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Muslims, am I allowed to go to my white friends funeral? watch

    • #4
    #4

    Sneak off there? Some muslim girls get stabbed by there dads for diobeying
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Erm, yes it does.

    Quran (5:51) - O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust. (Yusuf Ali's translation)
    - http://al-quran.info/#&&sura=5&aya=5...=rows&ver=1.00

    Get your facts straight. I wonder how many "Muslims" here have actually read the Quran in English. I challenge you to keep your faith after doing so. I couldn't.
    That is DISGUSTING.
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    (Original post by hairychimpanzee)
    this is all complete lies, why are any of you fools even responding?
    I did countenance that thought. Maybe I'm just a cynic, but the OP's 'dad' is a stereotypical muslim father who hates whites, non-muslims, oppresses his daughter etc.

    rofl
    • #3
    #3

    Anon or delete, please.

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    Your idea of what is "evil" and what isn't is certainly not objective.
    I never said it was. I think most sane people, however, can agree that corporal and capital punishment are evil without having to be objective about it. If you're a Muslim, however, then you must believe that the teachings in the Quran are those of a perfect god, and are therefore the perfect objective moral code to live by. That would be absurd, as you'd have to accept corporal and capital punishment, which I believe are evil - do you? If not, than I have to ask, why the hell are you not living in an Islamic state? I noticed you offered no direct rebuttal to the verses which permit wife-beating, public flogging, and hand amputation as punishments. Do you agree that these are just punishments? If you're the kind of person that does, you scare me.

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    But slavery itself - well it's just another type of employment, where you get paid in food, clothes, shelter etc. rather than in money.
    Wow...

    After saying something so incredibly asinine, I think it's safe to say you've destroyed whatever credibility you had remaining. You're just an inherently rotten person. Seriously, that sounded like something out of Mein Kampf. I just can't respect someone with such disregard for liberty and freedom.
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    (Original post by pstars)
    This kind of stuff is what drives me crazy about Islam - that 'rules' like this, that have no basis in the Qur'an, the life of the Prophet, and even go AGAINST Islamic principles, are believed and practiced. No doubt this was some dodgy hadith or just some weird almost-rumour that turned into an actual practice. Why on earth would there be a rule that you have to walk past graveyards and say something ridiculous like that, when the Qur'an instructs you to, in regards to other LIVING people of other religions:

    "Say: O unbelievers!

    I do not serve that which you serve,
    Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve, 

    Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,

    Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:

    You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion."
    (from the Qur'an, surah Al Khafiroon, literally 'The Unbelievers').

    And the Prophet himself dealt and worked happily with people of other faiths - his daughter even married a person of no faith, and he at one point married a Coptic Christian! It drives me crazy that Muslims will believe anything like this and not realise how completely illogical it is, or question it. Who came up with this dumb rule?

    There is NOTHING in Islam to stop you from going to the funeral of your friend!! I encourage you to do so. As the Prophet said - even thinking a kind thought is an act of charity. Your love for your friend, and your kindness in wanting to honour him, is no doubt more important in the eyes of Allah than anything else.
    I was merely saying that there are hadith, which have been judged to be Sahih, or authentic, by scholars, which provide evidence supporting the claim that it is not allowed for a muslim to attend the funeral of a non-muslim.
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    Go. You'll regret it later if you don't.
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    Why is this in H&R? It just allows people to post crap anonymously. This should be in Theology or Ask a Muslim or something.
    • #5
    #5

    go to the funeral, nothing forbids u. This is the twenty first century, and why race should matter along with religion i do not know. Personally, i think u should go. I am a muslim, and i dont see how going to ur friends funeral is gonna send u to hell. Personally i am offended u father is telling u not to go, i have had people in my family die of illness and to be ******* dismissed as a simple white man, or any other man for that matter is ******* disgusting. Although what is happening in palestine is important, f why the **** is ur dad in this country and not helping them. Tell that ******** to leave u the **** alone and ull be a happier person.
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    Muslim guy here ... I think you should go to the funeral. I find it disgusting on your fathers behalf that he is stopping you from attending your friends funeral.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    My best friend died of cancer recently (at only the age of 15) and his funeral is going to be next week. I was so shocked when I heard the news, he meant so much to me and I haven't stopped crying since.

