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British vs. English/Scottish/Welsh/Irish Watch

  • View Poll Results: Which one?
    British
    78
    39.20%
    English
    53
    26.63%
    Scottish
    26
    13.07%
    Welsh
    15
    7.54%
    Irish
    13
    6.53%
    None
    14
    7.04%

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    (Original post by Beige_Angel)
    English. I don't have any English blood in me but I was born and raised here and have never lived anyone else in Britain so...
    'English' is ethnicity, it's what a person is. You're British.
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    (Original post by AP_89)
    'English' is ethnicity
    Rubbish. Englishness is a national identity like any other.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    Rubbish. Englishness is a national identity like any other.
    If you're, for example, Turkish by ethnicity but born and raised in the UK, you're not English - you're British.

    English is White British.
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    Cornish! Ethnicity is Hakka/Cornish.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    Yes, exactly my point, tbh.

    I refuse to be proud of something that I had nothing to do with, and was the purest of accidents? Why should I bother being proud of being this ethnicity or that ethnicity, when I know that it's completely random, and I would think the same thing about a different place if things had been different.

    But yes, the borders which mark out one country from another are imaginary. Nothing but a concept. A mass delusion if you will. The same way money isn't ACTUALLY worth anything (it's paper), but we all agree to pretend it is.
    Society relies upon so called 'concepts' such as money and borders to sustain itself. This is hardly a case of mass delusion, currency is the result of a long process of societal development and competition between states has shaped the world we live in today. Society itself, our ability to organise ourselves in a coherent yet complex way, is one of humanities greatest achievements.

    Furthermore, borders are very real, they separate different groupings of people from one another, often people who have developed their own cultural identity over the course of history. The borders define where one group ends and another begins, and our collective achievement in creating a largely stable world where borders are respected and peace is maintained (particularly in Europe) is to be commended. Just look into the past, the world was not always as stable as it is today.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    Yeah, I'm afraid I just don't agree with you on that one. Tea especially is quintessentially British, not just English to me - about as British as you get without a furry hat and an odd-coloured telephone box.
    Think about it this way - would an American associate tea with the Scots? i don't think so. Do they associate it with the English? i think so. I mean, one of the most well known teas around the world is English Breakfast tea. There isn't a Scottish breakfast tea (or Welsh for that matter.) And then there's Yorkshire Tea. There isn't to my knowledge a famous tea named after a Scottish or Welsh county. Also, the brand Twinings of London - the brand seems very English to me. The use of Stephen Fry in their adverts demonstrates this. To me he is as English as they come. There is the Unilever brand Scottish Blend which advertises itself as being 'no ordinary tea. Created in 1990 [!], it was the first tea specially blended to match the softness of Scotland’s water – for a taste the Scots preferred.' Here, all Scots apparently prefer this kind of tea. We can only assume that the tea they prefer it to is traditional, and therefore 'normal', English tea.

    Also, i don't often hear the phrase quintessentially British; quintessentially English is much more common. If you type in the first phrase on Google, you get 86,800 results. If you type in the second, you get 195,000. I think tea drinking is much more quintessentially English. Scotch whiskey is the Scottish national drink; tea is England's. The Scottish Blend website states that 'Tea was first imported in England between 1652 and 1654 and quickly replaced ale as the national drink'. It doesn't anywhere claim that it also replaced Scotch whiskey as the national drink of Scotland.
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    (Original post by AP_89)
    If you're, for example, Turkish by ethnicity but born and raised in the UK, you're not English - you're British.

    English is White British.
    That's just racist crap.
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    British. I'm Scottish, English and Irish so to be honest, I couldn't be anything else.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    That's just racist crap.
    i agree with you on that!
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    Again with this 'English' blood thing.

    Argh.
    Well every time I or someone else claims to be English on TSR some idiot says that I can't call myself that unless I or one of my parents is English, preferably both.

    (Original post by AP_89)
    'English' is ethnicity, it's what a person is. You're British.
    I am not British lol. I do not live in Britain, I live in England. I was not raised in Britain, I was raised in England. I am mixed therefore I have no pure "ancestral race" and I'm not going to choose one half or the other. So I choose English
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    British. I was born in England, the rest of my family are Scottish. So I wouldn't be able to pick even if I wanted to.
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    (Original post by danny d)
    Think about it this way - would an American associate tea with the Scots? i don't think so.
    No, the associate it with the British. Equally I doubt tea would be particularly associated with Cheshire - because it's British-wide.

