Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Thread for people who don't like snobby people who put down Art's degree's!!! Watch

    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jenny28)
    Art's degree's
    Please go back to Year 4 and re-learn how to use apostrophes.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by .ACS.)
    I randomly came across this earlier today: http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/ec...8-09-2/naylor/

    Makes for some very interesting reading!
    A social science degree gives the highest wage return, followed by science and then arts and humanities
    :jiggy:

    This whole debate is pathetic really unless you're going to take individual subjects into account. I'm pretty sure all bachelors degree awarded by Oxbridge are BAs. The people here who think science degrees will always be more financially rewarding are totally naive and immature. Earning a three figure salary takes a lot more than receiving a degree. That's just one of many stepping stones into the top-end of the working world.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by catoutofthebag)
    All you science and maths people, I would love for you to experience what the world would be like without any art, film, literature etc. Yes, you might be able to invent a television for example, and all the filming equipment to make a TV show, but oh my gosh look at that, no scripts, no sets, no costumes. All you can do with this marvellous invention is broadcast news ... How much fun.

    I would argue that 'science and maths' grads would be perfectly capable of creating sets, scripts and costumes for example Rowan Atkinson one of Britain's most successful ever comedic actors studied engineering!

    Without engineers and scientists, I would love you to experience a world without electricity, tv, internet, transportation, the built environment, advancements in medicine etc etc...

    I'm sure dancing around in a cave wearing elaborately decorated leaves would be a lot of fun, but I prefer today's modern hi-tech standards driven by scientific endeavour!

    Sorry about rant and vast generalisations but had to point that one out!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Arrrrggggghhhh how can people be so closed minded and ignorant. My stuck up school completely disowned me when I told them I wanted to pursue a fashion based degree, and tried to convince me repeatedly to do something more 'academic' at university. I am enjoying every minute of my degree so far and wouldn't have it any other way. If you're happy doing arts, do arts. If you're happy doing maths, do maths. Neither is better, they are just different.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    Orite kiddos calm down!

    This debate will never be resolved ever....trust me on this one I take Drama at Bristol and people are so shocked by the fact I can actually hold my own in a conversation about science that often they just end up screaming "see you on tv!" and chucking a protractor at me.

    In any case arts students and science students generally don't appreciate each other as much as they should - where's the love people? Also....science is art imo - stuff the Ba or the Bsc once you get to the highest levels of pretty much any science you enter the realms of philosophy - not to mention the inherent beauty of mathematics....similarly without the arts then what would be the point in progressing the more scientific fields? Without any form of culture to enjoy or politics to debate or even daily life to go about (not everyone aspires to be a leader in nanotechnology) what would be the point of ensuring that the country is healthy and efficient.

    If you want to lock yourself in an Orwellian nightmare then by all means wish yourself away to the land where arts degrees are banished from the face of the earth. Similarly if you want to spend your life discussing philosophy and art whilst sitting in a slum with bits of your anatomy casually failing on you then send the hate to Bsc/eng kids.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Valkyrja)
    In any case arts students and science students generally don't appreciate each other as much as they should - where's the love people?
    I agree. I'm sharing a flat next year with 3 guys, all of whom go to Imperial, 1 studies science, the other 2 study maths :yes: It's a shame people let their piggish and ignorant views get in the way; you never know, you could learn something from each other instead of fighting over which degree is 'better'.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Danny_777)
    Please go back to Year 4 and re-learn how to use apostrophes.
    omg this it getting boring now, in the past 3 pages i think we have discussed my apostrophe tardiness enough, and decided on the 'come for the grammar, stay for the discussion' approach! :p:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Valkyrja)
    Orite kiddos calm down!

    This debate will never be resolved ever....trust me on this one I take Drama at Bristol and people are so shocked by the fact I can actually hold my own in a conversation about science that often they just end up screaming "see you on tv!" and chucking a protractor at me.

    In any case arts students and science students generally don't appreciate each other as much as they should - where's the love people? Also....science is art imo - stuff the Ba or the Bsc once you get to the highest levels of pretty much any science you enter the realms of philosophy - not to mention the inherent beauty of mathematics....similarly without the arts then what would be the point in progressing the more scientific fields? Without any form of culture to enjoy or politics to debate or even daily life to go about (not everyone aspires to be a leader in nanotechnology) what would be the point of ensuring that the country is healthy and efficient.

