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    (Original post by Jadel_L)
    The part in bold suggests that he was willing to do it again, it doesn't matter if he meant it as a joke or not.

    I have never said i agree with the punishment, just the fact that he should stand trial over there. I agree that 70 years is a bit much but i think you are wrong in saying that he won't get support for his aspergers. They do know what it is and how to deal with it.
    The problem is the best support for the condition is to stay in a local environment (i.e. somewhere he's used to), even prison in general will be difficult. I agree that I'd of thought America would know how to deal with it once he's there though, screwing up in a case with this much publicity is not in their best interests.
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    (Original post by RK)
    OK, then just make sure you're up on your Canadian law before using TSR then, as if you break Canadian law when using TSR, you risk being sent there if they ask for you, as technically the webiste is in Canada.
    Because TSR and the US Navy and NASA top secret security info are so similar??
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    (Original post by dn013)
    Because TSR and the US Navy and NASA top secret security info are so similar??
    Well, no but the idea follows from what you think that if you do something against Canadia law on TSR, then what you are saying is that the Canadian authorities are well within their rights to demand you be sent over to them for trial.
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    (Original post by benwellsday)
    Don't you expect "special treatment" for people that have mental disabilities?
    No why should they?
    People often use their disability as an excuse for commiting the crime and they get a much softer sentence because of it.
    Take people with ADHD as an example, i read so many cases where people used it as an excuse, and some of these people weren't even diagnosed until after the crime.
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    (Original post by dn013)
    And this guy pleaded guilty so the US has proof of crime, what is your point??
    The problem is how this case has brought to attention how one sided the extradition laws are.

    Also in an interview yesterday his mother said that she was told by the Government "the number one priority was to maintain the srong treaty". Surely the number one priority of the Government at all times is to protect and help it's own people as that was the whole point in Government's being created ni the first place.
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    (Original post by benwellsday)
    The problem is the best support for the condition is to stay in a local environment (i.e. somewhere he's used to), even prison in general will be difficult. I agree that I'd of thought America would know how to deal with it once he's there though, screwing up in a case with this much publicity is not in their best interests.
    Prison is difficult for anyone. And he'l get used to the change.
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    (Original post by RK)
    Well, no but the idea follows from what you think that if you do something against Canadia law on TSR, then what you are saying is that the Canadian authorities are well within their rights to demand you be sent over to them for trial.
    Well if I used TSR to hack into Canada's top security defense information then I would assume it was within Canada's right to extradite me, why should a country not have a right to prosecute someone who is techicnally spying, potentially attacking, by accessing its most secret defense information??

    Look I do not think the guy is going to get 70 years. Everybody in the US has a right to a defense lawyer, if the defense lawyer has a good case that the hacker was not in a mentally stable condition at the time of the crime then I am sure Mckinnon will not get a very harsh sentence. In regards to healthcare, he will receive better healthcare in the States than in the UK, if someone is in prison they have every right to a US hospital - insurance or no insurance.
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    (Original post by dn013)
    Well if I used TSR to hack into Canada's top security defense information then I would assume it was within Canada's right to extradite me, why should a country not have a right to prosecute someone who is techicnally spying, potentially attacking, by accessing its most secret defense information??

    Look I do not think the guy is going to get 70 years. Everybody in the US has a right to a defense lawyer, if the defense lawyer has a good case that the hacker was not in a mentally stable condition at the time of the crime then I am sure Mckinnon will not get a very harsh sentence. In regards to healthcare, he will receive better healthcare in the States than in the UK, if someone is in prison they have every right to a US hospital - insurance or no insurance.
    Because he's really a "terrorist" and one of "the most dangerous men since Hitler" like the US Government have said.
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    (Original post by lewis132)
    The problem is how this case has brought to attention how one sided the extradition laws are.

    Also in an interview yesterday his mother said that she was told by the Government "the number one priority was to maintain the srong treaty". Surely the number one priority of the Government at all times is to protect and help it's own people as that was the whole point in Government's being created ni the first place.
    First of all, he should be extradited because he committed a crime against the United States on US property - ie a US website.

    Secondly if the UK denies extradition, when the guy has already pleaded guilty to the crime, then why should the US ever allow any British criminal to be extradited to the UK from the US??
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    It's such a shame he lost his appeal; the crime was committed on British soil and so should be tried here, also. If anything, he did the US a favour by highlighting how weak their security was and that indeed without him, they wouldn't have spent money on strengthening it. Most of all, I'm disappointed in our government for yet again, letting America get what they want.
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    (Original post by Jadel_L)
    No why should they?
    People often use their disability as an excuse for commiting the crime and they get a much softer sentence because of it.
    Take people with ADHD as an example, i read so many cases where people used it as an excuse, and some of these people weren't even diagnosed until after the crime.
    ADHD is something where there can be different levels of it, and unfortunately there is a lack of understanding of certain psychological/mental disorders which leads to softer or harsher sentences in the wrong cases. But saying people don't deserve "special treatment", which I write in speech marks because really it is equal treatment under the circumstances, is the same as saying all the special care units for prisoners should be abandoned, and all prisoners put under one roof. Given there's a lack of understanding within the legal system of these people (and in the scientific community, hence why they still research these conditions) then you'd expect a stereotypical prisoner to be even less understanding.

