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Our parents don't let us sleep in the same room together Watch

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    (Original post by Anonymous)

    DUDEE you talk a load of BS! you seriously need to get a life!!


    its only some 16 year old girl wondering why she cant share a bed with her bf of 7months, which in the grand scheme of things isnt very long, and when you're that young most people wait a year or so.
    a parent can enforce whatever rules they like in their house (within reason). and saying your daughter cannot shag under their roof is within reason.
    you need to teach phugoid how to sum up his sentences this short...and how to make this much sense
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    Seriously, I know its a saturday night and there's nothing on TV, but this seems pointless time wasting to me. Really?
    I dare you to try to refute my point, rather than sit here and dismiss it entirely. I dare you.



    Often, its not that the parents don't trust their kid, its that they don't trust OTHER PEOPLE.
    By not trusting your daughter's boyfriend you are not trusting your girlfriend's ability to choose a decent boyfriend. The boyfriend can not go behind the girlfriend's back and get her pregnant when she's not looking or anything . It takes two to tango, and anything that her boyfriend can try to do to get her pregnant can by thwarted by her own maturity. Then again, why would her boyfriend of 16 ever be trying to get her pregnant?

    I still don't see how anyone can argue that its rational or irrational. They're her parents, so what they say goes. Just because they said so. Haven't your parents ever said that to you when you've asked why or why not you have to or can't do something? "Because I said so" is the most irritating response, but they're parents and technically they can tell you what to do while you're living in their house so yeah, deal with it.
    You seem to be confused about what irrationality is. Statements are either rational or irrational. Whether or not they are rational or irrational depends on whether or not they follow from their premises.

    Here's parental logic as you describe it.

    Premise: I am a parent.
    Conclusion: Therefore I am being rational.

    It's a non-sequitur. That is, the conclusion doesn't follow from the premise. That's why it's irrational, you see? It's illogical. It makes zero sense. It's a fallacy. It's wrong. It's ireconciliable with sense.

    I hope you can see that things that parents say CAN be irrational.

    Ignoring it by allowing it to happen in your house? Will you be able to ignore it when you hear the sound effects at night, or empty the trash out of her room? I think not.
    I won't be 'allowing' it to happen. I won't be making a rule which says 'my daughter is allowed to have sex'. Just like there isn't a rule which says that pedestrians are allowed to whistle while they walk. It's not banned, but that doesn't mean it isn't bloody annoying. So yes, my daughter having sex in my house will not be 'allowed', but it will also not be 'banned'. I will simply wish to remain ignorant of it, since I don't like much the idea of it. And if it gets to the stage that I'm hearing it through the wall, then I will pull her up for it, and ask her please not to be so noisy, just like I would pull up that annoying pedestrian walking past my house whistling. It will be an embarrassing thing to request, but I'm sure I can stop ignoring it for a few moments just to request that she cease being so loud. In any case, I will never object to my daughter having sex in my house. Noisy sex, yes, but sex in itself, no.

    You use that word too much. Yawn.
    Yes, and you produce flawed arguments too much, what of it?
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    (Original post by sophisticated)
    One point. No harm is going to come to anyone while they're dancing naked around their bedroom, is it? Fail.
    What harm has ever come from having consensual protected sex with somebody you're in a relationship with? None. Fail.
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    It's seems very unfair that you are being treated differently by your brother, however i don't know what kind of person you are so maybe they trusted him more, although you sound a bit normal to be honest.

    Anyway i think it's good they are not allowing it and try and prove to them that you two can be trusted and then they might see it's ok. I have to say i'm only 17 but if i picture me having a daughter and seeing her in bed with another boy at 16.. eurgh, that wouldn't happen. I think it's different with girls because dads know how some boys can be so they just want to protect you.

    Sit down with them anyway and say that you respect their wishes but you do really like him and nothing would happen. Don't mention your other friends doing it though, that's just slutty.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    I dare you to try to refute my point, rather than sit here and dismiss it entirely. I dare you.





    By not trusting your daughter's boyfriend you are not trusting your girlfriend's ability to choose a decent boyfriend. The boyfriend can not go behind the girlfriend's back and get her pregnant when she's not looking or anything . It takes two to tango, and anything that her boyfriend can try to do to get her pregnant can by thwarted by her own maturity. Then again, why would her boyfriend of 16 ever be trying to get her pregnant?



