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Do you belive humans are significantly affecting global warming? watch

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    but some super villan might put a giant reflecting thing in the middle of the hole, where it could hover relatively upeturbed... and then concentrate the sun on to it via various large mirrors, and then hold the world to ransom... but apart from that it's pretty good.

    Assuming we survive another million years, we'd be ridiculously advanced, and probably live in crazy things which move, and we would drag the earth behind us as an example to other less advanced races of how not to do it... either that or kill them.

    Pffft. My house is surrounded by hundreds of other houses on each front.
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    its an ingenious idea Jonaton, but how do you propose we do it, if u suggest nuclear weapons , im pushin the button
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    Me being god in the future might be usefull for the whole redesign of the earth thing... but i think it would be better if JSM gets to push the button, and instead of destruction upon impact, everyone gets a beautiful sense of elation, and i turn the world into a doughnut, the most utopian of forms...

    p.s. unless i think of something better i might also chose that moment for the whole sun earth and torent of water thing too.
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    all u manz r neekiezzzzz!zzZZz!
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    (Original post by Spc_K)
    where's the green party when you need it?
    I'm right here

    And even greenpeace and friends of the earth don't pretend that humans are solely responsible for climate change.

    I've looked at the evidence, particaularly the relationship between CO2 levels and sea levels over geological time (geology graduate) and I don't think that climate change is "the end of the world" but upsetting the balance of the carbon cycle is very likely to have an impact on the climate...the sea level for the last million years or so has been abnormally low - if it rises and the temperature changes (changing the balance of energy in the system and making the climate globally far more volatile and less predictable) the world won't end, but it will cost a massive amount of money and could damage civilisation and what balance there is in society far more than I am willing to risk.

    If you don't beleive in the relationship between CO2 and temperature thats fine with me - the evidence is indirect and the direct relationship remains unproven and in any system as complex as the planet's climate it's going to involve far more work and computing power than is currently available.

    But at the same time I cannot accept the apparant ropey-ness of the evidence in favour of climate change as an excuse that makes wasting energy and non-renewable resources OK. I save energy because I believe it makes a difference - but also because it saves me money...anyone who prefers to stick with inefficient systems and uses "global warming is a myth" as an excuse is cutting off their own nose to spite their face...and therefore pretty much contemptable.

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    (Original post by Pencil Queen)
    I cannot accept the apparant ropey-ness of the evidence in favour of climate change as an excuse that makes wasting energy and non-renewable resources OK.
    I don't know many that use climate change as an excuse to waste energy or as an argument against looking for renewable energy sources. (Exceptions would be owners of the american built V16, 16 litre, 1000lb/ft troque, cadillacs.. but i'm sure even they would like an even more powerful vehicle with a cold fusion propulsion system.)

    Oil will run out, and we want ridiculous amounts of cheap energy (if only to power enormous sound sytems, instantaneously boiling kettles and stupidly fast computers -in that order of priority) so we have to find reliable sources that will not run out... i believe in the sun for short term personally.
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    (Original post by Spc_K)
    I don't know many that use climate change as an excuse to waste energy or as an argument against looking for renewable energy sources. (Exceptions would be owners of the american built V16, 16 litre, 1000lb/ft troque, cadillacs)

    Oil will run out, and we want ridiculous amounts of cheap energy (if only to power enormous sound sytems, instantaneously boiling kettles and stupidly fast computers -in that order of priority) so we have to find reliable sources that will not run out... i believe in the sun for short term personally.
    Although most people would deny it there is a definate undercurrent to the arguement against global warming (mentioning no names :cough: Esso :cough: ).

    I don't think it's something that is commonly believed but at the same time there are people and companies out there trading off these excuses and general distrust of the evidence.

    And I do think argueing about the evidence is counterproductive when there are measures we could be taking now which would benefit the entire planet whether or not the fear of climate change is justified.
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    Hell yes, even i would use a persons ignorance to my own gain especially if i had no face, just a name that didn't care...

    The fact is there's loads of people misleading others in both directions, for their own ends (even if their end is a better world), one direction is however more worthy, and the same directions' statments are also more generally belived.

    I'd be interested to hear what measures could be taken beyond economising energy. Most significant things that could be done are down to money, where i'm afraid, renewable energy tends to lose... and i'm totally against wind farms btw, but i think just about everyone knows they're a pile of crap, especially if they've played sim city. The other measures are down to government, and they've been allies of oil since US illegalise ganja as an excuse to prevent hemp production
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    Well, yeah. Humans as a whole are responsible, as animals couldn't build all these factories, weapons etc.
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    Of course humans are partially affecting global warming. Think about the greenhouse gases that are given off as a result of modern day technology (cars etc). This must have some effect.
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    As i said before just about every credible statistic puts this effect at less than 0.5% of greenhouse effect, so it's an effect, but by no means significant. especially seeing global warming isn't just about greenhouse effect.
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    (Original post by Spc_K)
    As i said before just about every credible statistic puts this effect at less than 0.5% of greenhouse effect, so it's an effect, but by no means significant. especially seeing global warming isn't just about greenhouse effect.
    The problem is most of those studies look at CO2 output over a year - but the CO2 increase has been happening ever since the industrial revolution and because we've been increasing CO2 production but not Carbon storage (through preserving animal/plant remains) the residence time of carbon in the atmosphere has increased dramatically and so the effect is cumulative and outside of the natural carbon cycle.

    Although it's only a small % of the CO2 output annually the % in the atmosphere due to the disruption to the carbon cycle (and the removal of natural buffers like forests) is far far greater.

    Before we started burning fossil fuels and making concrete in great quantities there was a balance - the amount of carbon released (through "natural" causes) equalled the amount stored away (in limestones and peat bogs and other reservoirs). We've upset that balance in so many ways and for so long and in ever greater quantities that the impact on CO2 levels in the atmosphere is likely to be quite severe.

    CO2 always has made up a tiny amount of the atmosphere but it's influence of it's concentration on the planets carbon is huge. Tiny "insignificant" changes could result in substantial changes to climate.

    And then of course there is the snowball effect caused by methane deposits - sea temperature rises and the frozen methane on the sea bed boils to the surface. Methane as a greenhouse gas is 10* more effective than CO2 (although it's residency time is much smaller and after 10 yrs it will decompose into the less harmful CO2) so sea temperatures rise some more thawing out even more methane etc etc etc. This process has already begun, our only hope is to slow down the process to a level at which we can adapt.
 
 
 
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