, not in this present day, so if you believe it's the case that you have to do so much more to ultimately achieve the same thing, then you're stupid for taking IB.

Reply 117

gozatron

16

gingerbread_traveller

No, but if you had another 2 subjects and had to write it at the same time, then I'm sure it would be. And that's at GCSE.

I hate how A-level people think we "over-exaggerate" about the IB. Yes A levels are easier because you take (usually) half the subjects we do. I'm sure if in IB you took 3 subjects only and they were your best subjects then it would be a similar type of thing to A levels.

You completely misreading my point. Even with your subjects a 4,000 word essay shouldn't drastically increase your workload.

Reply 118

fizzicsfiend

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

At the end of the day, IB gives you no advantages over A levels, not in this present day, so if you believe it's the case that you have to do so much more to ultimately achieve the same thing, then you're stupid for taking IB.

Now, now, touchy much? :p:

So if sweeping the streets would get you into university, would you do that rather than A levels? After all, you'd be 'stupid' 'to do so much more to ultimately achieve the same thing'.

I don't know about anyone else, but my mind's been changed :wink:

Reply 119

jay8

PurpleMonkeyDishwasher

No, it most definitely doesn't make you stand out. Maybe it will in the future, who knows, but you'll get no special recognition for doing IB instead of A levels; the majority of students don't get the choice so obviously that wouldn't be justified.

I really do think that an IB student DOES stand out over an application of a similar strength from an A Level applicant. The IB just gives you a little more academic edge because of its breadth, regardless of how justified that is given the number of people who don't have a choice. Obviously I'm not an admissions tutor, but a very high IB score is, rightly or wrongly, more impressive than AAA. Even at Oxbridge, other students (who would probably have achieved similar scores if they'd taken the IB) are impressed by a high IB score. The nature of the qualification is seen as more rigorous.

OP: One of your considerations when choosing should be this, which I don't think has been particularly emphasised on this thread. From a report by ACS International Schools looking at how the IB is viewed in comparison to A Levels: "More admissions personnel cite the IB as a better preparation for university life than A levels, claiming that the IB provides better preparation for university learning, prepares its students better for creative thinking, independent learning and self management than A levels." (http://www.acs-england.co.uk/brochures/pdf/ib_report_2006.pdf) A statistic from the report is that 50% of admissions personnel felt that IB students were advantaged to some extent, and 50% felt that whether a student took IB or A Levels made no difference. But none thought they'd be disadvantaged compared to A Level students. So there does seem to be a slight advantage in taking the IB with respect to university applications.

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