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Are Degree Grades Worth the Same? - Consistency and Dumbing Down watch

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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    guys, get over it... the inverse snobbery on this site is obscene! anyone with their head screwed on knows that a degree from oxford is worth hundreds of times more than one from brookes because:
    A) you have to be a LOT more intelligent to get into Oxford
    B) you have to work a LOT harder when you are there.
    fact.

    most people who argue against this are either slightly delusional or are trying to big-up their own drossy institution... end of.
    Of course, you're completely right. I apologise. It was foolish of me to think academic research on the topic could have possibly stood up to you typing 'fact' at the end of your point. I've been truly humbled.
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    (Original post by 0404343m)
    Of course, you're completely right. I apologise. It was foolish of me to think academic research on the topic could have possibly stood up to you typing 'fact' at the end of your point. I've been truly humbled.
    i'm not too fussed about your "sociology research", and neither are employers. its called common sense!
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    i'm not too fussed about your "sociology research", and neither are employers. its called common sense!
    Who are you? The CBI?
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    Who are you? The CBI?
    nope. just someone saying it how it is.
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    nope. just someone saying it how it is.
    No, you are someone who hasn't got a clue. 5 minutes in any HR department of any large company will tell you what a massive impact sociological and psychological research has had on recruitment practices in the last 20 years.
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    No, you are someone who hasn't got a clue. 5 minutes in any HR department of any large company will tell you what a massive impact sociological and psychological research has had on recruitment practices in the last 20 years.
    meh. any 'sociological and psychological' that seeks to portray oxford brookes as an institution with equivalent academic standards to Oxford is just plain wrong; you do not need an MBa in "advertising management intergrating information technology studies" to tell you that.....
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    meh. any 'sociological and psychological' that seeks to portray oxford brookes as an institution with equivalent academic standards to Oxford is just plain wrong; you do not need an MBa in "advertising management intergrating information technology studies" to tell you that.....
    Seems you are creating a straw man here. You were responding to comments about whether university brand was a key factor in employment decisions - in the grand scheme of things it isn't. Why? Because many large graduate recruiters have been heavily influenced by sociological and psychological research into the benefits of diversity on business resiliance.

    Personally I believe in judging individual departments on how good they are as they have so much autonomy in the delivery of their courses that it makes little sense to go beyond that. In that examination Brookes has many excellent departments, let's take History as a good example. The History department at Brookes has been very highly rated for research over several research assessment exercises and many of its academics are world-leaders. Are we really trying to say that these top-class academics are not capable of delivering a quality of History degree course that is of the highest standard? If we assume that academics are so professionally incompetent that they are beholden solely to the quality of their student intake to assess standards then why allow them to teach at all?
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    Seems you are creating a straw man here. You were responding to comments about whether university brand was a key factor in employment decisions - in the grand scheme of things it isn't. Why? Because many large graduate recruiters have been heavily influenced by sociological and psychological research into the benefits of diversity on business resiliance.

    Personally I believe in judging individual departments on how good they are as they have so much autonomy in the delivery of their courses that it makes little sense to go beyond that. In that examination Brookes has many excellent departments, let's take History as a good example. The History department at Brookes has been very highly rated for research over several research assessment exercises and many of its academics are world-leaders. Are we really trying to say that these top-class academics are not capable of delivering a quality of History degree course that is of the highest standard? If we assume that academics are so professionally incompetent that they are beholden solely to the quality of their student intake to assess standards then why allow them to teach at all?

    to help you out mate, here is my first post. i think you should have read it first...

    guys, get over it... the inverse snobbery on this site is obscene! anyone with their head screwed on knows that a degree from oxford is worth hundreds of times more than one from brookes because:
    A) you have to be a LOT more intelligent to get into Oxford
    B) you have to work a LOT harder when you are there.
    fact.

    most people who argue against this are either slightly delusional or are trying to big-up their own drossy institution... end of.
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    to help you out mate, here is my first post. i think you should have read it first...

    guys, get over it... the inverse snobbery on this site is obscene! anyone with their head screwed on knows that a degree from oxford is worth hundreds of times more than one from brookes because:
    A) you have to be a LOT more intelligent to get into Oxford
    B) you have to work a LOT harder when you are there.
    fact.

    most people who argue against this are either slightly delusional or are trying to big-up their own drossy institution... end of.
    I've read it.

