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Which football club has the most deluded set of fans? watch

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    (Original post by DrLiamRydae)
    Oh yeah, Ronaldo was definitely the best player in the world that season. But this year just gone he was pretty dire in comparison, and I think Utd will be better off without him.

    Also, any Man U fan that thinks Michael Owen is a rubbish signing is more deluded that pro-Ronaldo fans. The guy was free, for god's sake, and they'll come back in May saying they knew all along that Owen would score 20+ goals and win them at least one trophy. Bah.
    Dire is a harsh word to use. We can't always compare his work to the season that will be remembered as the greatest of his career. I don't think we'll be better off, as such, it will allow us to change the way we play. He never chased back, so we had to sacrifice Rooney or use Park/Fletcher to chase back. With that gone, it frees up Rooney, a creative midfield spot for Giggs/Scholes and Nani/Valencia on the wing.

    I also think we relied on him too much to come up with a ridiculous goal. Fewer freekicks will be wasted, someone else can score the pens. With a full pre-season for Berba, Owen banging in the goals and Rooney playing in his best position, I'm quietly confident.
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    (Original post by nase14_aldayz)
    Most arsenal fans aren't like that. ALL clubs have hypocrites and the fickle fans.

    Anyway tottenham have the most deluded fans, think they've got some god given right to be pushing for champions league each year.
    Yer I said Tottenham as well.

    And yes all clubs have hypocrites and fickle fans, but ALL clubs also have some deluded fans.

    I don't live in North London so I'm only really exposed to Arsenal 'fans' who happen to live near me, or those that post on message boards, or appear on TV/radio, etc which is always going to skew my opinions (since I'd suggest that these people tend to be more extreme in their views/delusions than typical fans). Since I'm posting this on a message board I guess I fall into this category as well.

    However, my experience of most fans (outside of the midlands clubs) is through these exact same media and Arsenal/Tottenham fans do come across worse than a lot of other clubs (in my opinion of course...).
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    (Original post by Ascient)
    Would you like to explain why style of football doesn't actually matter, then? And what is wrong with finding the means to the end just as important as the end it self.

    Say your mother's ambition in life was to make £1m. Would you tell her she was deluded if she didn't want to do it by prostituting herself but preferred to work her way up in a job and make it like that?

    Thanks.

    EDIT: Just a facetious example, of course, as harmless banter. Please don't take it seriously (anyone).
    Well football is based on results, and I'd rather watch my team scrape an ugly win than lose in style. There is of course nothing wrong with wanting your team to play stylish football, but I don't think taking any sort of high ground when playing teams which don't compete with you on the same terms is justified - and this is a trait I have noticed in some (clearly not all...) Arsenal fans and what I'm saying is 'deluded'.

    If we compare teams like Stoke, and Wimbledon a while ago maybe, with someone like West Brom last season then it is clear that they can't compete with Arsenal playing beautiful football - but can be successful in their own terms.

    If this (minority...) of Arsenal fans had their way all the other teams would basically just lie down in front of them and acknowledge that they can't play as pretty as them.

    But I concede, if you can completely detach yourself from the result/the fortunes of the team itself then it would probably be more enjoyable watching Arsenal than Stoke. Which is probably why I/so many others used to get such a kick out of watching Italian/Spanish football, when I just didn't care who won/how it would affect my team.

    You could also of course argue that Arsenal are prostituting themselves by focussing on attractive football and teams like Stoke are hard-grafting and working their way up, within their own limitations...(and I'll echo your statement about not taking this seriously)
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    (Original post by nase14_aldayz)
    Anyway tottenham have the most deluded fans, think they've got some god given right to be pushing for champions league each year.
    We don't think we have a god given right, it's just that every summer we spend big and therefore think that we're capable of it. Our squad last year was capable, but obviously the bad start put pay to that. It wasn't long ago that we were 4th for more or less an entire season and then lost out because some guy doesn't know how to cook a lasagna...

