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    hi all

    okk so thats the job im thinking of doing just gotta few questions though!

    what is the best way to become a pilot? like should you get a degree?

    what is the minimum height to become a pilot cause im only 5 foot 4??

    thanks for the help
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    Whether or not you should get a degree is your call. It isn't compulsory, but given the amount of points during the training pipeline and thereafter where you could find yourself "out on your arse", in many cases for reasons beyond your control, there's a lot to be said for having a degree as a solid backup. Or you could find yourself out of the service for whatever reason in your early twenties, when all your peers in the job market have degrees, and you don't.

    For your second point, although I guess there are published minimum and maximum heights to be a Pilot, it's more to do with how the lengths of various sections of your body are proportioned rather than your overall height.
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    its very hard to become a pilot in the RAF you need 5 GCSE's at grade c and above including maths and english and 2 a levels. on top of that to have any chance you need to display some sort of leadership and teamwork experience eg. DofE. then you need to go to the armes services careers office and have an interview and then you may or may not be recommended for officer and aircrew selection which is 4 days of tests including 7 straight hours of aptitude tests and you need to score above 112 points (this is where i fell down) but they say to have a decent shot you need around 130 points. and get through that and ya still might not get in. what im doin is getting a degree in aerospace engineering and tryin to join the university air squadron and get some flying hours and general military experience then will apply again after uni.
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    From what I've gathered, although some people do join up as school leavers, OASC do tell a lot of guys to go to uni and 'mature'. Basically, uni gives you a chance to get out and live independently, and does provide you with lots of new experiences. Also, if you get yourself onto a UAS, you get paid to fly, play sport, go on expeditions, and generally get a good insight into military life. It's a win-win situation!

    As for being a shorty - like DBazza said, it's all about limb proportions, so you wont really know if you're medically eligible until you get measured up.
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    http://www.raf.mod.uk/careers/jobs/p...m?tab=thefacts

    And try your UAS at your University. Recruitment is during freshers week.
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    ok thanks for the help
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    (Original post by *NuckingFuts*)
    As for being a shorty - like DBazza said, it's all about limb proportions, so you wont really know if you're medically eligible until you get measured up.
    This has always seemed a bit odd to me---I can't find the anthropometric requirements published anywhere (go on, prove me wrong someone!) and yet you have to get to the last day of OASC before they tell you you're too big/small to do the job you've applied for.
    I am only just big enough and I would have been gutted to get through all the way to the medical just to be told I'm too small. I know this happens with e.g. sight and hearing too, but people generally know whether their hearing and eyesight are likely to be up to scratch before they apply (and indeed there are published eyesight standards).
    Are they hoping that if you get through most of OASC hoping to be (e.g.) pilot but are the wrong size they won't 'lose' you (as you've proved yourself to be competetive in officer selection) and they can persuade you to do something else instead? That was the only theory we came up with on our OASC but it's not convincing to me. I'm sure there's a lot of good applicants to every branch, not just those requiring specific anthropometrics.
    I do now have the list of measurements at home for those who are interested as they were listed on my medical form. Is there a better, more central place to put them than this thread? (Or any reasons I should not put them in the public domain?)

    p.s.
    (Original post by Rowinglegend)
    what is the minimum height to become a pilot cause im only 5 foot 4??
    I'm 5'4" and was big enough, but I have known people taller who weren't. As *NuckingFuts* says, it's all about limb proportion. Btw, where do you row?
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    you have to get to the last day of OASC before they tell you you're too big/small to do the job you've applied for.
    I am only just big enough and I would have been gutted to get through all the way to the medical just to be told I'm too small.
    Simply put, I imagine it's because the medical stages are more expensive. You have to pay a bunch of locum doctors, and they're time consuming too. If you leave it until last, you wait until you've weeded out aptitude failures, interview failures, fitness failures, and anyone who's messed up in the group stage of selection. Only your tentative "passees" get sent for medicals.

    Yes, it would make a huge amount of sense to rule out the medical issues first, but it makes financial sense to only medical those you have to.

    (Original post by anony_miss)
    Are they hoping that if you get through most of OASC hoping to be (e.g.) pilot but are the wrong size they won't 'lose' you (as you've proved yourself to be competetive in officer selection) and they can persuade you to do something else instead?
    Not really. The problem is, as you've hinted, that after several days of bonding with your boardmates and going through selection, you really want to pass. People used to get given this option after the old part 1, normally after an aptitude or medical fail, and continued on to part 2 in another branch.

