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    (Original post by Mr_Deeds)
    But if you don't think that gay people should have the right to marry then surely you can't really claim to tolerate the gay community. You can't say "I tolerate you but I don't think that we should have equal rights because you're different." That's dicrimination, direct or indirect and it is hardly the epitome of tolerance. Racist people might "tolerate" other races but they're still racist if they feel the need to distinguish between people on the basis of the colour of their skin. As far as I'm concerned, you're homophobic if you feel the need to judge somebody because of their sexual orientation. It's as smiple as that.
    The point is though, he doesn't think they should stop gay marriages.
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    (Original post by DaneCook)
    That's retarded because it's not the same context. There are black males and females. Homosexual unions are same sex, which is why that in itself is the issue. I don't agree with it. Sue me.
    In other words, you are homophobic. It's no use making a comment like that and then arguing that you're not prejudiced, because you very clearly are.
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    (Original post by Mr_Deeds)
    But if you don't think that gay people should have the right to marry then surely you can't really claim to tolerate the gay community. You can't say "I tolerate you but I don't think that we should have equal rights because you're different." Racist people might "tolerate" other races but they're still racist if they feel the need to distinguish between people on the basis of the colour of their skin. As far as I'm concerned, you're homophobic if you feel the need to judge somebody because of their sexual orientation. It's as smiple as that.
    I largely agree with what you're saying here, however, this case is somewhat different. The OP is saying that while he personally does not agree with gay marriage, he doesn't think his views should determine whether another group enjoys a certain right. In other words, he thinks gay marriage should be legal but he doesn't agree with it - well, that's what I understood from his comments.
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    (Original post by Mr_Deeds)
    But if you don't think that gay people should have the right to marry then surely you can't really claim to tolerate the gay community. You can't say "I tolerate you but I don't think that we should have equal rights because you're different." That's dicrimination, direct or indirect and it is hardly the epitome of tolerance. Racist people might "tolerate" other races but they're still racist if they feel the need to distinguish between people on the basis of the colour of their skin. As far as I'm concerned, you're homophobic if you feel the need to judge somebody because of their sexual orientation. It's as smiple as that.
    :ditto: this. I couldn't agree more.
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    (Original post by DaneCook)
    That's retarded because it's not the same context. There are black males and females. Homosexual unions are same sex, which is why that in itself is the issue. I don't agree with it. Sue me.
    Discrimination is discrimination - whether or not it's based upon the colour of somebody's skin or their sexual orientation is wholly irrelevant and you're clearly deluded if you think otherwise. Racism is defined as "the prejudice that members of one race are intrinsically superior to members of other race" and homophiobia is defined as "prejudice against (fear or dislike of) homosexual people and homosexuality." You're prejudice and that makes you homophobic, deal with it.
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    (Original post by SuperSam_Fantastiche)
    Marriage is a religious union, and religion (a lot of the time) does not agree with homosexuality.
    If that's the case, civil marriages ought to be banned. The state shouldn't regulate a religious matter.
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    (Original post by Flying Cookie)
    You said you didn't agree with gay marriage. That is not homophobic, but the reasons behind it probably are.
    This.
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    (Original post by Newsweek)
    I largely agree with what you're saying here, however, this case is somewhat different. The OP is saying that while he personally does not agree with gay marriage, he doesn't think his views should determine whether another group enjoys a certain right. In other words, he thinks gay marriage should be legal but he doesn't agree with it - well, that's what I understood from his comments.
    That doesn't matter! Geez, two hundred years ago your ancestors might have had slaves and whilst they might have treated them lovely they're just as bad as the people who were importing them. Homophobic people, whether or not they think their opinions should be followed, are homophobic for the opinions they hold themselves. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by DOA)
    is this statement I made homophobic:

    "I may not agree with gay marrage but its not my place to stop someone doing it"

    at which point this man comes over and starts calling me a homophobe

    I didnt think this was homophobic am I wrong?
    That's not homophobic at all.
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    (Original post by SuperSam_Fantastiche)
    Homosexual reporting in.

    Gay marriage should not be allowed.