    (Original post by nase14_aldayz)
    United will never be better off without Ronaldo.
    I don't know, I think it'll be a relief to the rest of the team to know that they don't have a player who individually thinks he's better than the rest of the team, throws tantrums not unlike toddlers, doesn't chase back to correct a mistake and instead just poses for the Sky cameras, and someone who won't try to move every summer. Don't get me wrong, good player, but he has such an unprofessional attitude and I hate the idea that kids will look up to him.

    (Original post by Rated R Superstar)
    Dire is a harsh word to use. We can't always compare his work to the season that will be remembered as the greatest of his career. I don't think we'll be better off, as such, it will allow us to change the way we play. He never chased back, so we had to sacrifice Rooney or use Park/Fletcher to chase back. With that gone, it frees up Rooney, a creative midfield spot for Giggs/Scholes and Nani/Valencia on the wing.

    I also think we relied on him too much to come up with a ridiculous goal. Fewer freekicks will be wasted, someone else can score the pens. With a full pre-season for Berba, Owen banging in the goals and Rooney playing in his best position, I'm quietly confident.
    So you should be, Fergie has spent (or not, in Owen's case) really well this summer and I see a really good season for you. I think it'll be interesting to see how long it takes for Ronaldo to throw the toys out when he doesn't start regularly at Madrid.
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    (Original post by MC REN)
    Well football is based on results, and I'd rather watch my team scrape an ugly win than lose in style.
    Well, I would argue this "win at any cost" attitude is shallow in exactly the same vein you would argue my "means is just as important as the end" attitude is.

    There is of course nothing wrong with wanting your team to play stylish football, but I don't think taking any sort of high ground when playing teams which don't compete with you on the same terms is justified - and this is a trait I have noticed in some (clearly not all...) Arsenal fans and what I'm saying is 'deluded'.
    Whilst this is true, in my experience the opposite is more true. Rather than me having a problem with you wanting to win at any cost, you have a problem with me not wanting to win at any cost.

    If this (minority...) of Arsenal fans had their way all the other teams would basically just lie down in front of them and acknowledge that they can't play as pretty as them.
    You assume we take superiority because we play better football but also think we want everyone to play this better football. I think the two are more irreconcilable than anything. Why would we want everyone to play the same football as us if, as you say, we think that's what distinguishes us?

    I don't necessarily believe all this, incidentally, I'm just trying to illustrate the contradictions in your argument.

    But I concede, if you can completely detach yourself from the result/the fortunes of the team itself then it would probably be more enjoyable watching Arsenal than Stoke. Which is probably why I/so many others used to get such a kick out of watching Italian/Spanish football, when I just didn't care who won/how it would affect my team.
    It's not about completely detaching yourself, though. It's about the right balance. I'd rather we continued as we were, however, rather than bowed down to the demands of people like your good self and started playing one-dimensional football and buying £30m players.

    You could also of course argue that Arsenal are prostituting themselves by focussing on attractive football and teams like Stoke are hard-grafting and working their way up, within their own limitations...(and I'll echo your statement about not taking this seriously)
    Look, I don't have anything against the likes of Stoke or Bolton that extends beyond light banter and a different appreciation of how they conduct themselves. Like I said earlier, it's you that has a problem with the way I choose to support my football team rather than me having a problem with the way anyone else chooses to support theirs. I don't think we're any 'better' than Stoke, Bolton or Blackburn (well, maybe Blackburn :teeth:), we're just different. And I'm speaking in my own capacity as an individual and not as some sort of representative of Arsenal.
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    (Original post by Ascient)
    Well, I would argue this "win at any cost" attitude is shallow in exactly the same vein you would argue my "means is just as important as the end" attitude is.


    Whilst this is true, in my experience the opposite is more true. Rather than me having a problem with you wanting to win at any cost, you have a problem with me not wanting to win at any cost.



    You assume we take superiority because we play better football but also think we want everyone to play this better football. I think the two are more irreconcilable than anything. Why would we want everyone to play the same football as us if, as you say, we think that's what distinguishes us?

