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Injective and Surjective

If g o f is surjective then f is surjective. Can someone help me with this, I don;t know where to start to prove this result. Thanks!
Reply 1
I have managed to come up with a proof, but not sure if it's right.
It starts like this:
let f: A-->B and g:B--C, then gf:A-->C

since gf is surjective we know that for each c in C, there is an element a in A such that gf(a)=c
Original post by Mr.A
I have managed to come up with a proof, but not sure if it's right.
It starts like this:
let f: A-->B and g:B--C, then gf:A-->C

since gf is surjective we know that for each c in C, there is an element a in A such that gf(a)=c


Thanks! If you dont mind me asking one more question :tongue:. If g o f is surjective then g is surjective. is this false or true? I can't seem to be able to prove it to be true. But I'm not sure what counter example I can give.
Reply 3
Yes, if f:ABf: A \to B and g:BCg: B \to C are functions then gf:ACg \circ f: A \to C is surjective only if g is surjective.
Original post by Zhen Lin
Yes, if f:ABf: A \to B and g:BCg: B \to C are functions then gf:ACg \circ f: A \to C is surjective only if g is surjective.


Thanks, so does that mean f and g have to both be surjective?
Reply 5
No, f does not need to be surjective.
See if you can find an example where g o f is surjective, g is surjective but f is not.
Original post by Zhen Lin
No, f does not need to be surjective.


Ok, suppose g: A -> B f: B -> C
Iff g o f is surjective then
Then g o f(A)=g(f(a))=g(B)=C
For each element of C there is at least one element of B so g is surjective.
This seems rather short and wrong:tongue:. But I just want to know if its ok or am I going the wrong direction with this?
Original post by IrrationalNumber
See if you can find an example where g o f is surjective, g is surjective but f is not.


The example of g(x)=x^2 and f(x)= squareroot of x. Is that an acceptable example?
Original post by JBKProductions
The example of g(x)=x^2 and f(x)= squareroot of x. Is that an acceptable example?


Well, now we need to be very careful! What are the domains of f and g in your example?

EDIT: actually, what are the domains and ranges? Your example will sink or swim depending on the answer to those two questions.
(edited 13 years ago)
Original post by ljfrugn
Well, now we need to be very careful! What are the domains of f and g in your example?

EDIT: actually, what are the domains and ranges? Your example will sink or swim depending on the answer to those two questions.


for g its g: R -> R. Just to be clear since I can't write it like the standard notation R is the set of real numbers.
f: R+ ->R. R+ is just positive real numbers.
Original post by JBKProductions
for g its g: R -> R. Just to be clear since I can't write it like the standard notation R is the set of real numbers.
f: R+ ->R. R+ is just positive real numbers.


In that case, no. gg isn't surjective, because it doesn't hit everything in R. Try changing the ranges/domains and you should (assuming I'm not half asleep) be left with a working example...

P.S. Does anyone know how to do blackboard bold on the forum LaTeX? The usual mathbb doesn't work...
Original post by ljfrugn
In that case, no. gg isn't surjective, because it doesn't hit everything in R. Try changing the ranges/domains and you should (assuming I'm not half asleep) be left with a working example...

P.S. Does anyone know how to do blackboard bold on the forum LaTeX? The usual mathbb doesn't work...


Ah ok so if the range was positive real numbers and domain is the set of all real numbers, would that be ok?
Original post by JBKProductions
Ah ok so if the range was positive real numbers and domain is the set of all real numbers, would that be ok?


I think so!

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