Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by sypher1985)
    My AFCO is Luton. Cheers for the grats .

    Where abouts in Poland you planning on going? Also, where did you study for Erasmus? I frequent Poland often because that is where my girlfriend is from.

    Dzien Dobra :P
    Sorry about the delay in replying!

    Czesc! I was planning on going to Kedzierzyn-Kolze in the South but have since found out that they can't honour the time I would require off work for OASC and so I'm no longer going!

    I studied in Lublin for Erasmus, where abouts is your girlfriend from?

    (Original post by Vizzini)
    Jamie,

    Hope that goes well for you today. If you don't mind sharing the result on here, I think it could be as helpful as Sypher's post for anyone else reading the thread.

    Best of luck!

    Vizzini
    Thanks, I called the AFCO and the Flt. Lt. was more than happy for me to teach in Poland providing I could get a CRB check after. Unfortunately, however, I have since had to decline the job offer as they couldn't honour the time I needed off work to attend OASC! Easy choice there

    I wondered if you could help me. I'd like to attend an 'RJP' but have been getting mixed messages from AFCO and people on here. The impression I get from my AFCO is that I have to sort out the RJP myself whereas it seems people on here have been sorting it through their AFCO. Can you shed any light on this for me?

    Thanks.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Vizzini)
    Hi Sypher,

    Just so I'm clear: You're happy with the whole RJP process now? Have you spoken to your AFCO to get you on one yet?
    I'm back from my AFCO. I asked them about going to Boulmer they said they will sort it out for me. But they think it might be in May or even June. More than likely after my OASC. But I still put my name down for it. As for the process, I have no idea, I just went to the AFCO and they said leave it with them.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by TownFanJamie)
    I wondered if you could help me. I'd like to attend an 'RJP' but have been getting mixed messages from AFCO and people on here. The impression I get from my AFCO is that I have to sort out the RJP myself whereas it seems people on here have been sorting it through their AFCO. Can you shed any light on this for me?

    Thanks.
    Hi Jamie,

    Thought I'd mentioned this previously - your AFCO should be speaking to the Institute of Recruitment (IoR) at RAF Cranwell to load you onto an RJP. We run the visit up at Boulmer, but we're not responsible for who gets to come on them. That's down to the IoR. Speak to your AFCO, stress you want to do an RJP and tell them to speak to the IoR to book you on.

    (Original post by sypher1985)
    I'm back from my AFCO. I asked them about going to Boulmer they said they will sort it out for me. But they think it might be in May or even June. More than likely after my OASC. But I still put my name down for it.
    Good stuff! As I've mentioned before, I didn't actually get an RJP until after my OASC, but it was still highly useful. There's enough info on here to get you through OASC, but it still helps to see it all put into action!

    I'm not at work until Monday now, so I can't check the dates for the next RJP until then. I'll see what I can find out next week and I'll let you both know.

    Vizzini
    • CV Helper
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Vizzini)
    Institute of Recruitment (IoR)
    *cough*

    Inspectorate of Recruiting (IofR)

    /pedant
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ProStacker)
    *cough*

    Inspectorate of Recruiting (IofR)

    /pedant
    PS,

    Standing corrected !

    Vizzini
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Hey All,

    Vizzini, fantastic work on the thread i'v found it very helpfull and taken a good 2 hours to read haha. I recently passed my filter interview for ABM and have a medical next week. I believe the RJP for Boulmer i'm going on is the 30th March. However i'm soon to receive the paperwork, i will get back to you all on this.

    Just thought I'd pop in and say hi, and well done/keep it up on the updates as im craving OASC right now lol can't wait!!

    Mav
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Maverick13291)
    Hey All,

    Vizzini, fantastic work on the thread i'v found it very helpfull and taken a good 2 hours to read haha. I recently passed my filter interview for ABM and have a medical next week. I believe the RJP for Boulmer i'm going on is the 30th March. However i'm soon to receive the paperwork, i will get back to you all on this.

    Just thought I'd pop in and say hi, and well done/keep it up on the updates as im craving OASC right now lol can't wait!!

    Mav
    Hi Mav,

    Thank you for your comments and congrats on passing the filter! Hope to see you up here on the RJP and good luck for OASC when it comes around. Please do keep us updated on your porgress.

    BTW, do you feel the need?

    Vizzini
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Hi folks - I'm just getting my noggin around all the various ABM threads. Shame there's not one massive one with everything in, but this was filters it for specifics - which also works.