    I don't necessarily believe all this, incidentally, I'm just trying to illustrate the contradictions in your argument.



    It's not about completely detaching yourself, though. It's about the right balance. I'd rather we continued as we were, however, rather than bowed down to the demands of people like your good self and started playing one-dimensional football and buying £30m players.



    Look, I don't have anything against the likes of Stoke or Bolton that extends beyond light banter and a different appreciation of how they conduct themselves. Like I said earlier, it's you that has a problem with the way I choose to support my football team rather than me having a problem with the way anyone else chooses to support theirs. I don't think we're any 'better' than Stoke, Bolton or Blackburn (well, maybe Blackburn :teeth:), we're just different. And I'm speaking in my own capacity as an individual and not as some sort of representative of Arsenal.
    Epic quotage there, nice one.
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    Every club had deluded fans who, like to think they are bigger than they actually are, I doubt any club has a large percentage more than any other.

    As a Stoke fan, I would rather us play the way we did last season and stay up comfortably, than take West Broms approach. Our style of play was/is not as bad as the written media say and the football got a lot better as the season progressed and as the midfield changed to one with a lot more quality in (When Lawrence returned from tripping over his dog, Etherington signed and Whelan came in to the side - all these were much better footballers than those that they were replacing).
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    (Original post by Singh_2)
    Epic quotage there, nice one.
    Cheers
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    (Original post by Singh_2)
    Arsenal- hate the way they think they are the masters of sexy football. Also hate the 'Liverpool hoof the ball' chants when they come to Anfield.
    Meh I don't know ANY gunners fans who'd say we were "masters" of sexy football - but you can't deny that we play good football. I prefer Arsenal's/Barca's style of game compared to other teams but it's all down to preference.

    Most deluded:

    Man City - buybuybuy =/= big 4 :mad:
    Money mad **** owners. I like most of the supporters I know though, but they seem to think everythings about to change drastically :no:

    Liverpool - "This year is SO our year.. Oh wait no, I meant next year.. Uhh maybe the year after..?"
    They do have a very good team though, they just shouldn't assume they're gonna win stuff.

    Spurs - "HAHA WE GOT SILVERWARE THIS SEASON"
    yet they forget about all the previous seasons where they've had nothing. And ended up like.. 50th in the table. They buy good players and then nothing happens.
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    (Original post by CityOfMyHeart)
    Meh I don't know ANY gunners fans who'd say we were "masters" of sexy football - but you can't deny that we play good football. I prefer Arsenal's/Barca's style of game compared to other teams but it's all down to preference.

    Most deluded:

    Man City - buybuybuy =/= big 4 :mad:
    Money mad **** owners. I like most of the supporters I know though, but they seem to think everythings about to change drastically :no:

    Liverpool - "This year is SO our year.. Oh wait no, I meant next year.. Uhh maybe the year after..?"
    They do have a very good team though, they just shouldn't assume they're gonna win stuff.

    Spurs - "HAHA WE GOT SILVERWARE THIS SEASON"
    yet they forget about all the previous seasons where they've had nothing. And ended up like.. 50th in the table. They buy good players and then nothing happens.
    But surely you can't deny that this year truly is OUR year? :cool:
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    (Original post by Singh_2)
    But surely you can't deny that this year truly is OUR year? :cool:
    Haha maybe we should wait until the season starts and see how everyone gets on? S'always the best thing to do :p:

    I don't think I'll be able to stand United winning the title this year - I find they have THE most arrogant supporters ever. Quality team but argh. So Arsenal or Liverpool for the title please. In that order. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Ascient)
    You assume we take superiority because we play better football but also think we want everyone to play this better football. I think the two are more irreconcilable than anything. Why would we want everyone to play the same football as us if, as you say, we think that's what distinguishes us?

    It's not about completely detaching yourself, though. It's about the right balance. I'd rather we continued as we were, however, rather than bowed down to the demands of people like your good self and started playing one-dimensional football and buying £30m players.
    You want other teams to play the same style as you because you are better at it than them, and would win.

