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    (Original post by PaulRevere)
    you use "an" if the next letter is vowel douchebag. (a, e, i, o or u)

    would you say "an house"?
    It's not as simple as that. If the emphasis of the word comes towards the middle or the end of a word begining with "H" it's more correct to say "an" for example "An Historical event" where the empahsis of the word is on the "O" after the "T".

    However if the emphasis of the word is towards the start, it's better to say "A", like in your example "A House" as the emphasis is towards the start of the word.

    To be honest I would say "A horrible place" is more correct than "An horrible place".
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    (Original post by Reaver)
    You are correct

    A well known grammar rule says that we should use an before vowel sounds; for example, an accident, an item, an hour. We use a otherwise: a book, a hotel, a university.

    Notice that we say an hour, not a hour. The choice of a or an is based upon the sound of the word, not the spelling. Hour sounds like it starts with a vowel sound (ow); hence, we use an.

    Following this rule, we would say a historic, not an historic because (for most speakers) historic doesn't start with a vowel sound.

    Words of three or more syllables that start with h are treated differently by some speakers, though. (This may be because of the tendency of some regional accents to drop initial Hs.)
    Its not a grammar rule, merely something people have made up to rationalise their poor grammar
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    you go around calling people "the underclass" and you wonder why you get beaten up?

    The probelm with this country is all the idiots who demonise young kids for simply standing around and occasionally doing something we would all secretly like to do, like intimidating a stuck up tw*t in tight jeans.
    'Tis a good point.

    If you treat 'them' and speak to 'them' like they're part of this so called 'underclass' (and I'm pretty sure thir just normal people from working families who make up the majority of Brits) then of course they're going to treat you like a piece of w**k :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Morlock)
    A,E,I,O,U and H

    "an house" is correct as is "an hotel", "an horrible" etc.

    Jesus H, this is basic English grammar!
    Nope, wrong.
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    Hmmm. Yeah I dunno. It's not perfect obviously. There are countries in Europe without this problem. There are other countries such as France and Germany who have the gang mentality as well though. Overall it's really not a bad place to live.
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    Typical TSR. You make a thread and grammar nazism appears out of nowhere for something so insignificant it's unbelievable.

    Of course there is gang culture in the UK. Kids just want to act like their peers who want to act like who they see on telly. So it's the media's fault, once again.
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    (Original post by hey guysch im kl)
    thats incorrect. "an historical" for example, is correct.
    Admittedly, your reasoning makes a hell of a lot of common sense, and is how most people talk (as do I). However, it is grammatically incorrect. I was merely pointing that out to one of the grammar nazis.
    It's not grammatically incorrect. "An historical" comes from the fact the word is a french loan word and in french the "h" is always silent. Thus, at one point it was pronounced "'istory", hence the "an". Over time, the rule, like many grammar rules, got applied to everything where it made no ******* sense whatsoever. Now, the reverse is happening. Furthermore, as grammar is always changing and English has no formal language committee prescribing rules, the rule of thumb is if it is common use, then it is grammatically correct.

    The rule was and still is, technically, it is only "an" when the "h" is silent.

    It's like when people say you shouldn't end a sentence with a preposition and then go ahead and split phrasal verbs cause they don't understand the difference between a verb+preposition and a phrasal verb.


    (Original post by hey guysch im kl)
    Its not a grammar rule, merely something people have made up to rationalise their poor grammar
    Actually, the "-n" before vowel sounds in English use to be very common. For example, the possessive pronoun pairs, "my-mine" and "thy-thine" worked in the exact same way as "a-an" do. This is why Shakespeare constantly goes on about "mine eyes".
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    (Original post by Onion Terror)
    Okay, here's one explanation: wearing skinny jeans is not an attack on anybody else, and certainly not one that warrants a violent response from anybody. Such arbitrary attacks and violence do not belong in a supposedly first world country such as Britain.

    Now, you go and explain why and where exactly you disagree with me.
    This isn't how debates work. It is up to OP to explain his position and offer a rational defence for it, and then respond to a counter argument, then the second party should repond.
    You haven't given a rational reasoning for your position, or explained it throughly. I think you are trying to alter the discussion by not adhering to basic discussion formalities. This isn't the proper way to do things I am afraid.