    Right, I've just made it through OASC without getting my BFH (my boo f hoo, I've been chopped). I originally applied for another branch but that one was closed and I was kindly informed of that 3 days before OASC.
    My interview went a bit pants in terms of remembering the ins and outs of IOT (I knew a fair bit) and my current affairs stories were given the (apart from that story... apart from that story...) treatment - probably to make me squeal. Everything else I did seemed strong - I was quite a bit above the lowest ABM aptitude scores and it would seem I'd also be qualified to sell ice creams at Cranwell open days.

    The way I see it having read Vizzi's info -
    I would start and complete IOT without much specialism at all.
    I would go to Boulmer to train at the School of ABM. (Each year if I ran out of cash and needed to vote on a union boss I could go from the SABM to the ATM at the AGM).
    Erm,
    I could be at Fylingdales within a few months on a BMEWS 6 week course?
    I would then need a 3 month course at the SABM?

    During ?certain course? I would have my aptitude tested for streaming into Weapons or Surveillance (IDO)?

    I'm kind of getting the picture but may well be a bit confused.

    Any clarity on a chronological (including a split for Weaps and IDO) map would be the poodle's noodles.

    Assuming IOT finishes on Dec 31st 1999 and has NO ABM training in it at all -

    Jan 1st 2000 - sent from Cranwell to Boulmer ??? .. etc

    thanks a lot folks - any clarity greatly appreciated.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I'm sorry I'm not exactly sure what your questions are. In fact I read your post feeling very confused? Are you asking for information regarding ABM training after IOT? In which case I would of thought you would of been given a couple of pages from your AFCO explaining the role of an ABM and how the career progression looks.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    Two bits stood out for me...

    (Original post by MrMasham)
    I would start and complete IOT without much specialism at all.
    Assuming IOT finishes and has NO ABM training in it

    Seems you're maybe slightly confused on what IOT is? It's Initial Officer Training. Every potential officer in one place. Why would there be any branch training there at all?

    Trick question: there isn't. You're all just Officer Cadets, learning how to be in the military, in the Air Force and be Junior Officers. All branch related stuff comes at phase 2.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MrMasham)
    My interview went a bit pants in terms of remembering the ins and outs of IOT

    I would start and complete IOT without much specialism at all.
    I would go to Boulmer to train at the School of ABM.
    I could be at Fylingdales within a few months on a BMEWS 6 week course?
    I would then need a 3 month course at the SABM?
    During ?certain course? I would have my aptitude tested for streaming into Weapons or Surveillance (IDO)?
    MrM,

    tl:dr, you're looking at:

    IOT (6 months) - 2 weeks leave - ABMSC (6-weeks) - 1-2 weeks leave - WCC (longest course (25-weeks)) - 2 weeks leave - start work.

    In more detail:

    As Drewski says: IOT= Intial Officer Training - or Phase One training in the modern vernacular - which means training in how to be an RAF Officer-generalist (no specialization training). Approx 6 months (?) leading to award of Commission.

    Then you come to the SABM, RAF Boulmer, for the 6-week long Aerospace Battle Manager Streaming Course (ABMSC), at the end of which you are streamed Weapons, Surveillance or Space.

    Enter Phase 2 (or professional training). Weapons Control Course (WCC) is 25-weeks long, approximately; Surveillance (Identification Officers' Course (IDC) is approx 20-weeks long, or Space course - 6-weeks long. WCC and IDC at SABM, RAF Boulmer, Space course at RAF Fylingdales. On completion of Phase 2 training, receive award of Certificate of Qulification (CQ) and confirmation of Commission.

    This is very important - you are not an Officer until your Commission is confirmed. Fail Phase 2, no Commission. As I've said before, this does not necessarily mean that if you fail at either ABMSC or during your ABM course, you are out of the RAF. Ideally, you get re-selected to another, non-aptitude based Specialization (it's all about aptitude). As recent posts on another thread indicate, however, it's tough out there at the moment and you may only be picked up if there's a suitable slot...

    Then enter Phase 3 (Combat Ready (CR) theory) approx 3-months after award of CQ and Phase 4 (Combat Ready practical) on completion of Phase 3.

    Hope that helps!

    Vizzini
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Hello Vizzini, I hope you can help with my query, you seem to be the person in the know !

    My husband has an RJP soon and is hoping to be an ABM, fingers crossed, the wheels are in motion so to speak, we know it's a long road ahead, but I am a planner and like to be in the know !

    He will be leaving a secure well paid job and we realise that the pay cut will be difficult - together with the living apart.

    Could you tell me how long the £15k pay is for and what are the pass rates, is it 12 weeks of training and then you are told if you have passed/failed?

