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Why is Wales and Scotland so much more patriotic than England? watch

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    England is pretty patriotic, it's just some people are told not to express it by the PC brigade numpties.

    England gets very patriotic especially during sports events.
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    (Original post by ajp100688)
    No it wasn't, from 1606 to 1707 the Kings of what would become the UK ruled as King of England and King of Scotland, the two countries were in a personal union in the form of the monarch. They were formally united in 1707.
    1603.

    An interesting side fact to this is that the legislation that merged the two crowns and created the United Kingdom also called for Scotland to be renamed 'North Britain' and England to be renamed 'South Britain'. Neither name really took hold but technically it's still British legislation.
    These were two separate events - the Union of the Crowns and the creation of the United Kingdom - over a century apart. The former didn't have any legislative enactment to bring it about - it happened because one monarch died and another took her place. If you're saying the Acts of Union 1707 refer to 'North Britain' or 'South Britain', then you're wrong.

    (Original post by john87)
    this pretty much, you get people asked to take their flags down because they are "offending" minorities, pathetic.
    Been getting your news from the Daily Express, have you?
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    cuz we're speshol :awesome:
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    Their patiotism is heightened because they don't have national autonomy, and remain part of Great Britain. They express their cultural solidarity in the form of patriotism.
    This is true to an extent. They have also in the past been involved in many battles against England which has heightened their sense of a strong national identity which even their young people today can identify with.

    (Original post by wilko1991)
    The general rule of thumb is smaller countries = more patriotic.
    Well smaller countries can often identify with a racial identity more, such as the Gaelic heritage, but that 'rule of thumb' isn't really true.

    According to recent studies, some of the largest countries appear as the most patriotic; USA, India, South Africa, Canada... Granted, Slovenia and Ireland are up there too but your rule doesn't seem to apply very widely.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    These were two separate events - the Union of the Crowns and the creation of the United Kingdom - over a century apart. The former didn't have any legislative enactment to bring it about - it happened because one monarch died and another took her place. If you're saying the Acts of Union 1707 refer to 'North Britain' or 'South Britain', then you're wrong.
    Is there a difference between a personal union and merging of the crowns? One way to look at it is that between 1603 and 1707 being the monarch of England and being the monarch of Scotland were two separate titles, two separate "positions". They just happened to both be filled by the same person. It wasn't until 1707 that both titles were merged into one.

    I think the main reason for England seeming less patriotic is down to the relative population sizes. As Lib says, for a lot of people, England and Britain are almost synonymous. Because England is so much bigger, England is seen as being the main, most important part of Britain (I'll point out that I don't personally agree with this, I don't consider one place to be more important in this context just because more people live there) and Scotland and Wales are just little extra bits.

    This has the effect of increasing welsh and scottish patriotism because they feel like they need to be extra clear they are not England. It has the opposite effect in England because many english people don't feel the need to keep their english identity as separate from their british identity because as far as they (and much of the rest of the world) are concerned they are practically the same thing.
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    Their patiotism is heightened because they don't have national autonomy, and remain part of Great Britain. They express their cultural solidarity in the form of patriotism.
    England doesn't have national autonomy either, it is also part of GB.
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    Scotland isn't very patriotic tbh outside sport and Burns night.
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    (Original post by aeonflux)
    England doesn't have national autonomy either, it is also part of GB.
    It's also worth pointing out that even if Scotland, Wales and England were all independent sovereign states they would still be part of Great Britain as that is the name of the island.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    Is there a difference between a personal union and merging of the crowns? One way to look at it is that between 1603 and 1707 being the monarch of England and being the monarch of Scotland were two separate titles, two separate "positions". They just happened to both be filled by the same person. It wasn't until 1707 that both titles were merged into one.
    Indeed, the term 'Union of the Crowns' - whilst almost universally used - is a misnomer. The Crowns actually remained quite separate - even literally in some cases: Charles I and II were both Crowned in Scotland with the Scottish Crown too.

    That legal technicality didn't stop James VI - who assumed Union would be a foregone conclusion and quickly concluded after his arrival in England. Unfortunately the Parliament of England delayed and eventually it was quietly dropped into a long 'to do' list. But James had still used a lot of his Prerogative powers to effectively create a two-state country: for example, he (and the subsequent Stewart monarchs) took (and used) the style of King of Great Britain even though it was not a title which came with any legal responsibilities.

    (Original post by Rizzletastic)
    Scotland isn't very patriotic tbh outside sport and Burns night.
    I would agree to an extent, but I think the St Andrew's flag is gaining a bit of a resurgence in use. During the Edinburgh Festival for example, loads of them are displayed down the Royal Mile by the local council on temporary flagpoles: that sort of patriotic display just seems a bit... over the top to me.

    Flag-wise the St Andrew's cross is used far more officially than the St George's.
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    I don't know. Maybe because they're smaller than England and when some people think Britain they think England. So they want to get away from that and tell you they're from wherever and proud.
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    (Original post by aeonflux)
    England doesn't have national autonomy either, it is also part of GB.
    But England has always been the dominant component of Great Britain.
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    But England has always been the dominant component of Great Britain.
    Yep I agree with you, but it's obviously wrong to say Scotland and Wales are more patriotic than England because they don't have national autonomy when Enlgland does not have national autonomy either.
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    Because a lot of people in England are immigrants, whereas in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, there aren't any because they suck, so people wouldn't leave their own country to go there.
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    Someone's catching feelings over the internet :awesome:
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    But England has always been the dominant component of Great Britain.
    'Dominant' is not a synonym for 'biggest'.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    'Dominant' is not a synonym for 'biggest'.
    We've had this argument before.
    England is the dominant (or primary) component in Great Britain, in the sense that throughout history it was the invading country which attempted to subjugate its neighbours and absorb them into Great Britain through the Treaty of Union.
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    We've had this argument before.
    England is the dominant (or primary) component in Great Britain, in the sense that throughout history it was the invading country which attempted to subjugate its neighbours and absorb them into Great Britain through the Treaty of Union.
    But Scotland agreed to the Act of Union :confused:

    I'll admit that it could be said England invaded Wales, but only in the same way the Normans invaded England.
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    (Original post by L i b)
    1603.
    Ha you got me there, it was a late night post, I was around about the right date though :p:

    These were two separate events - the Union of the Crowns and the creation of the United Kingdom - over a century apart. The former didn't have any legislative enactment to bring it about - it happened because one monarch died and another took her place. If you're saying the Acts of Union 1707 refer to 'North Britain' or 'South Britain', then you're wrong.
    This I will admit to being wrong on, I didn't realise it was just used by James I, the story I'd always heard was that it was a cast aside relic on the Act of Union, my bad :o:
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    Wales and Scotland wouldn't last 10 minutes without England. They'd get raped by the French. THE FRENCH.

    Scottish people don't even have Haggis anymore. Fail.
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    (Original post by Olivia_Lightbulb)
    We've had this argument before.
    England is the dominant (or primary) component in Great Britain, in the sense that throughout history it was the invading country which attempted to subjugate its neighbours and absorb them into Great Britain through the Treaty of Union.
    Well, we did go through this before - and I believe we established it to be based upon your poor knowledge of history. The Treaty of Union was an act of both Scotland and England - indeed, it had been pushed for by Scotland for more than a century prior and rebuffed by the English Parliament as a threat to the liberties of Englishmen who were afraid that the united Parliament would take upon the more absolutist traditions of their northern neighbours.
 
 
 
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