    But my dad always shouts at me when he sees me crying in my bed (when I think I'm alone and just let everything out). Apparently 'he's just a white man, what does he mean to you?' I'm not allowed to argue back, to argue that regardless of colour, race, religion, whatever I am totally hurt and genuinely really really saddened by his death, it hurts so much because I'm meant to be 'daddy's good little girl who cooks and cleans and stays at home'. URGH, it makes me so angry ...

    'Your brothers in Palestine are being murdered every day and do you cry then?'

    That's all he ever drills in me, but what the hell do random men in Palestine have to do with me?!?

    And now he's not letting me go to his funeral because of our cultural/religious differences apparently and the fact that he's male

    But Muslims, is he actually allowed to do this?? Is there anything in the Quran that says we can't go to others' funerals??

    It's not Islam that prohibiting you from attending this funeral, it's your dad. He definitely has views that clash with Islam.
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    Its a hard choice but i think you should go anyway and face the reprecussions...you'll seriously regret it if you don't..regardless of race or religion, its your moral obligation to pay your final respects...
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    i'm not muslim but i'm pretty sure that no religion would prevent you from going...just go anyway...you're gonna regret it otherwise...normally i'd say to listen to ur parents but in this case i don't think thats an option at all...with the greatest respect to ur father he's being insensitive and plain ridiculous...
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    I never said it was. I think most sane people, however, can agree that corporal and capital punishment are evil without having to be objective about it.
    Just because "most people" think something, that doesn't make it correct.

    And in any case, "most people" follow a religion whose scripture does include corporal and capital punishment.

    You personally may not agree with these things. But that doesn't make it wrong. It just means you hold a different opinion.



    Wow...

    After saying something so incredibly asinine, I think it's safe to say you've destroyed whatever credibility you had remaining. You're just an inherently rotten person. Seriously, that sounded like something out of Mein Kampf. I just can't respect someone with such disregard for liberty and freedom.
    What's liberty and freedom got to do with it?

    I have a cleaner in my house, and we give her money for it. Is that wrong?

    If instead of giving her money, we gave her other things like food, shelter, and basically made her part of the family, would that be wrong?


    If so, what is wrong with it? As I said, you seem to be making the error of association - that slavery is associated with lack of freedom and liberty (for example, in the Roman Empire 2000 years ago), and have assumed that all slavery must necessarily involve unhappiness on the slave's part.
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    Your dad is a prick and a racist.
    • #3
    #3

    Anon or delete, please.

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    Just because "most people" think something, that doesn't make it correct.

    And in any case, "most people" follow a religion whose scripture does include corporal and capital punishment.

    You personally may not agree with these things. But that doesn't make it wrong. It just means you hold a different opinion.
    Violence for any reason other than self-defence is wrong. Anyone who doesn't think so can stay the hell away from me. What right does anyone have to execute, whip, beat, or amputate the limbs of someone based on instructions from a god for whom there is no evidence of existence?

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    If so, what is wrong with it? As I said, you seem to be making the error of association - that slavery is associated with lack of freedom and liberty (for example, in the Roman Empire 2000 years ago), and have assumed that all slavery must necessarily involve unhappiness on the slave's part.
    You're referring to servants, not slaves. The difference is that slavery is forced labour. What you're trying to do is muddle the definition of slavery in order to make it acceptable, but it isn't working. There's a huge difference between servants, who choose to work, and slaves, who are forced, and considered as property. That's what the Quran permits, and that's what I consider evil. Would you enjoy being a slave? Somehow, I doubt it.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Violence for any reason other than self-defence is wrong. Anyone who doesn't think so can stay the hell away from me. What right does anyone have to execute, whip, beat, or amputate the limbs of someone based on instructions from a god for whom there is no evidence of existence?
    For punishment and deterrence of crime, of course.

    In Saudi Arabia, the punishment for theft is to have your hands cut off. But if you go there, I doubt you'll see a single person with no hands, even if you were looking for them.
    There's a reason why it has one of the lowest theft rates in the world.

    You might think there are better ways of dealing with crimes - but that'sno reason to say that everyone else is wrong.
    This is just your opinion, and nothing else.

