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England: The Evil Empire watch

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  • View Poll Results: What do you think?
    Britain was just like any other European imperialist power
    39.58%
    Britain was particularly evil and particularly destructive
    15.28%
    Britain wasn't as bad as the others
    32.64%
    Other / Don't care
    12.50%

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    (Original post by Delta Usafa)
    Like strapping thousands of Indian rebels to cannons and blowing them to pieces?

    Totally.

    By "get something done" you mean make profits off of exploiting other cultures though, right?
    If you want to comment upon that, you should first read about what the mutineers did to British families living in North West India. Slaughters of women and children abound in almost every city where they rebelled, people literally hacked to pieces, mass executions. That sort of thing.

    They got what they deserved.
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    (Original post by Jaager)
    This guy is an idiot, but i dont think anyone should be an apologist for britains imperialist past, those who defend the british empire etc always say stuff like we brought the railways etc, but they did more than that, they committed more holocausts and genocides than any other european empire.
    The actions of the government (or, rather, governments - it was almost entirely the fault of local officials) that bring Britain's imperial past into apparent disrepute have nothing to do with imperialism.

    Governments abuse their populations - the British state, just like any other, abused its people: not only in the colonies, but in the 'mother country' too. However a double standard certainly exists - there's a rather good Eddie Izzard sketch where he discusses that we are more or less fine with mass killing, so long as people keep it within their own borders. That certainly was the view, at least until very recently, and when discussing historical issues I don't believe the public has really caught up.

    Trying to govern underdeveloped and troublesome regions is not easy. I am by no means excusing it, but in this sort of environment justice and order has a tendency to collapse and governments have a tendency to behave improperly. Rebellions happen, and historically speaking they are almost always suppressed violently. That is true whether the said regions are governed by white Europeans or people with a more local skin-tone.

    (Original post by Lessthanzero)
    What a moron, he says " we had no legal right over these lands".
    It's a bit difficult to suggest there is legal title to anything in places where there was no legal system.
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    What an absolute load of crap.

    Every single thing he says is just pure, deluded rubbish... The bloke is an utter ****!

    Where would America be without the British? More than likely still walking across deserts with wagon trains ululating and killing buffalo.
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    (Original post by cowsgoquack)
    I don't know anything about india so I can't comment, but yes exactly.
    Well that is exactly your problem, my friend. :rolleyes:

    You don't know anything about the history you are trying to discuss and comment upon. Of course life would be better for the elites who were buying the fine British goods, and for those who had employment at that time but not now, but you need to understand the major and deep sociological effects of 200 years of British rule before you draw conclusions along relatively petty and trivial lines!

    Taming the savages may be true for certain African colonies, but I hate having to defend Indian history in this way when people don't realise that the first British government officer who went to India to regulate the East India Company fully prostrated before the local Mughal leader and fought many wars over a great deal of time before the British could obtain a stronghold militarily in India. This makes somewhat a strong point as India was not even a unified country at that time with a single army.

    As for the 'savage' way of life, the ancient Aryan people had developed advanced social methodology in measurements, trade and even justice long before the Romans came to civilise Great Britain with most of the rest of Europe.

    History has definitely not always been as we see things today - so don't assume. :yes:
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    (Original post by DJkG.1)
    Well that is exactly your problem, my friend. :rolleyes:
    I was telling you what the residents of these countries told me.

    I'm not talking about India because I've not been there and I don't know their history or the effect it had on their people.
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    I really hope this is nothing more than a piss-take.
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    (Original post by DJkG.1)
    Well that is exactly your problem, my friend. :rolleyes:
    Sorry I forgot to sign the rep! :p: (it was me)
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    (Original post by L i b)
    It's a bit difficult to suggest there is legal title to anything in places where there was no legal system.
    True for many colonies, not true for a great deal of others.

    Certainly many African civilisations and definitely India under the Mughals had regulated and strictly enforced legal systems.

    It was convenient at the time for the British to dismiss alternative methodologies as unjust so as to not recognise what today we would accept as a perfectly valid legal system, in order to seize control.
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    (Original post by cowsgoquack)
    Sorry I forgot to sign the rep! :p: (it was me)
    Wow the comment was a bit harsh!

    I don't get why you're so angry, I was just engaging in a historical debate - but each to their own I suppose.

    I didn't think you would get so furious at a bit of a debate! :p: It is certainly interesting though!
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    I just read the reviews of the book on Amazon. I'm not sure if the book is either satirical or serious :iiam:
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    (Original post by DJkG.1)
    Certainly many African civilisations and definitely India under the Mughals had regulated and strictly enforced legal systems.
    Ah, and it's quite interesting to see how the British did essentially build themselves up within the previous Indian state before they took over. They didn't just go around stealing property.

    As for the point you seem to be making about the legitimacy of the preceding states in general - that is not a matter of law. Frankly, there's no right to rule, particularly from a state which has only got to where it is by force and power. If another, better state can displace them, then fair game I say.
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    (Original post by mfm89)
    Thats daft.

    Worshiping the Queen, wtf?

    Could make a neat little cartoon on the genocide of native americans and the mass destruction of Vietnam, but that would be degrading. git
    Not to mention Korea and both of the Gulf conficts, and God-only-knows what else.
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    Sherlock Holmes did cocaine, as did Sigmund Freud. Doesn't mean anything. :indiff:
    The Queen/Monarchy is an ornament more than a leader we follow nowadays.
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    (Original post by DJkG.1)
    Wow the comment was a bit harsh!

    I don't get why you're so angry, I was just engaging in a historical debate - but each to their own I suppose.

    I didn't think you would get so furious at a bit of a debate! :p: It is certainly interesting though!
    yeah well I don't like that smilie!

    also lol at crying to the mods
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    (Original post by cowsgoquack)
    yeah well I don't like that smilie!

    also lol at crying to the mods
    Who said I went crying? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

    We should both be mature now and stop this bickering. :o: Your last point on 'the right to rule' was very interesting and had a strong element of the truth, it certainly made me question if the indigenous rulers had a right to enforce their rule through force when a foreigner could do the same; which begs the question is it immoral for the foreigner to do so just because of their ethnic origin?

    It is an interesting topic of debate, just what got me peed off was your cocky know-it-all attitude when posting comments which were always followed with "but I don't actually know anything about XYZ which I just wrote about"!
    ** Would use the roll-eyes smilie but fears you'll get really mad :p: **

    Oh no wait - that post wasn't by you! Sorry, I didn't even realise. :p:
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    :rofl: One of his reasons we're evil on his website is that Elton John was made a knight. :rofl: What a complete ****.
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    (Original post by Kagutsuchi)
    :rofl: One of his reasons we're evil on his website is that Elton John was made a knight. :rofl: What a complete ****.
    Ha, I think it's worse that Rolf Harris was knighted.

    Look at what he did to Stairway to Heaven
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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    The author of this book really is an obnoxious, arrogant idiot.
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    (Original post by Reaver)
    Ha, I think it's worse that Rolf Harris was knighted.

    Look at what he did to Stairway to Heaven
    HAHAHA.... i dont know whether to laugh or cry
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    My god; after looking at some of the interviews with the author of that book I'm not even sure what to say - his 'logic' and theories have more faults than George Bush; according to the author, for example, "the reason for the iraq war is because England invented Iraq".
 
 
 
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