    Twice.

    So what?

    Ever worked with someone from Oxford Brookes? Ever even met someone who went there?
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    I've read it.

    Twice.

    So what?

    Ever worked with someone from Oxford Brookes? Ever even met someone who went there?

    yeah my sisters there now - she says it's a ******* joke.
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    yeah my sisters there now - she says it's a ******* joke.
    Oh well then, that's all the evidence we need. Let's torch the place right now.

    :rolleyes:

    Tbh there are courses at brookes that require ABB to get on. Telling people that that is a huge step down from AAA is really a bit much.
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    yeah my sisters there now - she says it's a ******* joke.
    That's mighty handy to support your argument. Just as handy as that uncle who did recruitment for that magic circle firm that only employed Oxbridge and Durham law grads that happened to come in so useful in your last argument in the absense of any facts to back your statement up. Along with the cast-iron 'its just common sense', how many more relatives have you got in these positions- perhaps a cousin who would tell us all that s/he employs the graduate from the highest university in the league table when they apply? Or a friend of the family who's taught at ex-polys and ancient universities and knows all the students at the former would never pass an exam in the latter? I must say, you are a mighty fine person to know in an argument, with all these connections you seem to have.
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    (Original post by 0404343m)
    That's mighty handy to support your argument. Just as handy as that uncle who did recruitment for that magic circle firm that only employed Oxbridge and Durham law grads that happened to come in so useful in your last argument in the absense of any facts to back your statement up. Along with the cast-iron 'its just common sense', how many more relatives have you got in these positions- perhaps a cousin who would tell us all that s/he employs the graduate from the highest university in the league table when they apply? Or a friend of the family who's taught at ex-polys and ancient universities and knows all the students at the former would never pass an exam in the latter? I must say, you are a mighty fine person to know in an argument, with all these connections you seem to have.

    haha! sister at brookes and a QC godfather.... not really the sultan of Brunei now am i ?!? (though i do think it's sweet of you to big up my connections). but like i said, the inverse snobbery here is hilarious...
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    (Original post by Superhans121)
    haha! sister at brookes and a QC godfather.... not really the sultan of Brunei now am i ?!? (though i do think it's sweet of you to big up my connections). but like i said, the inverse snobbery here is hilarious...
    Did you see that?
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    (Original post by Danny_777)
    It's all quite pleasant. We've had a couple of issues with chavs, but that's hardly unique to Gilesgate. LOL - all the incidents in Mile End I've read about and known people to be in involve quite shocking levels of violence! On one occasion a student crossing the road was beat unconscious with a baseball bat after someone got out of a car and decided to attack him.
    True. It's just the way the place gets highlighted as if sometimes it's the only bad part of London. I've spent time in Bloomsbury and despite being commonly thought of as heaven on here by some people, I have seen a case of GBH near Gordon Square (near University of London Union). Actually what you describe sounds like the same thing that I saw back in 2006. Oddly enough that involved a baseball bat or a metal bar of some sort. As usual people look on with bewilderment and only saw one other person phoning the emergency services.

    I'll have to visit Mile End to see what the fuss is about. I live with my parents during the holidays in a supposedly chav ridden town but I've not felt unsafe very often. The problem with comparing different places for crime is the population density and poverty I'm guessing. Crime is a city problem 99% of the time.

    I grew up in Paddington before you think I grew up living in Mile End by the way. :p:
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    (Original post by T. Hereford)
    Ex-poly. Enough said.
    Didn't realise age is an indicator of worthiness. I'll inform Warwick to close down because Durham is much better. I realise Warwick is not a post-1992 university but during the 70s it had the same stigma as post-1992 universities do now.
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    Never had a problem with anyone in Mile End but a few chavs already at Gilesgate.
    Very friendly, actually (although next door seem to be numpties). I'd describe it has having a few numpties but not dangerous. I bet I'll get a lot more trouble in my home village than Gilesgate. Oh, actually, that reminds me of something. I'll tell you later. Anyway, Gilesgate has nice areas. That 1980s/1990s estate and Gilesgate bank/Claypath - I bet those houses aren't cheap. Bloody busy though.