    You seem to be confused about what irrationality is. Statements are either rational or irrational. Whether or not they are rational or irrational depends on whether or not they follow from their premises.

    Here's parental logic as you describe it.

    Premise: I am a parent.
    Conclusion: Therefore I am being rational.

    It's a non-sequitur. That is, the conclusion doesn't follow from the premise. That's why it's irrational, you see? It's illogical. It makes zero sense. It's a fallacy. It's wrong. It's ireconciliable with sense.

    I hope you can see that things that parents say CAN be irrational.



    I won't be 'allowing' it to happen. I won't be making a rule which says 'my daughter is allowed to have sex'. Just like there isn't a rule which says that pedestrians are allowed to whistle while they walk. It's not banned, but that doesn't mean it isn't bloody annoying. So yes, my daughter having sex in my house will not be 'allowed', but it will also not be 'banned'. I will simply wish to remain ignorant of it, since I don't like much the idea of it. And if it gets to the stage that I'm hearing it through the wall, then I will pull her up for it, and ask her please not to be so noisy, just like I would pull up that annoying pedestrian walking past my house whistling. It will be an embarrassing thing to request, but I'm sure I can stop ignoring it for a few moments just to request that she cease being so loud. In any case, I will never object to my daughter having sex in my house. Noisy sex, yes, but sex in itself, no.



    Yes, and you produce flawed arguments too much, what of it?
    Correction;

    Premise; I am a parent.
    Premise; I own the house you live in and provide for you.
    Conclusion; Therefore I have authority over what happens and what doesnt while you're in my house.

    I can't be bothered to refute your arguments about sandwiches and tools and sex anymore. I already have given my view a million times. You just don't let up.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    What harm has ever come from having consensual protected sex with somebody you're in a relationship with? None. Fail.
    Contraception can fail you know. Fail. Nothing is completely foolproof. You should understand the meaning of the word, cos you've failed plenty of times in this thread.

    I'm so over this topic now....:cool:
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    DUDEE you talk a load of BS! you seriously need to get a life!!
    I'd be glad to accept this if you could provide evidence for it.

    its only some 16 year old girl wondering why she cant share a bed with her bf of 7months, which in the grand scheme of things isnt very long, and when you're that young most people wait a year or so.
    Oh, sorry, I didn't realise that you were in the relationship brigade. Who the **** are you to decide how long somebody should wait before having sex, and how old they should be.

    Also where are your statistics to prove that most young people wait a year or so, because I highly suspect that you're talking out of your arse.

    a parent can enforce whatever rules they like in their house (within reason). and saying your daughter cannot shag under their rule is within reason.
    Something is reasonable based on its premises, not based on its conclusions. Saying that your daughter cannot shag under their roof is the conclusion, not the premise. The premise is... well I don't really know what the premise is, but of all the premises I can think of, none of them are reasonable in so far as logic is concerned.

    By the way, are you really so cowardly as to have to go anonymous to make this post? I suggest that if anybody needs to get a life, it's the guy who's so scared of neg rep, or being refuted, that he has to go anonymous to throw his ad hominems around.
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    Ooh, the posts above mine smell badly of EFFORT.

    http://mohel.dk/grafik/andet/Someone...e_Internet.jpg
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    (Original post by sophisticated)
    Contraception can fail you know. Fail. Nothing is completely foolproof. You should understand the meaning of the word, cos you've failed plenty of times in this thread.

    I'm so over this topic now....:cool:
    Yes, and dancing naked can also lead to severe injuries.

    Nothing is completely safe.

    And contraception will fail regardless of whether you have sex in the house or if you have sex somewhere else, or if you have sex in the house when your parents aren't in. Which brings my back to the ever-recurring point that a ban on sleeping together makes no difference to the chances of pregnancy occurring. Protected or not, it makes no difference. Protected or not, the parents are not to blame for accidents.
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    (Original post by sophisticated)
    Correction;

    Premise; I am a parent.
    Premise; I own the house you live in and provide for you.
    Conclusion; Therefore I have authority over what happens and what doesnt while you're in my house.