    Marriage is a religious union, and religion (a lot of the time) does not agree with homosexuality.
    Thats what I mean
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    (Original post by Newsweek)
    If that's the case, civil marriages ought to be banned. The state shouldn't regulate a religious matter.
    I agree. If you're not religious, you shouldn't be getting married. Civil unions are fine between people of either gender, but Marriage, to me, is something entirely different.
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    (Original post by we_are_motherwell)
    You have the right to say whatever you like in a free society, we shouldnt be afraid to offend people.
    No you don't.
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    (Original post by Mr_Deeds)
    That doesn't matter! Geez, two hundred years ago your ancestors might have had slaves and whilst they might have treated them lovely they're just as bad as the people who were importing them. Homophobic people, whether or not they think their opinions should be followed, are homophobic for the opinions they hold themselves. :rolleyes:
    I'm not saying that the OP is not homophobic - he is. However, I'm not going to ostracise him because he has said that he doesn't think his views ought to be enforced at the legislative/judicial level. We live in a liberal society and that's a reasonable position to hold.

    Similarly, a racist person can be against interracial marriage but as long as they don't want their views enforced at the legal level, it's OK. I mean, it's detestable, but ought to be tolerated.
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    (Original post by SuperSam_Fantastiche)

    Marriage is a religious union, and religion (a lot of the time) does not agree with homosexuality.
    Y'see, I would fundamentally disagree with this statement. Marriage is not intrinsically religious. Some people may choose to make it religious, and hold it in a church or place of worship or whatever, but in itself, it is a civil, not religious, institution (eg. I'm not religious, and that doesn't mean I'm never going to get married.)

    Allowing "gay marriage" is simply extending the same civil rights to homosexual couples as heterosexual couples. To believe that they should not be allowed this right IS discriminatory, there's no getting round that fact.

    So given the definition of homophobia as believing in different rights for homosexual and heterosexual couples, then the OP is a homophobe by that definition I'm afraid... Sorry to break up the love fest.
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    (Original post by Mad Vlad)
    No you don't.
    Yes you do. Last time I checked the United Kingdom is a democracy and one of the cornerstones of any democracy is the right to free speech.
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    (Original post by SuperSam_Fantastiche)
    Homosexual reporting in.

    Gay marriage should not be allowed.


    Marriage is a religious union, and religion (a lot of the time) does not agree with homosexuality.
    I agree.

    I personally think that it should be either/or on the use of the word "marriage", though. Heterosexual civil ceremonies should not be termed marriage if homosexual ceremonies cannot. I would be in favour of allowing religious ceremonies for civil partnerships, i.e. Gay marriage, if a particular church is happy to provide such a ceremony, but the church should not be forced to accomodate, as you rightly say, religion tends to frown upon homosexuality.
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    (Original post by we_are_motherwell)
    Yes you do. Last time I checked the United Kingdom is a democracy and one of the cornerstones of any democracy is the right to free speech.
    :rofl: Try again.
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    (Original post by Mad Vlad)
    :rofl: Try again.
    Don't mock the lad Vlad, he's trying real hard :p:
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    (Original post by Newsweek)
    I'm not saying that the OP is not homophobic - he is. However, I'm not going to ostracise him because he has said that he doesn't think his views ought to be enforced at the legislative/judicial level. We live in a liberal society and that's a reasonable position to hold.
    And I respect that, the same right the OP has to hold his views about gay marriage also allow me to love whoever I want. The OP is sensible and I wish that more homophobic people thought like him. But at the end of the day, homophobia, like racism and sexism all boils down to prejudice and the belief that for whatever reason, one type of person is more superior than another. Equality is the opposite of discrimination and it's therefore illogical to suggest that the belief that gay people shouldn't be able to marry/ have a civil partnership or whatever is not homophobic. It clearly is and I think that you're really struggling to equate the whole equality thing with discrimination. Earlier you said: "it doesn't really matter if you're homophobic as long as you respect the right of gay people to enjoy the same rights as everyone else." Complete oxymoron, wtf?
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    It amazes me the number of people who are in denial about what the opinions they hold actually constitute.

    "I don't believe in gay marriage, but I'm not a homophobe"
    "I'm not racist, but I think muslims should adopt our culture"
    etc etc etc.

    Just embrace who you are! If you're homophobic, at least have the balls to admit it.
 
 
 
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