    I mean, one of the most well known teas around the world is English Breakfast tea. There isn't a Scottish breakfast tea (or Welsh for that matter.)
    There certainly is. As well as an Irish breakfast tea.


    And then there's Yorkshire Tea. There isn't to my knowledge a famous tea named after a Scottish or Welsh county.
    There's one named after Edinburgh, at least.

    Also, the brand Twinings of London - the brand seems very English to me. The use of Stephen Fry in their adverts demonstrates this.
    "I feel myself Norfolk before I feel myself England, and England before I feel myself Britain and so on, that it is possible to have multiple identities." - Stephen Fry

    Does that make it a Norfolkesque brand rather than and English one?

    To me he is as English as they come. There is the Unilever brand Scottish Blend which advertises itself as being 'no ordinary tea. Created in 1990 [!], it was the first tea specially blended to match the softness of Scotland’s water – for a taste the Scots preferred.' Here, all Scots apparently prefer this kind of tea. We can only assume that the tea they prefer it to is traditional, and therefore 'normal', English tea.
    Nothing more than a marketing gimmick.

    Also, i don't often hear the phrase quintessentially British; quintessentially English is much more common.
    It's not a 'phrase', it's two words put together to create a meaning.

    Scotch whiskey
    That's an oxymoron actually.

    It doesn't anywhere suggest that it also replaced Scotch whiskey as the national drink of Scotland.
    That's because you're giving whisky a pretended status in Scotland. Tea could not replace whisky - they were drunk for completely different reasons. As in England, tea was used as a substitute for beer in Scotland, which was the ordinary, daytime drink of the time. Indeed, there was a moral panic over it.
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    (Original post by Beige_Angel)
    I am not British lol. I do not live in Britain, I live in England. I was not raised in Britain, I was raised in England.
    Er, you do realise what you're saying is indisputable nonsense, don't you?
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    (Original post by danny d)
    i agree with you on that!
    Indeed, I hate this pretended situation which some people create where someone who is coloured or whatever cannot be English. There's no logic or reason behind it whatsoever.

    I can think of plenty of people of different races who are English.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    Er, you do realise what you're saying is indisputable nonsense, don't you?
    haha that is exactly what i was thinking!
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    (Original post by Beige_Angel)


    I am not British lol. I do not live in Britain, I live in England. I was not raised in Britain, I was raised in England. )
    That's some party trick right there, being in England but not in Britain. Next you're going to try being in Germany but not in Europe?
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    (Original post by L i b)
    Er, you do realise what you're saying is indisputable nonsense, don't you?
    (Original post by Fusilero)
    That's some party trick right there, being in England but not in Britain. Next you're going to try being in Germany but not in Europe?
    Okay you guys know what I mean :p: I just meant that I am not living in four places at once, I was born and raised in this one country (England) and do not identify with Ireland, Scotland or Wales since I have never been there and feel no sense of community with the people from those places.
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    (Original post by rockrunride)
    Unless Northern Irish, someone Irish is absolutely not British. Sorry to go on like a broken record, but I feel staunchly about it.
    Sorry that mad me laugh so hard. No offence intended ofcourse - It just reminded me of a conversation I had with my dad.

    Edit: no idea why I just shared that!
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    (Original post by Allthewayhome)
    Sorry that mad me laugh so hard. No offence intended ofcourse - It just reminded me of a conversation I had with my dad.

    Edit: no idea why I just shared that!
    I felt weird using the word as well, it's not one I go for usually :erm:
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    (Original post by rockrunride)
    I felt weird using the word as well, it's not one I go for usually :erm:
    No, it just my local sensibilities bursting to the surface and not the word itself.

    The only time you will here a local coatbridgian(my home town) calling someone "staunch" around the this particular time in July is someones faith and commitment to the Orange order.

    Usually the comparison is made between a "stauch orangeman or protestant" (though both are not mutually inclusive) and "devout catholic" in the media/local chitchat but in a sign of protest my dad wanted to be referred to as a staunch catholic since he thought it was daft that these contrived phrases are always be hurled about with little thought or redress and I must agree that he's right. The media always seem to make a meal out of something or label/"pigeon hole" everyone.

    Tis very silly. You'll probs not get it but I'm afraid that's what happens when you live in the goldfish bowl that is the west of Scotland
 
 
 
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