    I can't be bothered to refute your arguments about sandwiches and tools and sex anymore. I already have given my view a million times. You just don't let up.
    I have never ever disagreed with the logic you have produces here. All I have said is that the nature of the authority, in this particular case is not based in rationality and is not justifiable. I am perfectly aware that people who own houses have jurisdiction over what happens in them (and you don't need to be a parent for that logic to work, so you can remove your first premise altogether...), but that does not mean that the jurisdiction is JUSTIFIED!!!!!!!!!!
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    (Original post by veronica111)
    I've been with my boyfriend for about 7 and a bit months, we're both 16, but neither of our parents let us sleep in the same bed together. It's really bugging me, is it wrong for us to sleep in the same bed together? I mean it doesn't seem it, 4 of my best friends all have boyfriends and they've been sleeping in the same bed/room together for agess!!! It's so irritating, so do you think my parents should let me? If you do, how do you think I could convince my parents, lol

    And, when my 18 year old brother was my age, he always had his girlfriend stay over, my parents even let her come on holiday with us and stay in the same room as my brother, so why am I treated any differently? :mad:
    Because you are only 16, and a girl.

    Frankly, if I was your parent I would say no as well. The last thing you want to hear as you try to sleep is two randy little teenagers going at it hammer and tongs!
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    I'd be glad to accept this if you could provide evidence for it.



    Oh, sorry, I didn't realise that you were in the relationship brigade. Who the **** are you to decide how long somebody should wait before having sex, and how old they should be.

    Also where are your statistics to prove that most young people wait a year or so, because I highly suspect that you're talking out of your arse.




    Something is reasonable based on its premises, not based on its conclusions. Saying that your daughter cannot shag under their roof is the conclusion, not the premise. The premise is... well I don't really know what the premise is, but of all the premises I can think of, none of them are reasonable in so far as logic is concerned.

    By the way, are you really so cowardly as to have to go anonymous to make this post? I suggest that if anybody needs to get a life, it's the guy who's so scared of neg rep, or being refuted, that he has to go anonymous to throw his ad hominems around.
    Where are your statistics to prove that most parents allow their daughters to jump into bed with their boyfriends as soon as they're 16? Errr nowhere.

    I think all of us are posting based on our experience. Clearly you've had experience of being allowed to share beds etc. I haven't. I wasnt allowed to, and alot of my friends still aren't. Depends on your individual family. A lottery I guess. But until the OP can prove she's trustworthy on this point (which she clearly hasn't done yet, despite your predictions about how mature she could be) then she has to live by her parents rules while she's in their house. Unfortunately its the same for everyone. Everyone is subject to their parents rules in their house. Often the rules are just different.

    Now please go and get a hobby or something. Knitting? Anything. Perhapsn you could conduct a survey on how many people were allowed to share beds with their bf/gf at 16. Do a poll on this forum. Then we could get some actual results/statistics to base our arguments on. Until then, I think you should stfu.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    I have never ever disagreed with the logic you have produces here. All I have said is that the nature of the authority, in this particular case is not based in rationality and is not justifiable. I am perfectly aware that people who own houses have jurisdiction over what happens in them (and you don't need to be a parent for that logic to work, so you can remove your first premise altogether...), but that does not mean that the jurisdiction is JUSTIFIED!!!!!!!!!!
    Justified? Just keep throwing that word around. Its not getting you anywhere is it? I for one can think of plenty of justifications for not allowing the OP to have a sex fest under her parents roof. One could be because they don't want to hear it. That would be good enough for me, and I'd be happy to give that reason to my daughter. If she didn't like it, then tough ****, cos I'm her parent, and aforementioned argument; I own the house, so what I say goes. What other reason can a parent have for inflicting rules like curfews, and reasons why teenagers should help around the house? If parents didn't have this kind of right to enforce rules, then kids would go awol. And the OP could be pregnant, for one. Hahahaha.
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    (Original post by sophisticated)
    Where are your statistics to prove that most parents allow their daughters to jump into bed with their boyfriends as soon as they're 16? Errr nowhere.
    If I had ever made that statement, this would be a relevant point. I have never made that statement.

    I agree, most parents don't let their daughters have sex as soon as they're 16. Whether or not they're right to do that is another question, and I believe the answer is no, they are not.

    I think all of us are posting based on our experience. Clearly you've had experience of being allowed to share beds etc. I haven't. I wasnt allowed to, and alot of my friends still aren't. Depends on your individual family. A lottery I guess. But until the OP can prove she's trustworthy on this point (which she clearly hasn't done yet, despite your predictions about how mature she could be) then she has to live by her parents rules while she's in their house. Unfortunately its the same for everyone. Everyone is subject to their parents rules in their house. Often the rules are just different.
    I haven't actually made a judgment about the OPs maturity. She could be immature, she could be mature. I don't know. That's why I'm not making any judgments. You, however, have decided that she must be immature, simply because she's 16, and that this means her parents are justified. This is an assumption that I'm not stupid enough to make, and I also haven't made the opposite assumption. All I've said is that a parent is not inherently right, and that a lot of time, in these cases, the parents are being irrational.

