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    once a lefty always a lefty!!!!!!
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    Football for a start.
    explain. Capitalism has allowed those with a talent for football to thrive, creating wealth not only for themselves but contributing to their own countries economy.
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    Yes, everyone is either 'left' or 'right' and they may not have any opinions of their own. You're just as bad.
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    Yes, I will always be left handed.
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    The condescending, patronising and moronic posts from those of the Right in this thread have made me glad to be a leftie. And yes, I probably will be for life, because I can't see myself ever wanting to reduce public services or support a movement fundamentally based on prejudice.
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    (Original post by MichaelG)
    Churchill once said;

    if a man isn't socialist by the time hes 20, then he is without a heart.
    if a man isn't conservative by the time hes 30, the he is without a brain.

    Everyone grows up eventually!
    It's Otto Von Bismarck who said it actually, though it wouldn't surprise me if Churchill repeated it.
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    I'll keep the red flag flying
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    (Original post by Andy the Anarchist)
    It's Otto Von Bismarck who said it actually, though it wouldn't surprise me if Churchill repeated it.
    Churchill certainly did use it :gthumb:
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    (Original post by MichaelG)
    explain. Capitalism has allowed those with a talent for football to thrive, creating wealth not only for themselves but contributing to their own countries economy.
    Dead atmospheres at clubs that used to have one before ticket prices priced real supporters out of the game with those who can merely fill seats. Look at my club Chelsea and compare that to Liverpool. The same thing has happened to Arsenal to a lesser extent.
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    Dead atmospheres at clubs that used to have one before ticket prices priced real supporters out of the game with those who can merely fill seats. Look at my club Chelsea and compare that to Liverpool. The same thing has happened to Arsenal to a lesser extent.
    This is called a bust. Capitalism is characterised by booms and busts. My friend if it wasnt for capitalism, your football you kick around would still be made from pig skin.
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    (Original post by MichaelG)
    This is called a bust. Capitalism is characterised by booms and busts. My friend if it wasnt for capitalism, your football you kick around would still be made from pig skin.
    What he is talking about has nothing to do with the recession. Working class supporters have been priced out of football since around the time of the introduction of the Premiership in 1992.
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    (Original post by MichaelG)
    This is called a bust. Capitalism is characterised by booms and busts. My friend if it wasnt for capitalism, your football you kick around would still be made from pig skin.
    For football capitalism needs limits. A lot of supporters will bemoan of wage salaries but to me ticket prices are the bigger concern. Teams in the top flight, let alone Champions League regulars, make diddly squat from ticket sales so having a cap on ticket prices is not as big of a concern as it might be. Germany have caps on ticket prices and it's not until very recently that there has been a poor representation of German league clubs in Europe.
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    I'll probably stay Conservative most of my life. Mostly because i see good, workable things within the ideology, and want to see them used. They also seem to have a bad name in places, but im just a regular bloke with views. Likewise, im sure may leftwingers are. I just want to make a good name for us.
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    The once hardline-Trotskyist Peter Hitchens who is now a prominent conservative gives a fascinating account of his conversion in his latest book The Broken Compass. Essentially he says that after spending considerable time in the Soviet Union he came to the belief that - carried through to its logical conclusion - any Left-wing ideology would eventually terminate at the tyranny he witnessed in the USSR.
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    Hmmm...a lefty for life you ask?
    **** yeah! :yep:
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    Hallelujah - she finally got banned...
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    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    The condescending, patronising and moronic posts from those of the Right in this thread have made me glad to be a leftie. And yes, I probably will be for life, because I can't see myself ever wanting to reduce public services or support a movement fundamentally based on prejudice.
    Don't make the mistake that right = authoritarianism and that left = liberalism. How long will this two-dimensional way of thinking reign over peoples minds?

    The right is based on prejudice? What do you call libertarianism?
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    (Original post by Shalarmay)
    Or will your views change when you emerge from your ivory tower, AKA cushy university accommodation and enter the real world?

    My family is not exactly rich and I have certainly lived in the "real world". I emerged a lefty without any pushing from my politically blasé parenting.

    Probably will, yes.
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    I believe that after much deduction the Left-Right dichotomy can ultimately be reduced to a choice between utopianism or realism. For a while I toyed with the ideologies of the anarchist Left after reading its seductive literature. It has only been within the last year or so that my political persuasion has become firmly rooted in a sort of conservative realism. I came to this realisation mainly after reading John Gray's Black Mass where he convincingly shows that the utopian adventures of the past have always failed not simply because of practical error but because of the inherent flaws in utopianism itself, namely its false presumption that human nature is a creature which can be understood and controlled. This scepticism of utopianism is applied not merely to Left-wing ideologies but also to universalist Right-wing ideas such as neo-conservatism and the global free market.
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    (Original post by SteveThePhysicist)
    I believe that after much deduction the Left-Right dichotomy can ultimately be reduced to a choice between utopianism or realism. For a while I toyed with the ideologies of the anarchist Left after reading its seductive literature. It has only been within the last year or so that my political persuasion has become firmly rooted in a sort of conservative realism. I came to this realisation mainly after reading John Gray's Black Mass where he convincingly shows that the utopian adventures of the past have always failed not simply because of practical error but because of the inherent flaws in utopianism itself, namely its false presumption that human nature is a creature which can be understood and controlled. This scepticism of utopianism is applied not merely to Left-wing ideologies but also to universalist Right-wing ideas such as neo-conservatism and the global free market.
    "Conservatism is the negation of ideology"

    - Russell Kirk

    I completely agree with you. Utopians blame the problems of society on the political arrangement rather than thinking it might have something to do with the capacity for evil.
 
 
 
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