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    (Original post by Oswy)
    White nationalism is racism (white nationalism means wanting to create a white nation or something as close as possible). It is also a strong parallel to the Nazi aim of creating an 'aryan nation'. If you admit the BNP are white nationalists, which you seem to and which they are, then you're admitting they're racists.
    I was referring to some members of the American friends of the BNP, not the BNP itself. Most nationalism in America tends to manifest itself as white nationalism.
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    (Original post by learner_dancer)
    OP, here are my reasons as to why I think you're a ****:
    because you just are.



    See what I've done there?
    I lol'd
    Nicely done!
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    Andrew Brons was sucked into totalitarianism at a young age, but to suggest he still holds those views now is nothing short of ridiculous. There are former communist members in the labour party, yet nobody would even suggest that they still hold those views today.

    Perhaps they do have white nationalist voters, but that doesn't make the party itself white nationalist. If you want a mainstream party and hold those kind of views, BNP are the obvious choice if you want your vote to actually make any difference.

    To be honest, I don't think anything he discussed in that video was especially inflammatory or racist. He discussed how he was going to present his ideas to the public- something all political parties do, and only when you take into account the interpretation of the reporter does the speech resemble anything negative.
    I'm obviously talking to a brick wall. Andrew Brons used to lead the National Front, make of that what you will - clearly, you make nothing of it. Repeating someone isn't an interpretation - Griffin says he wants to present the party, he wants to sell it, so he won't say what he really means (racial purity for example) and will mask the white nationalism integral to the party. But, you're clearly very set in your views, so I give up.
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    (Original post by GinAndJuice)
    I am totally impressed by the BNP and their policies. Whilst some will argue that they are nothing but an outdated party who had their chance and blew it, I disagree. I think their polices have always made sense. I shall even go as far voting for them some time in the not to distant future. Their humanitarian, integral and just system should be an inspiration to us all.
    I think a lot of the BNP's policies are great however I'am not a big fan of socialism.
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    I was referring to some members of the American friends of the BNP, not the BNP itself. Most nationalism in America tends to manifest itself as white nationalism.
    On what evidence do you suggest "Most nationalism in America tends to manifest itself as white nationalism."? You're bending so far backwards to deny the white-nationalism, racism and neo-Nazism of the BNP you must have to stick your toothrush into your zipper to brush your teeth.
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    Whilst they may be white nationalists,he is actually adressing "American friends of the BNP", so when he says "our ideas, which are the same as yours" this doesn't mean he shares the same beliefs of the ku klux klan or whatever else it is blown up to be in that report. If he is adressing American friends of the BNP, it is fairly obvious they will share the same ideas.
    I'm sorry, but David Duke still to this day doesn't apologise for being in the KKK. In my eyes, to be perfectly fine with the idea of Nick Griffin in the same room with these degenerates is in itself immoral. Don't be so simplistic and blame the anti-BNP liberal media for this, the introduction and ending is irrelevant, and wouldn't have made a difference, or are you actually suggesting that without the reporter I, and others, would think differently? This first bit doesn't actually make much sense to be honest. Maybe that's just me.

    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    By reform ,I mean expelling extremist elements within the party with racist/nazi links and replacing them with nationalists and patriots. This is what has taken place- he is merely describing the change in their idealogy, not a masking or covering up of anything.
    Here you clearly just misunderstood what he was saying. Did you watch the video properly or what? Let me type out the actual quotes:

    "There's a difference between saying out your ideas, and saying, your ideas."

    "We are determined now, to sell about these basically, to use the 'sellable words' as I say: security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them, nobody can come at you and attack you on those ideas. They are sellable."

    "If you open out with your soul aim to start with, you're going to get absolutely nowhere."

    Orly?

    I'm not going to debate, and that's why I don't even bother replying half the time because you simply don't understand. I know I say it a lot, but only an immoral person would defend this, and you can't get through to people like that.
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    (Original post by GinAndJuice)
    I am totally impressed by the BNP and their policies. Whilst some will argue that they are nothing but an outdated party who had their chance and blew it, I disagree. I think their polices have always made sense. I shall even go as far voting for them some time in the not to distant future. Their humanitarian, integral and just system should be an inspiration to us all.

    Lol, so the "sinking boats full of immigrants" policy is "humanitarian" :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by JW92)
    I'm obviously talking to a brick wall. Andrew Brons used to lead the National Front, make of that what you will - clearly, you make nothing of it. Repeating someone isn't an interpretation - Griffin says he wants to present the party, he wants to sell it, so he won't say what he really means (racial purity for example) and will mask the white nationalism integral to the party. But, you're clearly very set in your views, so I give up.
    He never said that he won't say what he really means. He is talking about how to best word his ideas in order to gain public support, which is something that all politicians do.

    Discussing racial purity is little evidence of white nationalism,to be honest. He could talk about the natives of Britain losing their "identity" or their "racial purity" and it would invoke very similar ideas- he isn't talking about lying to the public or hiding any agenda.
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    Reason why nobody should taking this thread seriously:

    1.'My opinions'
    2.'BNP'
    3.'great'
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    He never said that he won't say what he really means. He is talking about how to best word his ideas in order to gain public support, which is something that all politicians do.