    Also why do you defend the other persons prejudice? I think you are prejudice aswell.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    But you would be wrong beacuse I am clever. I tihnk you are a idiot because you are prejudice against people who don't hold your opinions. I think that is idiotic.
    :confused: You can't be clever if you believe we should beat up everybody who doesn't conform to your ideal of clothing.
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    I like how this thread got totally derailed by a debate on the intricacies of English grammar
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    Well op, here's what you need to do:

    stop hanging out in the same places as the low class scum

    socialise with hard working, well to do people

    earn lots of money and move to a posh, high class surburb

    and you will be rid of the dregs of society forever; no more chavs!
    And it isn't just a problem in the UK. The low class 'chav' culture seems to be spreading throughout europe.
    Although I agree the ones in here are amongst the worse.

    It's quite the opposite when you go to some developing countries.

    I went to india and over there the low class look up to the high society and would willingly kneel and polish you shoes for a bit of cash. It felt great.
    Once they realised I was foreign I received even more respect.
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    (Original post by Hylean)
    If the "h" is silent. Guð minn goður, learn your rules correctly, don't just blanket apply them!
    Thanks. Your knowledge of English sounds far superior to mine so I will take your word for it.
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    (Original post by You Failed)
    It's not as simple as that. If the emphasis of the word comes towards the middle or the end of a word begining with "H" it's more correct to say "an" for example "An Historical event" where the empahsis of the word is on the "O" after the "T".

    However if the emphasis of the word is towards the start, it's better to say "A", like in your example "A House" as the emphasis is towards the start of the word.

    To be honest I would say "A horrible place" is more correct than "An horrible place".
    Exactly! Who say 'an horRIble' or ' an horriBLE'? The emphasis/stress is on the 'hor' and the 'h' isn't silent, nor is it a vowel = 'a horrible' surely?
    I wish those who believe it is grammatically correct to say 'an horrible' would explain why instead of just saying it's grammatically correct (links would help too). I don't mind learning new things!
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    (Original post by Onion Terror)
    Right, but please at some point offer some kind of defence for arbitrary violence, I am genuinely interested in what you have to say to defend your position.

    I suspect you are trolling but whatever, just in case you are not.
    Sorry I have social arrangements I must goto, I will reply when I am back.
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    (Original post by 35mm_)
    :confused: You can't be clever if you believe we should beat up everybody who doesn't conform to your ideal of clothing.
    I think you are a troll because your post is full of logical fallacies and non-sequiters. Why do you feel the need to troll? I have reported yout o the moderators.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    I think you are a troll because your post is full of logical fallacies and non-sequiters. Why do you feel the need to troll? I have reported yout o the moderators.
    lol.
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    (Original post by 35mm_)
    You can't be clever if you believe we should beat up everybody who doesn't conform to your ideal of clothing.
    He also supports the BNP. I don't you're looking for logic in the right place.
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    I think the point here is that pretty much everybody who runs into trouble with so called "scum" on the street are those people who go out expecting every group of harmless kids who happen to dress differently from them to be disgusting feral youths armed with machetes and STDs, and sneer at them for being so horridly poor and un-aesthetic. The OP clearly gave himself away as one of these people in his first paragraph.

    The rest of us don't have any problems with them at all, thanks.
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    "A is used before all consonants except silent h (a history, an hour); an was formerly usual before an unaccented syllable beginning with h and is still often seen and heard (an historian, an hotel, an hysterical scene, an hereditary title, an habitual offender). But now that the h in such words is pronounced the distinction has become anomalous and will no doubt disappear in time."
    Fowler's Modern English Usage, Second edition revised by Sir Ernest Gowers.
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    (Original post by burninginme)
    There are very few first world, supossedly civilized countries which have quite the same problem with feral youth randomly attacking people they don't like the look of for superficial reasons than the UK. I'm male, fairly skinny and generally wear tight jeans. In many British towns, the fact you are wearing tight jeans as a male is enough provocation for chavs to shout at/try to intimidat you, and occasionally beat you up if there's enough of them (cowards alone, pack mentality).

    However, I lived in Spain for a year and found significantly less issue with the underclass feeling the need to attack/cause touble with anyone they feel is different from them. Occasionally, you got youths of the underclass in Spain who would stare at you condecendingly with that cocky smirk, but that is as far as it went.

    However, for someone to actually get physically attacked over nothing more than dress was as far as I was aware quite unheard of, and certainly by no means a common occurance.

    However, the sad fact in the UK is that it is quite heard of, and quite possible for someone to get beaten up over superficial things.
    vote the BNP.They'll make tougher sanctions for violence
 
 
 
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