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Why are the British so appalingly bad at foreign languages?
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Hold on, firstly, I'm British and I speak English (duh) French and German, with basic knowledge of Arabic, Spanish and Urdu. When I go abroad I do my best to speak the languages I know (e.g. I spoke what French I could in Morocco, German when I went there and to Switzerland and so on).
Secondly, we don't all scorn those who can't speak English. Personally, for me when a foreigner is able to speak English my respect for them soars through the roof (assuming there's a roof above us), as I appreciate how many years of training and dedication it takes to learn a language to a fluent level. Two of my teachers are foreign, speak not fluent but strong English, and as such my respect for them is very high. To me, learning a language is a sign of cultural appreciation, lack of arrogance, hard work and often talent.
Admittedly, however, there is a problem with a significant proportion of Brits, especially those of the current generation. They don't seem to understand that 1) languages are essential if you want to fully integrate with / work / do business with another country, 2) they provide many skills and improve your understanding of English too and 3) there is a stereotype which we need to fight off. People from other countries assume me to be utterly hopeless at languages, and so when they attempt to speak in broken English, the smile on their face when I can respond in German/French is brilliant
Rant over, take what you will from this post - I don't really know if there was much point in it to be honest.
Oh, and others have been correcting in saying that for the majority of Brits, learning a language hasn't been even a remote priority, as English is just so widely spoken, especially in the West.
Secondly, we don't all scorn those who can't speak English. Personally, for me when a foreigner is able to speak English my respect for them soars through the roof (assuming there's a roof above us), as I appreciate how many years of training and dedication it takes to learn a language to a fluent level. Two of my teachers are foreign, speak not fluent but strong English, and as such my respect for them is very high. To me, learning a language is a sign of cultural appreciation, lack of arrogance, hard work and often talent.
Admittedly, however, there is a problem with a significant proportion of Brits, especially those of the current generation. They don't seem to understand that 1) languages are essential if you want to fully integrate with / work / do business with another country, 2) they provide many skills and improve your understanding of English too and 3) there is a stereotype which we need to fight off. People from other countries assume me to be utterly hopeless at languages, and so when they attempt to speak in broken English, the smile on their face when I can respond in German/French is brilliant
Rant over, take what you will from this post - I don't really know if there was much point in it to be honest.
Oh, and others have been correcting in saying that for the majority of Brits, learning a language hasn't been even a remote priority, as English is just so widely spoken, especially in the West.
Original post by abc:)
So what do you think causes someone to be appallingly bad at a language then?
Difficulty of learning languages (particularly ones with stark differences to English, for example, Japanese), bad teaching, etc.
Our education system fails spectacularly at teaching foreign languages. According to all the qualifications I have, I am fluent or near-fluent in French. On holiday in the Shetland Islands, my friend (who holds a similar level of qualification in French) and I came across a couple of French tourists who got off a boat between two of the islands and didn't appear to know when the bus would arrive to take them to the port on the north of that island to go to another island.
We managed to ascertain what bus they wanted, but neither of us could say 'The bus to Gutcher is at 4.15pm'. We managed to splutter our way through the French equivalent of 'Gutcher bus arrive [point to time here]' ... but that was it. It apparently wasn't good enough for them to understand, because they got back on the boat and returned to the other island!
So what went wrong? We both have good GCSEs in French, plus additional qualifications, all to a good standard. We could have gone on for ages about our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what subjects we liked at school, where we last went on holiday ... but neither of us could compose 'The bus to wherever arrives at whatever time'.
It's because we weren't taught this. We were taught to pass French exams on our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what we like at school, our holidays. We were taught that very well and we do very well in that area, but none of what we learnt is of any practical application apart from possibly our names.
We managed to ascertain what bus they wanted, but neither of us could say 'The bus to Gutcher is at 4.15pm'. We managed to splutter our way through the French equivalent of 'Gutcher bus arrive [point to time here]' ... but that was it. It apparently wasn't good enough for them to understand, because they got back on the boat and returned to the other island!
So what went wrong? We both have good GCSEs in French, plus additional qualifications, all to a good standard. We could have gone on for ages about our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what subjects we liked at school, where we last went on holiday ... but neither of us could compose 'The bus to wherever arrives at whatever time'.
It's because we weren't taught this. We were taught to pass French exams on our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what we like at school, our holidays. We were taught that very well and we do very well in that area, but none of what we learnt is of any practical application apart from possibly our names.
Original post by TheSownRose
It's because we weren't taught this. We were taught to pass French exams on our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what we like at school, our holidays. We were taught that very well and we do very well in that area, but none of what we learnt is of any practical application apart from possibly our names.
It's because we weren't taught this. We were taught to pass French exams on our names, when we were born, the town we live in, what we like at school, our holidays. We were taught that very well and we do very well in that area, but none of what we learnt is of any practical application apart from possibly our names.
Agreed, good post.
Original post by Wave
Because English is the lingua franca. Also it is the main language of everywhere important. All other languages are either just spoken in the parent country or the parent country + some tinpot African/South American/Middle-Eastern dictatorships.
EDIT: Omg why is this negged? It is totally true. Name one exception I challenge you.
EDIT: Omg why is this negged? It is totally true. Name one exception I challenge you.
China, Russia, Brazil, Japan.
All better and more important economies than the UK.
sozbro
I agree. I speak 4 languages and people seem shocked...
Firstly, I think it's because English has become the Lingua Franca so people don't see the point in learning a foreign language if everyone wants to speak English.
