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    (Original post by Subcutaneous)
    aww are you a med student? In nottingham/derby?

    I just enjoy how general it is, plus old people are the funnest to work with, and if you're ever bored just go talk to one of them and they always appreciate it..plus i love the care delievered, its my favourite 'type' of care, i dont think i want to end up working in CofE, but i enjoy it as a HCA/student, good chance to pratice bls too, but that is a selfish reason
    I'm afraid not, hopefully one day though. I'm basing this on the work experience I've done. :p:

    Yeah, they seem to have this wisedom which you can only get with age, and these different perspectives. But it is quite sad when you can see them getting frustrated/depressed by their afflictions, and you know you can only do so much.

    So if you don't see yourself in CofE, what area do you see yourself going into?

    x
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    (Original post by LozengeC)
    I'm afraid not, hopefully one day though. I'm basing this on the work experience I've done. :p:

    Yeah, they seem to have this wisedom which you can only get with age, and these different perspectives. But it is quite sad when you can see them getting frustrated/depressed by their afflictions, and you know you can only do so much.

    So if you don't see yourself in CofE, what area do you see yourself going into?

    x

    i quite like the idea of two very different areas of nursing, lol critical care, and gynaecology, but within a more community based setting
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    (Original post by Trigger)
    Yes, they do. You say they don't because you are one of those nurses.
    you need to prove this assertion

    show me a job description which states that a Registered Nurse is responsible to a Doctor and i'll believe you

    10 + years in clinical practice says otherwise.

    or are you one of those Doctors ?

    there are 2 situations i'vve been in when i was managed by a Doctor

    1. in an emergency dept in a small trust where we had a Lead consultant and a Matron but no general manager , the Lead consultant however did have protected time and additional secretarial support to undertake General manager Duties - so that was where the general manager for the unit happened to be a Doctor

    2. in a multidisciplinary management group within a voluntary sector healthcare group where the functional team at that time was lead by a Doctor, I also remained accountable to the lead nurse for my clinicla Nursing role and to Lead Paramedic as someoen who crews Ambulances ... again this was a case of the 'general manager' happening to be a Doctor


    in my NHS roles the lines of accountabilty have been and remain

    Support workers -> Registered nurses -> Shift leaders /Team Leaders -> Senior Sister/ Charge Nurse (ward manager) -> Matron -> Divisional director of nursing -> Trust director of nursing.
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    (Original post by zippyRN)
    i think you need to support that incorrect assertion.

    as a registered Nurse once you are out of preceptorship you are accountable for your caseload on a shift to shift basis, you also hold ongoing accountability for any patient you are named nurse for.

    a Junior Doctor never holds the ongoing responsibility or accountability for a patient that is vested in the Consultant or Staff Specialist under whom the patient is admitted.
    is that why the nurses write 'doctors informed' anytime poo goes down then?
    Because they feel it is necessary to tell their 'not seniors' but colleagues..?

    hmm....


    Seems to me that wards full of 'you cn't tell me what to do' nurses are the worst ones because nothing ever seems to get done.
    I get sick of having to justify my every request. Its not my job to teach basic medicine to nursing staff. Sometimes you really aught just take a request on faith.
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    is that why the nurses write 'doctors informed' anytime poo goes down then?
    Because they feel it is necessary to tell their 'not seniors' but colleagues..?

    hmm....


    Seems to me that wards full of 'you cn't tell me what to do' nurses are the worst ones because nothing ever seems to get done.
    I get sick of having to justify my every request. Its not my job to teach basic medicine to nursing staff. Sometimes you really aught just take a request on faith.

    a decent nurse wouldn't need to ask a question, as they'd have experience and knowledge to not need to question a doctor, HOWEVER nurses have professional accountability, and i know when i qualify it would be a cold day in hell when i'd do something a doctor suggests without knowing why, just too much at stake, been drummed in at Nursing school about knowing WHY we're doing things, having evidence to back it up, just a quick gander on the NMC website tells me the consequences of ie, administering a drug which a doctor prescribed, wrongly- but the nurse got struck off, or not questioning what the staff felt an unnecessary procedure, and the nurse got suspended- just far far far too much at stake
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    is that why the nurses write 'doctors informed' anytime poo goes down then?
    Because they feel it is necessary to tell their 'not seniors' but colleagues..?

    hmm....


    Seems to me that wards full of 'you cn't tell me what to do' nurses are the worst ones because nothing ever seems to get done.
    I get sick of having to justify my every request. Its not my job to teach basic medicine to nursing staff. Sometimes you really aught just take a request on faith.
    if a nurse made a suggestion to you, surely you would question it? you wouldn't just 'put your faith into it' because they're a part of your MDT, you would question 'why'.
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    (Original post by Subcutaneous)
    a decent nurse wouldn't need to ask a question, as they'd have experience and knowledge to not need to question a doctor, HOWEVER nurses have professional accountability, and i know when i qualify it would be a cold day in hell when i'd do something a doctor suggests without knowing why, just too much at stake, been drummed in at Nursing school about knowing WHY we're doing things, having evidence to back it up, just a quick gander on the NMC website tells me the consequences of ie, administering a drug which a doctor prescribed, wrongly- but the nurse got struck off, or not questioning what the staff felt an unnecessary procedure, and the nurse got suspended- just far far far too much at stake
    So i have to waste my time - and precious time that is too, when on call explaining simple stuff to nurses because they weren't listening in their lectures?