    (Although even Stoke score the occasional stunning goal (Fuller vs Villa for example, which was still pretty direct actually) which must put more of a smile on their faces than seeing Delap throw the ball into the box ad nauseum :p: )

    It is about balance, the whole league is, and I'd much rather teams like Arsenal and West Brom did play than didn't - but not exclusively at the expense of teams like Bolton. I just think some Arsenal fans seem to feel the league would be better if teams like Bolton weren't allowed to play.

    You clearly aren't one of the Arsenal fans who holds this sort of attitude, but it does exist amongst you (to a greater extent that at most other clubs I'd say - and other people on this thread have mentioned this about Arsenal fans).

    Also, the whole results vs style issue is does need some balance, but it is a very common complaint around football grounds (not just yours) that "we played better than them so deserved to win" which isn't right. Extending this to Arsenal fans one might say that they take this attitude towards the whole season.
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    Tottenham without doubt. Closely followed by Liverpool and then Newcastle. Just because every single on of their fans believe they are worthy of winning something. Tottenham is self explanatory, Liverpool due to the fact that 'Stevie G' is idolised and Newcastle because they had the chance to make themelves decent with a few good players but still managed to **** it up.
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    (Original post by MC REN)
    (Although even Stoke score the occasional stunning goal (Fuller vs Villa for example, which was still pretty direct actually) which must put more of a smile on their faces than seeing Delap throw the ball into the box ad nauseum :p: )
    Hardly 'pretty direct' - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TV4bXyl4uM

    Fuller is a quality player who would probably be at a club in the top half of the Prem, if it wasn't for his knees, which 'would never pass a conventional medical'.
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    (Original post by Ben25)
    Hardly 'pretty direct' - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TV4bXyl4uM

    Fuller is a quality player who would probably be at a club in the top half of the Prem, if it wasn't for his knees, which 'would never pass a conventional medical'.
    Yer, the way I remembered it Lawrence's throughball was from like 20 yards into the Stoke half, so sorry

    Fuller once scored something like 40 goals in a season for me on Champman so I've always liked him

    Both Villa Stoke games were sick last season:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFX6d...eature=related although ******* hell, the commentator properly cursed Villa after that goal
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    I love Ricardo Fuller :love: Legend! :woo:
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    As objectively as I can, Spurs.

    I have a theory that Spurs, City, and Everton all suffer to either greater or lesser degrees from "Big Club Syndrome." Rather like wanting to keep up with the Jones's, these clubs convince themselves they are bigger than they actually are due to close geographical proximity/rivalry with a genuinely big club. They feel it would be even more humiliating in the context of those rivalries to admit their true status, so they inflate their histories to a level somewhat relative to the local rival. This invariably fails.

    It's football's equivalent of an inferiority complex as I see it.
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    (Original post by Hubert Poo)
    As objectively as I can, Spurs
    Yeah...didn't work.



    Enjoyed reading it though.
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    :teeth:

    I'm serious though mostly. Some of the things Spurs fans come out with seems far more concerned about us than their own club, and much of it is simply fantastical.
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    (Original post by Hubert Poo)
    As objectively as I can, Spurs.

    I have a theory that Spurs, City, and Everton all suffer to either greater or lesser degrees from "Big Club Syndrome." Rather like wanting to keep up with the Jones's, these clubs convince themselves they are bigger than they actually are due to close geographical proximity/rivalry with a genuinely big club. They feel it would be even more humiliating in the context of those rivalries to admit their true status, so they inflate their histories to a level somewhat relative to the local rival. This invariably fails.

    It's football's equivalent of an inferiority complex as I see it.
    Everton, are you joking? IMO could not be further from the truth.

    Their chairman has frequently gone on about Everton being this friendly club, a nice family football club. Doesn't one bit of their stadium/stands even have them down, in writing, as a family club? They don't appear to have a big club syndrome/mentality.

    Newcastle, Liverpool - two clubs that do spring to mind in regards to having their fair share of deluded fans.
 
 
 
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