    The problem was that virtually no-one would refuse the offer of another branch, because the draw of finishing selection was so large. Then, they'd arrive at IOT, and crack on just like everyone else. It wasn't until arriving at specialist training that they'd go "hang on, I wanted to be a pilot, why did I sign up for training officer again??"

    Result, lots of people hacked off and VWing from training.

    Sensibly, OASC won't let you compete for a branch that you haven't researched and shown an interest in before. You can continue if you've got a non-aptitude or non-medically specific branch already on your paperwork, but for these reasons it's not possible nor sensible to add a branch at the late stages.

    (Original post by anony_miss)
    That was the only theory we came up with on our OASC but it's not convincing to me. I'm sure there's a lot of good applicants to every branch, not just those requiring specific anthropometrics.
    Spot on; and they'd rather have a keen wannabe Flt Ops bloke who wants to do the job go into training, rather than a wannabe pilot who grabbed it because it had "flight" in the branch name when he was medicalled out.

    (Original post by anony_miss)
    I do now have the list of measurements at home for those who are interested as they were listed on my medical form. Is there a better, more central place to put them than this thread? (Or any reasons I should not put them in the public domain?)
    I wouldn't bother, because it'll just end up with a bunch of people sitting here with tape measures going "aww I'm not big enough" and not applying, even though they've probably measured themselves wrong and actually are. Or, people measuring and going "yay, I'm fine" then getting rejected and kicking up a fuss.

    It's one of the elements of selection you can't do anything about, so I would advise most people not to worry. If you are disproportionately tall, you won't fit. If you're fairly normal, you will.
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    (Original post by Wzz)
    Simply put, I imagine it's because the medical stages are more expensive. You have to pay a bunch of locum doctors, and they're time consuming too.
    Yes, I understood that to be why medicals are the last stage of OASC, but I was really commenting on the lack of information out there about anthropometrics, compared to e.g. eyesight, and common medical conditions (e.g. asthma), before you get to OASC, or even apply. It is out there, but not officially published by the RAF.
    (Original post by Wzz)
    I wouldn't bother, because it'll just end up with a bunch of people sitting here with tape measures going "aww I'm not big enough" and not applying, even though they've probably measured themselves wrong and actually are. Or, people measuring and going "yay, I'm fine" then getting rejected and kicking up a fuss.
    I'm not sure I agree with that. If I'm 5 or 10cm too short on a measurement, maybe it will influence whether I apply. If I'm 1 or 2cm short, I would probably apply anyway, but at least be aware that it's an issue. And practice stretching
    Same thing with eyesight---if my eyes are blatantly below the standard, I'm not going to apply. If they're close, or I'm not sure, maybe I would. You make a valid point about accuracy of measurement which is perhaps where the comparison with eyesight breaks down, but I still think it'd be good to know roughly where you stand.
    (Original post by Wzz)
    If you are disproportionately tall, you won't fit. If you're fairly normal, you will.
    If you're fairly normal and a bloke, you mean.
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    I'm not sure I agree with that. If I'm 5 or 10cm too short on a measurement, maybe it will influence whether I apply. If I'm 1 or 2cm short, I would probably apply anyway, but at least be aware that it's an issue. And practice stretching
    Same thing with eyesight---if my eyes are blatantly below the standard, I'm not going to apply. If they're close, or I'm not sure, maybe I would. You make a valid point about accuracy of measurement which is perhaps where the comparison with eyesight breaks down, but I still think it'd be good to know roughly where you stand.

    That's because you're rational [despite being a female ].


    Hang around this forum long enough and you'll realise that a fair few people aren't quite so reasonable when it comes to accepting limits. There was a recent example with someone arguing about laser eye surgery.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    That's because you're rational [despite being a female ].
    You'll regret that assertion. Which part of it I'm referring to you won't know until IOT
    (Original post by Drewski)
    Hang around this forum long enough and you'll realise that a fair few people aren't quite so reasonable when it comes to accepting limits. There was a recent example with someone arguing about laser eye surgery.
    Yea, fair dos, I get Wzz's point. I'm lucky. I would've been NOT PLEASED if my legs had been another cm shorter.
    I had been measured before though, so I had an idea that I was probably ok, but close to the limit. Which I was grateful for knowing.