    Also, it's nothing to do with opinion or experience. I haven't tried to speak my opinion. I have only spoken about rationality, and shown, throw logic, that it is irrational for a parent to believe that stopping their kids from sleeping in the same bed as their partners does any good whatsoever.

    Now please go and get a hobby or something. Knitting? Anything. Perhapsn you could conduct a survey on how many people were allowed to share beds with their bf/gf at 16. Do a poll on this forum. Then we could get some actual results/statistics to base our arguments on. Until then, I think you should stfu.
    LOL. I don't need those statistics because I never made those statements, and I also don't need to make that statement to make the point that I have been making.

    Attempting to put words in my mouth is never a good strategy. It's nothing but another failure to communicate rationally.
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    op, if you were my daughter i too would say no for all the reasons said in the thread.

    http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x...stent-fail.jpg
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    I'd be glad to accept this if you could provide evidence for it.



    Oh, sorry, I didn't realise that you were in the relationship brigade. Who the **** are you to decide how long somebody should wait before having sex, and how old they should be.

    Also where are your statistics to prove that most young people wait a year or so, because I highly suspect that you're talking out of your arse.



    Something is reasonable based on its premises, not based on its conclusions. Saying that your daughter cannot shag under their roof is the conclusion, not the premise. The premise is... well I don't really know what the premise is, but of all the premises I can think of, none of them are reasonable in so far as logic is concerned.

    By the way, are you really so cowardly as to have to go anonymous to make this post? I suggest that if anybody needs to get a life, it's the guy who's so scared of neg rep, or being refuted, that he has to go anonymous to throw his ad hominems around.
    i posted anonymous because you seem the kind of person that will go out of your way to dispute anything someone says that you dont agree with, and i dont want you on my back all the time.

    my 'evidence' for saying you dont have a life it this thread, disputing everyone and arguing with essays.
    i didnt realise this was some sort of law case where you have to have premises that make a logical conclusion, but if you want one here it is:

    a parent is your legal guardian until you are 18
    you are not 18, therefore your parents are still your guardian

    conclusion: parents, being your legal guardian, can still enforce rules, as long as they are still being given money to provide a roof over your head.

    my arse is also quite happy talking to you, as the things that come out of it are better than what comes out of your mouth.
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    (Original post by sophisticated)
    Justified? Just keep throwing that word around. Its not getting you anywhere is it? I for one can think of plenty of justifications for not allowing the OP to have a sex fest under her parents roof. One could be because they don't want to hear it. That would be good enough for me, and I'd be happy to give that reason to my daughter. If she didn't like it, then tough ****, cos I'm her parent, and aforementioned argument; I own the house, so what I say goes. What other reason can a parent have for inflicting rules like curfews, and reasons why teenagers should help around the house? If parents didn't have this kind of right to enforce rules, then kids would go awol. And the OP could be pregnant, for one. Hahahaha.
    It's just nonsense after nonsense after nonsense with you, isn't it?

    Who are you to assume that the OP would be pregnant already? Seriously, where is your back up for that? What basis do you have for that? Nothing.

    And again, I never said that parents shouldn't have the right to impose rules. All I've ever said (and you seem to be failing to grasp this rather miserably) is that some rules imposed by parents are not justified. That's it. That's all I've said all night, and you've been taking it round in circles by refusing to understand it.

    Also, why does sex have to be noisy? It doesn't. I have had sex probably 5 times a week for the past year and a half and not once has anybody living in my household had to put up with any noise. It doesn't take much to soundproof a room, and even without soundproofing, it doesn't take much to keep your sex discrete.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    If I had ever made that statement, this would be a relevant point. I have never made that statement.

    I agree, most parents don't let their daughters have sex as soon as they're 16. Whether or not they're right to do that is another question, and I believe the answer is no, they are not.