    If you want to lock yourself in an Orwellian nightmare then by all means wish yourself away to the land where arts degrees are banished from the face of the earth. Similarly if you want to spend your life discussing philosophy and art whilst sitting in a slum with bits of your anatomy casually failing on you then send the hate to Bsc/eng kids.
    Agreed. Hopefully I can come to Bristol in 2 months and spread the interdisciplinary love as an undergrad.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by elsie87)
    I would argue that 'science and maths' grads would be perfectly capable of creating sets, scripts and costumes for example Rowan Atkinson one of Britain's most successful ever comedic actors studied engineering!

    Without engineers and scientists, I would love you to experience a world without electricity, tv, internet, transportation, the built environment, advancements in medicine etc etc...

    I'm sure dancing around in a cave wearing elaborately decorated leaves would be a lot of fun, but I prefer today's modern hi-tech standards driven by scientific endeavour!

    Sorry about rant and vast generalisations but had to point that one out!
    The point I'm trying to make is that art is something which makes the world what it is, maybe it's just me being a bit 'arty farty' but the world needs art or it wouldn't be nearly as spectacular as it is, it's what can set us apart from other animals. Yes, science and maths are part of that as well. I never said that we didn't need scientists to give us electricity and transport etc, I give science degrees the respect they deserve and all I ask for is that respect back.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by kittensmittens)
    Yes you do. I'm too tired to repeat myself so I refer you to this thread.

    http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show...t#post18744347

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the opinion of actual graphic designers (such as myself and others commenting in that thread) who have worked for reputable ad agencies and large clients has more basis in reality than that of 18-year old kids who know nothing about the subject.
    Excuse me? Are you this rude to everyone you talk to for the first time?

    To prove your point, you've directed me to a thread on TSR? Hardly what I'd call a reputable source. I completely agree that a degree is of huge benefit to a career in graphic design, but it is not 100% completely and undoubtedly necessary to being successful in the field.

    If you have two people of equal age, one with an extensive portfolio of successful work for major clients and one fresh from a linear, sometimes restrictive degree programme in 'design', who are you going to choose?

    I'm not an 18 year old who knows nothing about the subject. I'm not persuing a career in design or consider myself a highly experienced designer, but I freelance on the side and have done work experience with, and been in contact with many workers in successful design firms over the years, particularly in the past when it was what i wanted to do.

    The reality is you don't NEED a degree in graphic design to become a graphic designer. You NEED a degree in Medicine to become a doctor. You simply cannot argue that point.

    So please, grow up a little and try at least to argue your point articulately before resorting to demeaning insults and generalisations.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I soo understand that..
    I'm going to be doing media and communication come September and its already looked down upon and i haven't even started... these type of degrees contribute in their own little way so i hate the people who think there great as there doing a academic kinda of degree and somehow that makes them better then us?
    What i find frustrating is that leading university don't actually offer these modern art degrees so you always end up going to a uni that offers it ( and may be highly ranked in the course like Goldsmiths is for media) but just cuz it don't stand out like KINGS, UCL etc as in the name of the uni that even random family members know to them it feels like your going to a crap uni even though its great for your course!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Every degree has their own merit, I was just bored and fancied joining in the rant lol! Surprising how much people care, at the end of the day most high end jobs involve teamwork with people from all walks of life. So it really doesn't matter, study what you enjoy/good at, enjoy uni, work hard, get a good grade and try get a good job!

    This kind of argument is very much diluted in America as they have to study a variety of courses, so can judge for themselves which is more difficult!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I can see why some people feel that those who study for an art degree get an easy ride and do not have to work as hard as people who study science for example. In my own case when I was studying for my own undergraduate degree in Fine Art at a Scottish Art School I was in college every day 9am to 6.30pm either working in the studio or attending workshops, lectures and seminars. I would have a break for dinner and then spend the rest of the evening either reading and researching my academic work or I'd head back into college to use the darkroom facilites or attend life drawing and anatomy classes. I spent 5 months studying in Moscow on an exchange program and had to spend a year prior to this learning russian in my spare time. I was dedicated to my studies and the degree I was awarded reflected this. At art school you do have to be incredibly self motivated as a lot of the time you have is yours to fill either productively or not as you see fit. Many people don't have the self-discipline to complete an arts degree to a high standard however these people also tend to leave with poor degrees.
    I have every respect for students who study engineering or science my partner is an engineering graduate and I myself turned down a place to study at the School of Physics and Astronomy at Edinburgh University to follow my passion which is art.