    (Original post by Jadel_L)
    Prison is difficult for anyone. And he'l get used to the change.
    I guess it's meant to be difficult, I just meant that even regular prison will mess with his head.
    As for getting used to the change, a regular person gets used to the change. I'd expect someone with moderate to severe Aspergers to become extremely reclusive, not leave the cell out of fear (not particularly fear of being attacked, just fear of social contact), which leads to skipping meals and behaviour that a prison guard may see as purposefully disobedient.
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    (Original post by lewis132)
    Because he's really a "terrorist" and one of "the most dangerous men since Hitler" like the US Government have said.
    I never said I agreed with the US government. But he did commit a serious crime against US national security interest and should be arrested for that - saying that he is the most dangerous man since Hitler is just insulting as it puts down how dangerous Hitler really was.
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    (Original post by dn013)
    First of all, he should be extradited because he committed a crime against the United States on US property - ie a US website.

    Secondly if the UK denies extradition, when the guy has already pleaded guilty to the crime, then why should the US ever allow any British criminal to be extradited to the UK from the US??
    I said that this case has brought attention on the extradition laws are one sided. Before now nobody really kew anything about them. I didn't say that in this particular case he shouldn't be extradited because of one sided laws
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    (Original post by dn013)
    Well if I used TSR to hack into Canada's top security defense information then I would assume it was within Canada's right to extradite me, why should a country not have a right to prosecute someone who is techicnally spying, potentially attacking, by accessing its most secret defense information??

    Look I do not think the guy is going to get 70 years. Everybody in the US has a right to a defense lawyer, if the defense lawyer has a good case that the hacker was not in a mentally stable condition at the time of the crime then I am sure Mckinnon will not get a very harsh sentence. In regards to healthcare, he will receive better healthcare in the States than in the UK, if someone is in prison they have every right to a US hospital - insurance or no insurance.
    Your argument seemed to be that the computers he hacked in to were in the US and so he should be sent to the US.

    Well the servers that host TSR are in Canada, so anything done on TSR is, by a similar argument, done in Canada and subjec to Canadian law if we go with what you were saying. Should Canada have a right to prosecute you if it's found something you do on TSR, from your own home in the UK (or where ever you may be), that Canada wishes to try and procescute you for?
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    (Original post by dn013)
    I never said I agreed with the US government. But he did commit a serious crime against US national security interest and should be arrested for that - saying that he is the most dangerous man since Hitler is just insulting as it puts down how dangerous Hitler really was.
    but surely you can see that alot of people see the hitler comment as an indication as how fair the punishment will be
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    Again, to the people who want him to be extradited, has the US provided any evidence of this damage he caused, or just claimed he caused $700,000 worth of damage (I got that wrong earlier...). Even if some of it is secret, you don't cause $700,000 worth of damage without affecting something fit for release to the media.
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    It's an embarrassment that they want to extradite him, if the government of the worlds largest superpower leaves it's network open by only using default passwords then what the hell has the Pentagon been spending it's billion dollar security budget for computers on? Surely they should be grateful it was just a quirky British person with a UFO interest that got in rather than the intelligence services in China?
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    (Original post by 1721)
    but surely you can see that alot of people see the hitler comment as an indication as how fair the punishment will be
    Yes but they would be wrong because the US government is a different beast to the US legal system.
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    The Americans should pay him to find exploits in their systems instead of just wasting his talent
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    (Original post by RK)
    Your argument seemed to be that the computers he hacked in to were in the US and so he should be sent to the US.

    Well the servers that host TSR are in Canada, so anything done on TSR is, by a similar argument, done in Canada and subjec to Canadian law if we go with what you were saying. Should Canada have a right to prosecute you if it's found something you do on TSR, from your own home in the UK (or where ever you may be), that Canada wishes to try and procescute you for?
    If i was found to be plotting a terrorist attack against Canada then I see no reason why I should not be extradited to Canada. Also if I was found to be hacking into Canada's top secret defense info through TSR, :rofl:, then similarly I would expect to be extradited. What crime against the UK would I have committed?? None, but I committed a crime against Canada.
 
 
 
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