    Discussing racial purity is little evidence of white nationalism,to be honest. He could talk about the natives of Britain losing their "identity" or their "racial purity" and it would invoke very similar ideas- he isn't talking about lying to the public or hiding any agenda.
    Refer to Failed123's post. Particularly the last quote. Your interpretation of Griffin is, at best, selective.
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    (Original post by Failed123)
    I'm sorry, but David Duke still to this day doesn't apologise for being in the KKK. In my eyes, to be perfectly fine with the idea of Nick Griffin in the same room with these degenerates is in itself immoral. Don't be so simplistic and blame the anti-BNP liberal media for this, the introduction and ending is irrelevant, and wouldn't have made a difference, or are you actually suggesting that without the reporter I, and others, would think differently? This first bit doesn't actually make much sense to be honest. Maybe that's just me.


    Here you clearly just misunderstood what he was saying. Did you watch the video properly or what? Let me type out the actual quotes:

    "There's a difference between saying out your ideas, and saying, your ideas."

    "We are determined now, to sell about these basically, to use the 'sellable words' as I say: security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them, nobody can come at you and attack you on those ideas. They are sellable."

    "If you open out with your soul aim to start with, you're going to get absolutely nowhere."

    Orly?

    I'm not going to debate, and that's why I don't even bother replying half the time because you simply don't understand. I know I say it a lot, but only an immoral person would defend this, and you can't get through to people like that.
    Thanks for backing me up.
    But it's "selling" not "saying".
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    Hang on 'till that racist biatch Neccessarily Bogus or whatever his name in comes in with his warped e-penis.
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    (Original post by Failed123)
    Don't be so simplistic and blame the anti-BNP liberal media for this, the introduction and ending is irrelevant, and wouldn't have made a difference, or are you actually suggesting that without the reporter I, and others, would think differently? This first bit doesn't actually make much sense to be honest. Maybe that's just me.
    I admit, associating yourself with David Duke is not a good idea publicity wise, and,obviously, I don't agree with the KKK. However,having an American friends of the BNP group is very beneficial funding wise, and white nationalists being attracted to such an event is no real suprise ( they are far more prominent in America).

    The reporter obviously makes a difference to those easily swayed, however even more important than that is the attitude you hold prior to watching the video. If you want to see Nick Griffin revealing how he will hide his racism and white nationalism to the public, then that is what you will see. This tiny excerpt without the context of the whole speech is so vague and general that it allows itself open to this interpretation, which is exactly why it was used by the media as an attempt to smear the BNP further.

    (Original post by Failed123)
    "There's a difference between saying out your ideas, and saying, your ideas."
    It was selling and selling out,actually.

    He is correct in saying this, and I can't see how anyone could take issue with this. This offers no proof they are hiding any kind of evil agenda, instead suggesting he wishes to become more electable and change his language accordingly.

    (Original post by Failed123)
    "We are determined now, to sell about these basically, to use the 'sellable words' as I say: security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them, nobody can come at you and attack you on those ideas. They are sellable."
    He is correct again, and every single political party uses those words, and probably holds similar discussions on how to best use them to get across their viewpoint. Again no evidence of any evil agenda being hidden.

    (Original post by Failed123)
    "If you open out with your soul aim to start with, you're going to get absolutely nowhere."
    Discussing change in BNP policy, and how their old image and policies were unproductive and failed.
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    ...

    Discussing racial purity is little evidence of white nationalism,to be honest...
    It's pretty damn good evidence actually, being very much in the same ball-park.
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    "Humanitarian"
    -what a completely absurd interpretation of what that means.
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    (Original post by Hubba Me Up)
    Hang on 'till that racist biatch Neccessarily Bogus or whatever his name in comes in with his warped e-penis.
    Ditto. Necessarily Benevolent will have a field day with this thread.
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    (Original post by 35mm_)
    Ditto. Necessarily Benevolent will have a field day with this thread.
    I think I'll quote him in :p:

    (Original post by Necessarily Benevolent)
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    (Original post by Oswy)
    It's pretty damn good evidence actually, being very much in the same ball-park.
    To the BNP,racial purity only ever meant keeping Britain ethnically British and not mixing with other ethnicities.

    After their reform, as was being explained in the speech, they replace these words which have some negative connotations and instead use words which are more politically mature.
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    (Original post by Voluntas Mos Victum)
    To the BNP,racial purity only ever meant keeping Britain ethnically British and not mixing with other ethnicities.

    After their reform, as was being explained in the speech, they replace these words which have some negative connotations and instead use words which are more politically mature.
    Assuming you agree with the BNP's stance, what's wrong with mixing with other ethnicities other than your own?

    Genuine question.
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    (Original post by 35mm_)
    Assuming you agree with the BNP's stance, what's wrong with mixing with other ethnicities other than your own?

    Genuine question.
    On an individual basis, there is nothing wrong with it. Mixed-race couples,for example,can be just as happy together as couples who are not mixed-race.

    On a larger scale however, it dilutes British identity and also British culture.
 
 
 
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