    I may never make as much money as I might have had I studied Physics but I have a life I love and I feel I do contribute to society. For the past few years I have spent between 2 - 6 months each year abroad in places as diverse as Tokyo, Prague and Santiago taking part in artists residencies. When I am at home I split my time between my studio, writing, teaching at the local art school and volunteering for various arts related community projects. My annual income is around £25,000 which is more than enough for my needs, I am very much from a working class background and where I am now is a million miles from the sort of life I would have been living had I not studied at all. I am going on to do my postgraduate degree in fine art next year and I hope to continue on after and complete a Phd as I have a passion for writing and teaching also. I am happy in my life, I am deeply fulfilled and I feel I contribute something of value to society just like many other artists, writers, musicians, actors and filmmakers.

    It is not a contest between artists and scientists both are of great value to mankind.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    Well my A levels consisted of ;
    Biology, Chemistry, Maths and English.

    Reason I picked English was because I wanted to study literature as a base to see why certain novels were so successful. Mainly because myself being a prospective novelist, I practically self taught myself and could continue however it just came down as a hobby for me.

    My main career plan is to graduate from Medicine and become a Doctor, however if I have the time, I can fill it up with my random hobbies such as writing.

    Take my tutor for example, he gained a first from Imperial for theoretical physics but spends a lot of his time playing the trumpet (extremely well). Many academics studying the standard Science/Maths subjects may very well be capable of playing instruments or drawing etc.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by L i b)
    Who is Art?
    Haha :rofl: good one good one. The problem in this country bigger than the economy is the APOSTROPHE!!!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by xSkyFire)
    Well my A levels consisted of ;
    Biology, Chemistry, Maths and English.

    Reason I picked English was because I wanted to study literature as a base to see why certain novels were so successful. Mainly because myself being a prospective novelist, I practically self taught myself and could continue however it just came down as a hobby for me.

    My main career plan is to graduate from Medicine and become a Doctor, however if I have the time, I can fill it up with my random hobbies such as writing.

    Take my tutor for example, he gained a first from Imperial for theoretical physics but spends a lot of his time playing the trumpet (extremely well). Many academics studying the standard Science/Maths subjects may very well be capable of playing instruments or drawing etc.
    Excellent point! I think that it is vital to balance yourself out with creative hobbies if you are a scientist or engineer for example and with some scientific pastimes if you are an artist of some kind. I am a keen amature astronomer and like to keep up with what is happening in science and I find that my creative work is frequently inspired by these interests.

    Just remember that Leonardo DaVinci was an artist, a scientist and an engineer, now perhaps we can not all be like him but he is an admirable role model.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I think design degrees give you the best chance of a decent career, because everything is designed by someone and that person most likely went to art school.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    Excuse me? Are you this rude to everyone you talk to for the first time?
    No, only rude arrogant people.

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    To prove your point, you've directed me to a thread on TSR? Hardly what I'd call a reputable source.
    I could direct you to many other sources but I don't need to "prove" my point to you or anyone else. I was directing you to posts that have been made earlier by myself and other experienced designers about the exact same topic, merely to save myself from writing the same thing twice. Most people who think graphic design is useless know nothing about the subject, but clearly you already know everything so I'll stop talking.

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    I completely agree that a degree is of huge benefit to a career in graphic design, but it is not 100% completely and undoubtedly necessary to being successful in the field.
    A degree is not 100% completely necessary for a lot of careers. But these days you cannot hope to get your foot in the door anywhere without a degree unless you are brilliant, extremely well connected and lucky, which most people are not.

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    If you have two people of equal age, one with an extensive portfolio of successful work for major clients and one fresh from a linear, sometimes restrictive degree programme in 'design', who are you going to choose?
    Of course I would choose the person with work experience, but how do you think you would get major clients in the first place if you didn't have a portfolio of work to show them? (A portfolio which would come from a degree course?) What, you think a multinational corporation is just going to work with some guy who learned photoshop in their basement? What planet do you live on?