    With most its fine, they have the common sense to ask a more senior nurse.
    But i hate it when its a junior nurse looking after a bay (or god forbid a student nurse) who instead of asking their colleagues decides I'm the one they will ask stupid questions of a dozen times an hour.
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    (Original post by smilee172)
    if a nurse made a suggestion to you, surely you would question it? you wouldn't just 'put your faith into it' because they're a part of your MDT, you would question 'why'.
    I like to think I'm smart enough to know why the suggestion i being made.
    If a nurse is asking me to do something its inevitably something banal like a TTO, drug chart, line, review a patient.
    And if i didn't know i would make sure to read up on it so as to patch up that hole in my knowledge. I wouldn't be so dense as to ask the same question several times over the last 3.5 months. (yes i have particular nurses in mind).
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    (Original post by belis)
    As if only nurses get bullied. Junior doctors are alos very likely to be victims of bullying. Both from their own seniors and other staff. In a recent survey 20% of junior doctors reported being bullied at some point in their current post.
    I was being tongue in cheek. I know Drs get bullied too.
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    Meh, I'm just being grumpy cos I've just come off nights where it felt like it was bring your student nurses to work night (and let them play with the bleep system).
    When you're doing 12hr solo night shifts you NEED some sleep.
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    (Original post by No Future)
    I was being tongue in cheek. I know Drs get bullied too.
    Sorry. Momentary sense of humour failure.:o:
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    I like to think I'm smart enough to know why the suggestion i being made.
    If a nurse is asking me to do something its inevitably something banal like a TTO, drug chart, line, review a patient.
    And if i didn't know i would make sure to read up on it so as to patch up that hole in my knowledge. I wouldn't be so dense as to ask the same question several times over the last 3.5 months. (yes i have particular nurses in mind).

    well a question that asks questions without doing their own reading/research..well isn't worth their wage, and shouldn't make you sterotype nurses in that way, if im ever unsure, i'll ask my mentor, the nurse in charge..then the doctor, if its something that can wait till later that day i may do reading up during my lunch but thats only on a 'good' day (ie when i get a lunch) and then once the new thing, for me has been done, i'll reflect, read around and propose an action plan of learning for the future, so don't tar those nurses or even the student nurses with that same brush
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    Meh, I'm just being grumpy cos I've just come off nights where it felt like it was bring your student nurses to work night (and let them play with the bleep system).
    When you're doing 12hr solo night shifts you NEED some sleep.

    atleast you get some sleep on a night shift!
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    why did I not do nursing? - so I can piss into the wind for at least another 2 years *apparently - just a vibe I'm getting from the thread*. Plus I'm Chinese so my parents would have killed me. ;P
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    Meh, I'm just being grumpy cos I've just come off nights where it felt like it was bring your student nurses to work night (and let them play with the bleep system).
    When you're doing 12hr solo night shifts you NEED some sleep.

    atleast you get some sleep on a night shift! :p:

    got 4 night shifts coming up in 2 weeks, am wondering what sort of hallucination i'll have this time, come the 4th night, 2 hours before i go...last time i kept thinking there was someone walking about my bay lol
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    (Original post by Jamie)
    I like to think I'm smart enough to know why the suggestion i being made.
    If a nurse is asking me to do something its inevitably something banal like a TTO, drug chart, line, review a patient.
    And if i didn't know i would make sure to read up on it so as to patch up that hole in my knowledge. I wouldn't be so dense as to ask the same question several times over the last 3.5 months. (yes i have particular nurses in mind).
    okay, well it seems you are generalising specific nurses then! I can assure you we are not all like that - some of us are actually aware of what is going on, what is being asked of us and the reasons behind the requests. don;t think we;are all like that!
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    (Original post by Subcutaneous)
    i quite like the idea of two very different areas of nursing, lol critical care, and gynaecology, but within a more community based setting
    Cool, so maybe being based at a GPs surgery then? Didn't realise that critical care could be more community based though. :p:
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    (Original post by LozengeC)
    Cool, so maybe being based at a GPs surgery then? Didn't realise that critical care could be more community based though. :p:

    no the gynaecology area i quite enjoy in the community, ie a pratice nurse with a specialist in gynae
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    (Original post by Subcutaneous)
    no the gynaecology area i quite enjoy in the community, ie a pratice nurse with a specialist in gynae
    Cool, sounds interesting. Plus then you'd get to work with midwives as well I imagine which would be quite interesting.
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    (Original post by Subcutaneous)
    atleast you get some sleep on a night shift!
    o right and nurses don't get protected breaks..?
    They certainly do in every hospital I've worked.
    In my current place a 2 hour protected break. during the 12hour night shift
 
 
 
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