    As finance is a large issue for many families, we would like to plan and see where we can make savings and also save money for the future to cover the drop in wages.

    In addition myself and our children plan to stay at home for the time being, until we know what the future holds, and for some of the training this should be manageable - we are based 45 miles from Boulmer. Although realise that long spells away from home and in different counties/countries is the norm !

    We have been together for 12 years and are very secure and strong in our relationship, I admit the prospect is very scary but seeing him so determined and enthusiastic is lovely to see (after many years in a job which holds no passion for him).


    So I want to offer support and try to help him see that we can manage and find out info about finances/training etc so that we can know what's involved.

    Thank you so much, and I have really enjoyed reading this thread !!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Perhaps this link will be of use to you?

    Basically it looks like the 15k pay rate applies whilst at Cranwell as an officer cadet. As and acting Plt Off on phase 2 training, your husband's salary would be around 24k.

    Hope that helps.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Wallazabal)
    Basically it looks like the 15k pay rate applies whilst at Cranwell as an officer cadet. As and acting Plt Off on phase 2 training, your husband's salary would be around 24k.
    Wallazabal,

    Thank you for posting that info.

    (Original post by charley24)
    My husband has an RJP soon and is hoping to be an ABM, fingers crossed, the wheels are in motion so to speak, we know it's a long road ahead, but I am a planner and like to be in the know !
    Charley,

    Just to further clarify the info Wallazabal has usefully linked - if your husband holds a degree, he would graduate IOT as a Flying Officer and receive a salary at Level 6, approx £29k, which will increase by one level each year. If he does not hold a degree, he would graduate as a Pilot Officer as Wallazabal says and progress annually from there. Again, as Wallazabal says, during the 6 months or so he would be at RAFC Cranwell, he would receive approx £15k pro-rata.

    All of this is academic at this stage. I appreciate you want to get more detail, and you're quite right to arm yourself with the facts - common sense after all! There's a couple of things I'd also like to stress, based on personal experience. I'm sure you're probably already considering them, but they're points for others reading this, too.

    The application process itself can take upwards of 18 months; some people on here are experiencing longer timescales. There is no guarantee of acceptance until long after OASC. Your husband should certainly not be talking to his employers about moving on until he has the letter from OASC saying he's been accepted. Ideally, even then he should be cautious and should not make any undertakings until he's been given a firm date for starting IOT.

    Actually, based on my own experience, there are no guarantees if OASC subsequently uncover something, but there's no legislating for that! I received a phone call on the Friday prior to starting IOT on the Sunday telling me not to report for duty... I'm sure this is rather exceptional behaviour on their part, but I then had to wait another 8 months before I was allowed to start IOT. It was a medical deferral, so I may be somewhat unique (I'm very special ) - my point is, and it should be something OASC tell your husband if he's successful (they certainly told me): he shouldn't give notice until the latest reasonable point prior to starting IOT. Most employers require 30 days, so I was caught coming and going, but my case is illustrative. I was fortunate - my employer essentially tore up my resignation and I continued working there. As usual, what I'm banging on about is risk - there is always a risk, but since you're a planner, if you know the worst case, you can take measures in mitigation - so there you go, my worst-case example!

    The risk doesn't end there, though; in chronological order, potential points of failure are (assuming he's passed the AFCO interview?):

    - OASC
    - IOT (people do fail, or withdraw, or undergo medical discharge...)
    - ABMSC (potentially 6-weeks after IOT...)
    - During professional training - earliest fail point is 10-weeks into the IDC - the shorter of the 2 main courses - but any point thereafter it could happen.

    Now let's look at actual failure rates:

    OASC - a recent correspondent told me 66% of his intake failed; rates seems to be running around the 50 - 60% mark judging by other posters on here, but these are just hearsay not official figures.

    IOT - here I don't actually know, but I'd say it was pretty low - there's a greater risk of re-course and subsequent Commissioning than failing, I suspect!

    ABMSC-onward - Our current (today) overall failure rate stands at 15%; or, rather, on selection to ABM at OASC, your husband has an 85% likelihood of completing his professional training.

    So, given the figures, and PS may have a clearer perspective, I'd say the biggest risk is at OASC, which bears up my earlier comments.

    (Original post by charley24)
    In addition myself and our children plan to stay at home for the time being, until we know what the future holds, and for some of the training this should be manageable - we are based 45 miles from Boulmer. Although realise that long spells away from home and in different counties/countries is the norm !
    You're in quite a fortunate position in many ways - I've been at Boulmer for nigh on 7 years now. There is a strong likelihood that your husband would end up working here as well - quite often a family situation such as your can be taken into account for posting on completion of ABM training, but Service need always comes first (as you recognise :yep:).