    But I no longer have long hair, although on days like today I do stand out by wearing a shirt and tie :p: May be different from you, long hair and all.

    (Original post by T. Hereford)
    Face it, prestige / reputation of the university you attend does matter!!!!
    Yes, keep saying it. You've convinced yourself but you won't convince many others until you provide solid evidence. Graduate employment is far too complex to generalise like that and, at the end of the day, I'd think most employers would want a dedicated, experienced

    I'd rather study at a strong department (at what some TSRers will perceive as being a mediocore university) rather than a weak department at a "top ten" university. In the misguided view that the stronger brand name will somehow magically get me the interview (and not skills, experience and academic achivement).

    (Original post by Lord_Farquad)
    No ever since all these ** universities started popping up offering BS courses like broadcasting and media studies a degree means **** ***. Unless of course you attend Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial
    Why did I reject that LSE offer :emo: My life is screwed.

    If you're referring to post-92s, many have been around for 100 - 200 years. Some even predate Durham, UCL and KCL. Many, probably the majority, predate the 60s unis like Warwick, York and Bath.

    Age isn't a measure of quality. Finally, you are aware that "top ten" universities like Warwick offer media/film studies? Durham and considering expanding Queens Campus and offering it also, alongside vocational/professional degrees like architecture. There's a market there are it's a valid academic discipline.

    Have you seen the course content and examinations of these courses at the ex polys?

    (Original post by Superhans121)
    meh. any 'sociological and psychological' that seeks to portray oxford brookes as an institution with equivalent academic standards to Oxford is just plain wrong; you do not need an MBa in "advertising management intergrating information technology studies" to tell you that.....
    Graduate employment to academic standards. But it's far more effective to compare departments rather than universities as a whole. Brighton doesn't have a bad architecture department. Does a Brighton grad have significant poorer prospects compared to a Newcastle, or even Cambridge, graduate? Is a Brookes town planning grad less desirable than a Cambridge Land Economy (the joke degree of the university)? Is there a difference in the intensity of the course? Possibly. Are Brookes' accredited degrees a good standard. From what I know, I certainly think so and the professional bodies must agree.
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    (Original post by cpj1987)
    Yet the MPs, who are clearly more educated on this issue than anyone else, claim that they "found these answers unclear"? What's essentially happening is that the MPs are making a claim about the quality of degrees, being given a very definitive answer by university representatives that proves them wrong, and then stating 'Oh, well, we didn't understand what they were saying'.
    How did you manage to interpret it that way?

    The university representatives are, clearly, question dodging.
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    Oh well then, that's all the evidence we need. Let's torch the place right now.

    :rolleyes:

    Tbh there are courses at brookes that require ABB to get on. Telling people that that is a huge step down from AAA is really a bit much.
    Wait, are you saying there is not a big difference between ABB and AAA? I hope you are joking. There is a MASSIVE difference. Also, by not having AAA you will not be considered by many graduate employers who want 360 points (Big 4 want AAB for certain departments, and virtually every bank wants 360).
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    (Original post by River85)
    Age isn't a measure of quality. Finally, you are aware that "top ten" universities like Warwick offer media/film studies? Durham and considering expanding Queens Campus and offering it also, alongside vocational/professional degrees like architecture. There's a market there are it's a valid academic discipline.
    Ah yes but universities are for job prospects, apparently, so disciplines such as journalism shouldn't be sniffed at. Besides, LSE have accounting and Oxford have financial strategy. Hang on, I'm kidding myself here. Only business driven disciplines such as accounting and finance are allowed because it pays more, gives you an unsociable and family prohibitive hours, and you're stuck behind a desk having a 'stressful' time. Bring on the proletariat!

    I only mention Gilesgate because students, generally and at Durham, have this amusing comfort blanket of their surroundings but are willing to castigate other areas for being unwelcoming. Granted, there will be differences in areas but some criticism is selective and students are not looking at their own turf. As for the best surroundings I'd imagine Regent's Park Business School is the best, at least for London anyway.
 
 
 
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