    You're referring to servants, not slaves. The difference is that slavery is forced labour. What you're trying to do is muddle the definition of slavery in order to make it acceptable, but it isn't working. There's a huge difference between servants, who choose to work, and slaves, who are forced, and considered as property. That's what the Quran permits, and that's what I consider evil. Would you enjoy being a slave? Somehow, I doubt it.
    The definition of "slave" in English is not the same as the definition of "Abd" in Arabic, mentioned in the Qur'an which does not include the connotation of forced work, or cruelty, or anything else like that.

    For example, the name "Abd-u-llah" literally means "slave of Allah". But as the Qur'an says, people can't be forced to serve Allah.

    The word "Abd" simply refers to someone who works in order to serve someone else.
    They aren't necessarily forced, treated badly, or unpaid/unrewarded.



    In fact, the Qur'an even says this:

    And let those who cannot find a match keep chaste till Allah give them independence by His grace. And such of your slaves as seek a writing (of emancipation), write it for them if ye are aware of aught of good in them, and bestow upon them of the wealth of Allah which He hath bestowed upon you. Force not your slave-girls to whoredom that ye may seek enjoyment of the life of the world, if they would preserve their chastity. And if one force them, then (unto them), after their compulsion, lo! Allah will be Forgiving, Merciful. - 24:33

    i.e. If a slave wants their "freedom", it is to be provided to them in writing, along with some money.
    • #3
    #3

    Anon or delete, please.

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    The definition of "slave" in English is not the same as the definition of "Abd" in Arabic, mentioned in the Qur'an which does not include the connotation of forced work, or cruelty, or anything else like that.

    For example, the name "Abd-u-llah" literally means "slave of Allah". But as the Qur'an says, people can't be forced to serve Allah.

    The word "Abd" simply refers to someone who works in order to serve someone else.
    They aren't necessarily forced, treated badly, or unpaid/unrewarded.
    Now you're just being flat out dishonest. That's a load of crap and you know it. If that were really the case, the translations I read would say "servant" instead of "slave". Do you really expect me to believe that slaves can refuse to work or are allowed to just get up and leave whenever they please? Of course not, because they're considered property.

    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    For punishment and deterrence of crime, of course.
    There we have it folks. An admission from a Muslim that in order to punish/deter crime, the authorities can beat, execute, publicly flog, or amputate the limbs of criminals based on the commands of an imaginary magic man in the sky, even though there's not a shred of evidence to suggest he actually exists.

    I don't think I need to argue any further at this point. You know, I really don't think you deserve to live in this country, but I acknowledge your right to do so nonetheless. It's just massively hypocritical for people who hold your beliefs to be living anywhere other than in an Islamic state. You'll probably disagree, but then you would, wouldn't you? Reaping the benefits of secular society while trashing all the ideals it stands for - now that's having your cake and eating it.

    I'm done. Thanks for playing.
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    Your dads a racist c**t at the end of the day
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Now you're just being flat out dishonest. That's a load of crap and you know it. If that were really the case, the translations I read would say "servant" instead of "slave". Do you really expect me to believe that slaves can refuse to work or are allowed to just get up and leave whenever they please? Of course not, because they're considered property.
    The Qur'an itself says that they can - I quoted 24:33 to you.

    And no, the translations do not use the word "servant", because that would imply that they are necessarily given money for their services.

    (But in any case, the words that the translations use are quite irrelevant. The Qur'an is an Arabic book, not an English book - so we use the definitions of the Arabic words, rather than the closest match in English).

    there's not a shred of evidence to suggest he actually exists.
    That's a rather bold claim. Just because you personally haven't seen or recognised evidence doesn't mean that there isn't any.

    I don't think I need to argue any further at this point. You know, I really don't think you deserve to live in this country, but I acknowledge your right to do so nonetheless. It's just massively hypocritical for people who hold your beliefs to be living anywhere other than in an Islamic state. You'll probably disagree, but then you would, wouldn't you? Reaping the benefits of secular society while trashing all the ideals it stands for - now that's having your cake and eating it.
    I don't live here to reap the benefits of secular society. I live here because the universities are good
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    i dnt think u would be doing anything wrong
 
 
 
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