are the "russel group" an accurate representation of the most prestigious unis.

hi

I wanted to know if people think that the russell group is the closest thing we have a definitive list of the most sought after and most prestigious universities in the uk, many will reply and say, who cares, and go to the university you want to, but the fact remains that people will always seek to quantify, rank and catogarise information...

so is the russel group, in your view, still accurate?

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Reply 1

PJ991

Well Durham isn't in it. I'm sure most would consider Durham quite prestigious

Reply 2

wer343lit

The Russell Group are a group of research-intensive universities, isn't it? I suppose most of the Russell Group are prestigious, but there will be prestigious universities who are not members of the Russell Group.

I'd say they are.

yes, give or take a few

Reply 5

Ekpyrotic

Let's not forget the 1994 Group.

Reply 6

priceless_beauty

Jonty99

but i guess that depends on everyones individual view on what is prestigious

some say the university of leicester is prestigious, some say it isnt for example

Reply 7

Dingy

Not really, its too big a group, and misses out some obvious names like Durham and St Andrews. The Sutton Trust 13 is more accurate IMO

Reply 8

Renal

The Russell Group are an accurate representation of prestigious universities. Since 'prestige' is often driven by people with little knowledge of tertiary education and no appreciation for course by course variation and a belief that 'research' is some holy grail, they could easily look at the Russell Group and imagine that these are the 'best' universities in the country.

Reply 9

0404343m

University prestige is a daft concept. Some people equate it with the age of the institution or its alumni, some with how hard it is to gain entry to, some with research excellence and the money it makes because of it. The Russell Group is the big research unis, the 1994 group the smaller ones- thats all it is, a lobby group to look out for the interests of the institutions. I'd say all of the Russell Group are strong in most of the areas they teach, and are thus are regarded as a 'safe bet' to study at- but I'd not go down the route of suggesting we have some 'group' which is inherently more prestigious than another group. There are some institutions which fit into all three of the above categories, yet are in neither group, and there are some courses at some places which are renowned for being amongst the best. Therefore, its really impossible to argue that the Russell Group are the most presitgious per se, as prestige is different things to different people.

Reply 10

.ACS.

Firstly, it's spelled Russell. :wink:

To be honest, I think the best way of looking at it is that the Russell Group (plus some from the 1994 Group such as York, Durham, and St Andrews) represent the most academically challenging and academically 'best' universities in the country.

As for prestige, there are far too many within the group for it to represent the most prestigious. Plus, how would you define prestigious?

Reply 11

SacredNomad

0404343m

- Aberdeen (always wondered why it's not in either of the two groups)

Reply 12

neomilan

they are some of the best universities in the UK, but it misses out some of the smaler less research intensive universities like Durham, exeter etc.

Reply 13

0404343m

SacredNomad

- Aberdeen (always wondered why it's not in either of the two groups)

Bingo. However, should they not feel that the benefits of membership outweigh going it alone (it is only a loose grouping to lobby government for the interests of their members), then I don't see why a university should be less prestigious if it isn't in either group. Strathclyde and Dundee are also large with some very strong departments and a long history which predates their formation as universities, but are in neither group, and probably have no plans to be. No university has applied to join either group and been rejected as far as I'm aware (providing they meet the research activity/size criteria, so it can't really be said that any university is prestigious because its in one group or another. Optometry at Glasgow Caledonian needs grades comparable to medicine, and is probably equally as selective- is that something to be sneered at because the student goes to an ex-poly?? As I said, take this prestige argument with a pinch of salt, there are plenty of very bright and talented students who haven't went down this route, I don't see why we all should.

Reply 14

Picnic1

I went to Leicester. It doesn’t rank in the top 10 for many individual subjects except for Mathematics, and English/ American Studies sometimes but has sometimes squeezed in to the top 10 overall as a university (it’s a similar story with York, another university I went to). Leicester’s student satisfaction has tended to be very high and it is willing to spend money. York is also expanding its campus and its range of courses.

I think that Durham should be included in a list of most prestigious universities because it tends to have consistently high entry requirements in the main subjects (with some exceptions), it is often said to be the default choice of those not accepted by Oxbridge (or chosen instead of Oxbridge by some, not least due to the vintage of some of its accommodation such as University College (The Castle), it has a true collegiate system and its integration into the city of Durham, can make it a compelling location in which to study. But maybe some other omissions are just as good or better for research itself.

St Andrews has a good reputation and long history but its quiet, small scale, location, which can be very attractive to some, can be a put off to others. That doesn’t necessarily make it more or less prestigious though- just maybe a bit less accessible.

Reply 15

steadyg

Most of them have their pros and cons but there are many employers in the city who will only consider those who graduate from a Russell Group University.

Reply 16

priceless_beauty

steadyg

Most of them have their pros and cons but there are many employers in the city who will only consider those who graduate from a Russell Group University.

Is there any evidence to support this?

Reply 17

steadyg

priceless_beauty

Is there any evidence to support this?

Well, aside from the continious oversubscription of many of the unis in the group, I cant point to anything in particular...I'm generalising on behalf of many. You can research though lol.

Reply 18

bigfatflanker

priceless_beauty

Is there any evidence to support this?

His statement is misleading and only half true. Employers will not negativly discriminate between job applicants on the basic of their alma mata.

The situation where it is true, is when it comes to straight graduate employment into highly competative firms. As there is little to distinguish graduates (when they've come straight out of university) employers will be more inclined to interview applicants which have firsts from Oxbridge + LSE/Imperial/UCL/other Russel Group etc than ones from Royal Holloway. What many people don't realise on here however, is the extensive amount of phycometric testing firms get their applicants to take. Their company performance strategists will have worked out what the companies highest performing workers score on the test, and how the worst do as well. These tests are how they find whether they are hiring the right person for the job.Your alma mata is just an indicator of how academic you are.

So, more russell group candidates may get to the interview stages, but people who have firsts from Oxbridge can easily be regected for not being 'company stuff', while a Royal Holloway graduate will get the job for being 'their sort'.

Reply 19

NDGAARONDI

Picnic1

it has a true collegiate system

No it doesn't. Colleges are just residences with pastoral and social support. No teaching happens within college, unlike undergraduate studies at Oxford and Cambridge. Applicants for Durham will have their decisions made by the department, not the college. Colleges, however, have a quota system so applying late to an oversubscribed college, like Castle or Hatfield, will not do you any favours.