I also think it's because of the way languages are taught in schools. Personally, I love languages, but French class at school doesn't exactly leave me jumping for joy. Plus, in other countries there is so much American and British influence and I've noticed that foreign teenagers listen to English language pop music, etc.
I also think it's because of the way languages are taught in schools. Personally, I love languages, but French class at school doesn't exactly leave me jumping for joy. Plus, in other countries there is so much American and British influence and I've noticed that foreign teenagers listen to English language pop music, etc.
Original post by im so academic
How?
Are people in this thread trying to say that if you learn a language as a teenager, you will never become fluent in it?
Are people in this thread trying to say that if you learn a language as a teenager, you will never become fluent in it?
He learnt two when he was younger, that ten already includes English and Dutch, and the other six were a requirement on top of that.
Well, for a start, in many other countries of the world, a foreign language (often English) is learnt from the very beginning of school i.e. like our Reception years starting French or Spanish.
The Government's policy on foreign languages is not a 'pro' one, unlike lots of Europe and Asia.
The Government's policy on foreign languages is not a 'pro' one, unlike lots of Europe and Asia.
Because you live on an island?
The education system is certainly one reason. But in other ways it maybe a good thing though that you're free to do subjects you're comfortable with. Here kids are forced to learn English from like 5-yr-old on and arent allowed to drop till they go to university. It's just a nuisance for some naturally maths-minded people who aren't good at it!
And English is a perhaps the easiest language out there, so for the sake of communication alone there is less need to bother learning a more difficult alternative.
The education system is certainly one reason. But in other ways it maybe a good thing though that you're free to do subjects you're comfortable with. Here kids are forced to learn English from like 5-yr-old on and arent allowed to drop till they go to university. It's just a nuisance for some naturally maths-minded people who aren't good at it!
And English is a perhaps the easiest language out there, so for the sake of communication alone there is less need to bother learning a more difficult alternative.
It's also because our school system simply doesn't teach foreign languages from nearly as young an age as most of the rest of the world, which is kind of retarded. You'd think something like Spanish or Mandarin would be taught from a young age (as they're both spoken by a ridiculous number of people worldwide).
(edited 12 years ago)
For most people it's not that useful. Is it more useful than not knowing another language? Of course. Is it more useful than something else you could learn instead, using the time you'd have spent on learning a language? Apparantly not, in the eyes of many. In a world where English is the language of business, it's not automatically a bad decision to prioritise the learning of other things.
Original post by DH-Biker
Original post by DH-Biker
He learnt two when he was younger, that ten already includes English and Dutch, and the other six were a requirement on top of that.
What languages does he know altogether?
How on earth did he learn all of them?
Original post by Rai
China, Russia, Brazil, Japan.
All better and more important economies than the UK.
sozbro
All better and more important economies than the UK.
sozbro
Maybe Brazil, But Chinese is spoken in China (parent country) and some unimportant indonesian islands, Russian is spoken in Russia (parent country) and some backwards eastern european countries, and Japanese is spoken in only Japan. And when I say "spoken" I mean it's the main language of that country. So what I say is still true.
Is there any evidence that any Britons are incapable of learning foreign languages? Maybe there's no incentive because the rest of the world learns English as a second language to communicate with each other. Where is the incentive to learn entire languages like French or German if it only allows you to deal with one country? If you're going to live there, then yes, learn them, but it's just completely stupid to suggest we're bad at languages. I have to say, despite Spanish being spoken in just as many countries as English is de facto, I didn't feel any incentive to make any effort because I don't intend on living in Spain, or visiting South America, which on the international stage is a bit like the elephant in the room.
Original post by im so academic
What languages does he know altogether?
How on earth did he learn all of them?
How on earth did he learn all of them?
English, Dutch, German, French, Italian, Mandarin, Japanese, Egyptian, Russian, Portugese and Spanish.
He learnt them the same way I am. Books, audio books, special programs on PCs and just repeat. It goes in quite easily, at least in our case it has done.
I can speak Dutch, German and French fluently. Still learning Russian and Mandarin Chinese. I would like to learn Japanese, Italian and Portugese as quickly as possible too.
Its just a skill that can always be useful. OK, its not entirely necessary, but I'd like to travel the world so I need it.
There hasn't been as much of an emphasis on the teaching of MFL in England as there has been of the teaching of English in the rest of Europe and China etc? I know I didn't do a single bit of French until year 7, got an A in it at GCSE then didn't see the point of taking it any further (wish I had now actually). It just isn't seen as important for us.
The syllabus in this country struggles to get a lot of young people numerate and literate, they aren't going to be able to produce masses of bi-linguals.
The syllabus in this country struggles to get a lot of young people numerate and literate, they aren't going to be able to produce masses of bi-linguals.
Original post by DH-Biker
English, Dutch, German, French, Italian, Mandarin, Japanese, Egyptian, Russian, Portugese and Spanish.
He learnt them the same way I am. Books, audio books, special programs on PCs and just repeat. It goes in quite easily, at least in our case it has done.
I can speak Dutch, German and French fluently. Still learning Russian and Mandarin Chinese. I would like to learn Japanese, Italian and Portugese as quickly as possible too.
Its just a skill that can always be useful. OK, its not entirely necessary, but I'd like to travel the world so I need it.
He learnt them the same way I am. Books, audio books, special programs on PCs and just repeat. It goes in quite easily, at least in our case it has done.
I can speak Dutch, German and French fluently. Still learning Russian and Mandarin Chinese. I would like to learn Japanese, Italian and Portugese as quickly as possible too.
Its just a skill that can always be useful. OK, its not entirely necessary, but I'd like to travel the world so I need it.
What the actual ****?
How long did it take him?
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