    [edit formatting]
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    You'll regret that assertion. Which part of it I'm referring to you won't know until IOT

    You can hold off on your threats... I don't know if I'm even going to be on this one yet!

    [What is it with short girls threatening me?! Jeesh]
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    You can hold off on your threats... I don't know if I'm even going to be on this one yet!
    I'm sure I'll see you there, even if you don't make it till November.
    (Original post by Drewski)
    [What is it with short girls threatening me?! Jeesh]
    I won't ask. But I will point out that I am of average height. Average height I tells ya.
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    I'm sure I'll see you there, even if you don't make it till November.

    I won't ask. But I will point out that I am of average height. Average height I tells ya.
    Yeah, but then you'll just be mean to the newbie :sad:


    You may be the 'average' height, but you're still 10" shorter than me...
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    I'm not sure I agree with that. If I'm 5 or 10cm too short on a measurement, maybe it will influence whether I apply. If I'm 1 or 2cm short, I would probably apply anyway, but at least be aware that it's an issue. And practice stretching
    I doubt very much if anyone could measure to the required millimetre accuracy anyway, and to be honest I think the proportion of the country who'd be 5cm out is so small they can be ignored.

    Regardless, I still think basing your application on what you see sitting at home with a tape measure is insane, especially if the numbers you're working with came from some anonymous voices on the internet. If it turns out you had the wrong numbers, or hadn't measured correctly, then you'd feel a bit stupid sitting in your office watching a jet go by in a few years time, when you didn't even bother applying.

    I still maintain that you have no control over any medical issues, and you can't possibly hope to check to anywhere near the standards required, so it's best to let the experts make all the decisions.
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    (Original post by Wzz)
    I doubt very much if anyone could measure to the required millimetre accuracy anyway, and to be honest I think the proportion of the country who'd be 5cm out is so small they can be ignored.
    Average height (F) = 5'3"/5'4". Standard deviation (~68% of population) = 2.8". I know people taller than me who've been rejected as they are differently proportioned, so let's pretend that I'm 'perfectly proportioned' (and I was close on all the measurements) and take 5'4" as the 'minimum height'.
    So that leaves 8% ((100-68)/2) females, i.e. 50%) of the population at least 2.8" (7cm) too short. That's about 1 in 12. And ok, that height difference may be split between legs and torso, but it's not entirely unlikely that it'll be concentrated in one or the other to the tune of 5cm. Anyway, I've got a big arse to boost my sitting height, not everyone of my height has that advantage
    (Original post by Wzz)
    Regardless, I still think basing your application on what you see sitting at home with a tape measure is insane, especially if the numbers you're working with came from some anonymous voices on the internet. If it turns out you had the wrong numbers, or hadn't measured correctly, then you'd feel a bit stupid sitting in your office watching a jet go by in a few years time, when you didn't even bother applying.
    True. But which is why some official numbers, published by the RAF might be helpful. Then again, maybe you're right, there's always going to be someone that the AFCO tells has the wrong measurements, won't apply and then is going to be very p****d off in a few years' time. Or the other way round.
    (Original post by Wzz)
    I still maintain that you have no control over any medical issues, and you can't possibly hope to check to anywhere near the standards required, so it's best to let the experts make all the decisions.
    Yea, you're probably right. I like to have all the info before I turn up though (you'd never have guessed eh?).
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    Yea, you're probably right. I like to have all the info before I turn up.

    Can I just be the first to say "...and you're joining the Armed Forces why!?".
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Can I just be the first to say "...and you're joining the Armed Forces why!?".
    I like feeling frustrated.
    Good point though. I'm going to have to learn to keep a better lid on my questioning (and pedantry).
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    (Original post by anony_miss)
    I like feeling frustrated.
    Good point though. I'm going to have to learn to keep a better lid on my questioning (and pedantry).

    Drinking helps the pain :yes:
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    On the anthropometrics I'm about 5'2" and came close on functional reach but was fine for everything else. Being small it is usually functional reach that is the issue. Being tall (over about 6'2" ) it is usually buttock to knee length that is the first issue, perhaps back length as well, depending on how the height is distributed.

    Anthropometric measurements are taken from very specific points of your body in specific sitting positions so there is no way you can measure them yourself to the millimetre tolerances that are required.

    5'4" won't be a problem if you can reach the change in the bottom of your pocket
 
 
 
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