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    I'm not an 18 year old who knows nothing about the subject. I'm not persuing a career in design or consider myself a highly experienced designer, but I freelance on the side and have done work experience with, and been in contact with many workers in successful design firms over the years, particularly in the past when it was what i wanted to do.
    Fair enough. I did freelance work before I finished my degree as well. But the level I was working at at that time (and the pay) was astronomically different from the level I worked at after my degree.

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    The reality is you don't NEED a degree in graphic design to become a graphic designer. You NEED a degree in Medicine to become a doctor. You simply cannot argue that point.
    Yes I can. See above.

    (Original post by Stratocaster)
    So please, grow up a little and try at least to argue your point articulately before resorting to demeaning insults and generalisations.
    What part of my post was demeaning? Most people on TSR who hold your opinion are ignorant as they know nothing about the subject and have never studied it. I'm only trying to educate them (but it is a pointless battle so I will stop). It was not meant to be an insult, but a fact.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Static-CS)
    Agreed. Hopefully I can come to Bristol in 2 months and spread the interdisciplinary love as an undergrad.

    See you there m'dear :p:
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by kittensmittens)
    No, only rude arrogant people.

    What part of my first post did you deduce as being rude or arrogant?

    I could direct you to many other sources but I don't need to "prove" my point to you or anyone else. I was directing you to posts that have been made earlier by myself and other experienced designers about the exact same topic, merely to save myself from writing the same thing twice. Most people who think graphic design is useless know nothing about the subject, but clearly you already know everything so I'll stop talking.

    Okay, but I never said I knew everything. In fact, I said the opposite.


    A degree is not 100% completely necessary for a lot of careers. But these days you cannot hope to get your foot in the door anywhere without a degree unless you are brilliant, extremely well connected and lucky, which most people are not.

    I know, I completely accept that. I agree with you on that. Your argument is that you absolutely, completely, 100% need a degree to become a graphic designer, which is of course not true. And before you say you didn't say this, look below at your response to my doctor/medicine comment in red below.

    Of course I would choose the person with work experience, but how do you think you would get major clients in the first place if you didn't have a portfolio of work to show them? (A portfolio which would come from a degree course?) What, you think a multinational corporation is just going to work with some guy who learned photoshop in their basement? What planet do you live on?

    You've just contradicted yourself. Before you said you could do it if you happen to be extremely lucky, well connected .etc, which is pretty much true, but now a degree is essential to gaining a good portfolio? People do learn photoshop in their basements, and eventually get lucky. It happens. A degree obviously gives you more opportunities and opens more doors, but the former does happen. Therefore, I'm on planet earth.

    Fair enough. I did freelance work before I finished my degree as well. But the level I was working at at that time (and the pay) was astronomically different from the level I worked at after my degree.

    Again, not something I'm arguing. Of course a degree is going to help you. I would advise anyone looking to become a graphic designer to persue formal training and education in the field.

    The thing is, there is no giant invisible God which says "in no way, shape or form will you ever become a successful graphic designer if you don't have a degree in the subject." THAT is what you have said, and THAT is what I am arguing. There are a number of examples of people who have been successful without a degree, although it is definetely becoming more important now.


    Yes I can. See above.

    What part of my post was demeaning? Most people on TSR who hold your opinion are ignorant as they know nothing about the subject and have never studied it. I'm only trying to educate them (but it is a pointless battle so I will stop). It was not meant to be an insult, but a fact.

    The part where you said "an 18 year old who knows nothing about the subject."

    Like you say, MOST people on TSR may be ignorant, but not all of them. You didn't know anything about me, so why jump to that conclusion and use the comments you did after 1 post? Dealing with my opinion in a mature and appropriate way would have spared this, but unfortunately, you decided to be unpleasant and rude for no reason. I understand you're frustrated with opposing opinions, but at least have the respect to listen and reply with some decency.
    Thank you.
 
 
 
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: July 28, 2009
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    What's your favourite Christmas sweets?
    Useful resources
    Uni match

    Applying to uni?

    Our tool will help you find the perfect course

    Articles:

    Debate and current affairs guidelinesDebate and current affairs wiki

    Quick link:

    Educational debate unanswered threads

    Groups associated with this forum:

    View associated groups
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.