    From what you've written, your husband has the desire to succeed at this and that is one of the key factors, so I wish him the best of luck for OASC! I'll be at the Meet and Greet for the RJP and if he wants to speak to me in person he's very welcome. Just tell him to ask for 'Vizzini'. Same applies to anyone else coming up here who's reading this!

    Vizzini
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I'm still trying to figure out your true identity Vizzini. There aren't THAT many commissioned IDO in the SABM...
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Thank you so Much Vizzini and Wallazabal....I feel like I should be Charleze and get myself a Z !!!

    Hubby has just read thru and said thanks so much really useful and he hopes to meet you next week.

    I appreciate your honesty about pass rates etc, as it is good to know what he is up against and can make himself push harder to achieve.

    In addition if the process can take some time, this is extra time for money to be saved, preparations to be made, if and when he joins.

    Also the fact that it is possible to be posted at Boulmer for sometime is also a plus, obviously where he goes, he goes, but we will see !

    Thanks so Much, food for thought and great advice as always !
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Wallazabal)
    I'm still trying to figure out your true identity Vizzini. There aren't THAT many commissioned IDO in the SABM...


    (Original post by charley24)
    I appreciate your honesty about pass rates etc, as it is good to know what he is up against and can make himself push harder to achieve.

    In addition if the process can take some time, this is extra time for money to be saved, preparations to be made, if and when he joins.

    Also the fact that it is possible to be posted at Boulmer for sometime is also a plus, obviously where he goes, he goes, but we will see !
    Charley,

    You and your husband are very welcome, always glad to help!

    I always think it's better to be upfront about these things so people have a better picture of what they're getting into - forewarned is forearmed and all that! As with all things there are no guarantees, so fingers crossed. I'll look forward to meeting him next week!

    Vizzini
    • CV Helper
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    As pay's been mentioned a couple of times, I thought I'd throw out this very useful post from another forum user (whose username I can't currently remember, otherwise I'd credit it properly; sorry mate, I can't spell it!) that explains your progression through the ranks and pay scales.

    In conjunction with the pay scales posted earlier, you can get a rough idea.

    (Original post by G...)
    OK *Cracks Knuckles*

    Direct Entry (Non Graduate) - Aircrew
    Officer Cadet for the duration of IOT
    A/Pilot Officer on graduation
    1 year to Pilot Officer
    1 year to Flying Officer level 6
    3.5 years to Flt Lt (Total IOT duration + 5.5 years to Flt Lt from Day1)

    Direct Entry (Non Graduate) - Ground Branches
    Officer Cadet for the duration of IOT
    A/Plt Off on graduation
    6 Months to Plt Off
    2 years to Fg Off level 6
    4 years to Flt Lt (Total IOT duration + 6.5 years to Flt Lt from Day 1)

    Graduate Entry 3 Year Degree - Aircrew
    Plt Off on day 1 of IOT
    6 months to Fg Off level 7 +6months
    2 Years to Flt Lt (Total 2.5 years to Flt Lt from Day 1)

    Graduate Entry 4 Year Degree - Aircrew
    Plt Off on day 1 of IOT
    6 months to Fg Off level 8 +6months
    1 Year to Flt Lt (Total 18 months to Flt Lt from Day 1)

    Graduate Entry 3 Year Degree - Ground Branches
    Plt Off on day 1 of IOT
    6 months to Fg Off level 7
    3 Years to Flt Lt (Total 3.5 years to Flt Lt from Day 1)

    Graduate Entry 4 Year Degree - Ground Branches
    Plt Off on day 1 of IOT
    6 months to Fg Off level 8
    2 Years to Flt Lt (Total 2.5 years to Flt Lt from Day 1)

    Levels and pay found here.

    Corrections Welcome!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Are the 3/4 year degree sections equivalent to Bachelor's/Bachelor's with Honours respectively, or is the 4 year degree a Master's? Also do you have to have the degree finalised and have graduated when you start at IOT, or does it still count if it comes in a month or two later?

    Thanks!
    • CV Helper
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    The 4 year degree's a masters (a Scottish degree with honours, for example, doesn't count), and you won't get paid appropriately until your degree's confirmed.
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Are unpaid trial work shifts fair?
    Useful resources

    Articles:

    Guide to the armed forcesGuide to the Royal Air ForceA job in the Army

    Featured recruiter profiles:

    Army logo

    The Army is recruiting now

    "With hundreds of roles available, there’s more than one way to be the best."

    Quick Link:

    Unanswered Armed Forces Threads

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.