    I haven't actually made a judgment about the OPs maturity. She could be immature, she could be mature. I don't know. That's why I'm not making any judgments. You, however, have decided that she must be immature, simply because she's 16, and that this means her parents are justified. This is an assumption that I'm not stupid enough to make, and I also haven't made the opposite assumption. All I've said is that a parent is not inherently right, and that a lot of time, in these cases, the parents are being irrational.

    Also, it's nothing to do with opinion or experience. I haven't tried to speak my opinion. I have only spoken about rationality, and shown, throw logic, that it is irrational for a parent to believe that stopping their kids from sleeping in the same bed as their partners does any good whatsoever.



    LOL. I don't need those statistics because I never made those statements, and I also don't need to make that statement to make the point that I have been making.

    Attempting to put words in my mouth is never a good strategy. It's nothing but another failure to communicate rationally.
    Go through this thread, and tot up how many people have agreed with OP that Mumsy and Daddy are being unfair by not letting her sleep in the same bed as her boyfriend, and then also count how many people have agreed that the parents are being perfectly fair because they've had the same rules from their parents so the OP should just put up and shut up until she's gained their trust or until the parents see fit.

    I think I'll make my point that way. I'm utterly bored of you now. And I can't believe your neg rep taking this as a "serious debate". Its H&R ffs. We're arguing over a 16 year old's sleeping arrangements. I said this ages ago, but I'm gonna go get back to my life now. Maybe you should try and find one of your own too. And also, if your gf doesn't make noise when you have sex, then I think you need to take a look at your own issues and stop arguing so much with me on a forum. I suggest www.lovehoney.co.uk cos clearly you ain't doing something right hahahaha.
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    (Original post by Phugoid)
    It's just nonsense after nonsense after nonsense with you, isn't it?

    Who are you to assume that the OP would be pregnant already? Seriously, where is your back up for that? What basis do you have for that? Nothing.

    And again, I never said that parents shouldn't have the right to impose rules. All I've ever said (and you seem to be failing to grasp this rather miserably) is that some rules imposed by parents are not justified. That's it. That's all I've said all night, and you've been taking it round in circles by refusing to understand it.

    Also, why does sex have to be noisy? It doesn't. I have had sex probably 5 times a week for the past year and a half and not once has anybody living in my household had to put up with any noise. It doesn't take much to soundproof a room, and even without soundproofing, it doesn't take much to keep your sex discrete.
    oo get you, 5 times eh? its quality not quantity, and you're obviously not giving quality if you cant make a girl be noisy :woo:
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    (Original post by Polly1101)
    i posted anonymous because you seem the kind of person that will go out of your way to dispute anything someone says that you dont agree with, and i dont want you on my back all the time.
    If I have evidence, and the other person doesn't, then yes, I will go out of my way to dispute their nonsense.

    my 'evidence' for saying you dont have a life it this thread, disputing everyone and arguing with essays.
    i didnt realise this was some sort of law case where you have to have premises that make a logical conclusion, but if you want one here it is:
    It isn't a law case, but as with anything, it involves either rational statements or irrational statements, and I simply refuse to have the OP bombarded by idiots making a mockery of her situation using irrational arguments.

    a parent is your legal guardian until you are 18
    you are not 18, therefore your parents are still your guardian
    First of all, I, personally, haven't been 18 for quite some time now, and I never had sex until I was 18 through my own personal choice. So, this argument doesn't apply to me personally. You said 'you', so just letting you know that I'm not 16 or whatever.

    Secondly, a 'guardian' does not mean 'somebody who is in control of your genitals'. It means somebody who provides financial and other support for you. When it comes to decision-making and responsibility, you are on your own from the age of 16. That's the age you can have sex, that's the age you can start your career, that's the age you can leave school, that's the age you can be legally prosecuted as an individual. So the parent, after 16, has absolutely no jurisdiction over what you choose to do with your genitals. K?

    conclusion: parents, being your legal guardian, can still enforce rules, as long as they are still being given money to provide a roof over your head.
    Yes, they can. But whether or not their rules are justified is a different matter altogether. I don't think that they are justified in this particular case.

    Who are all the idiots on this thread who think that I think that parents can't make rules.

    OF COURSE THEY CAN. I'm not denying that, you fool. All I'm saying is, they are NOT. ALWAYS. JUSTIFIED.

    my arse is also quite happy talking to you, as the things that come out of it are better than what comes out of your mouth.
    Well I'm glad you'd rather eat your own **** than have me spit in your face. Saves me a lot of effort.
 
 
 
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