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Why Conservatives should be agains the monarchy

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    (Original post by internetguru)
    When we have the time and resources to do so then let's do it but till then we should focus on the positions that are doable such as the head of state.
    Why not now? When will we have the time and resources to do it? It seems a pretty weak answer, dude.

    Don't you appreciate that the majority of other countries explicitly do not elect their Head of State, not because they can't, but because it's potentially constitutionally harmful?
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    (Original post by gladders)
    Why not now? When will we have the time and resources to do it? It seems a pretty weak answer, dude.

    Don't you appreciate that the majority of other countries explicitly do not elect their Head of State, not because they can't, but because it's potentially constitutionally harmful?
    Well when people want to elect bin men we will start electing bin men. For now though I want to focus on the head of state.

    They don't elect a head of state because I don't even know why they should declare referendums now.
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    "Should"

    Why should you make your decision upon a matter just because of your political leanings. It is shows a distinct lack of the ability to be able to look at something objectively and decide upon the merits, rather than blindly following the party line. There is nothing wrong with being left wing on certain issues and right wing on other issues.
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    They don't elect a head of state because I don't even know why they should declare referendums now.
    The reason they don't is because having two elected officials - PM and President - runs the risk of a competition for power, to the detriment of both accountability and sound public policy.

    Do you favour overusing a principle over sound government?
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    The Conservatives come from the old royalist Tory party which is why they support the monarchy.
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    Thing is, there's this myth going round that all left-wingers must oppose the monarchy, when there are a great deal of famous leftwing monarchists - George Orwell, for example.
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    That's Cameron out then cos' he a blue blood.
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    The Queen recently invited and dined with dictators who oppose democracy and repress their own people. Do we really want to have a monarch who is at odds with our own views of freedom and democracy?
    The Queen invited almost every Monarch in the world, whether or not you like someone in particular is irrelevant, it would be rude not too and could cause a pretty awkward diplomatic situation. First you don't invite Bahrain, then their Saudi Allies back out followed hastily by most of the other Muslim Monarchs either. Before you know it you're inviting all of the King of Swaziland's 14 wives just to make up numbers.
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    the people would be able to vote for a head of state therefore it would be better.
    looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooooool
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    (Original post by gladders)
    'Conservative' OP doesn't seem to be actually Conservative.
    This. All true conservatives in the true sense of the word like to preserve things as they are and have a great love of the monarchy.

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    (Original post by internetguru)
    The people would be able to vote for a head of state therefore it would be better.
    Then by the same logic why aren't the PMs of this country so wonderful?

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    (Original post by LETSJaM)
    Then by the same logic why aren't the PMs of this country so wonderful?

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    Because you have different political views to them. I'm sure if the Queen's political views were made public you wouldn't be too fond of her either.
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    Because you have different political views to them. I'm sure if the Queen's political views were made public you wouldn't be too fond of her either.
    I'm talking in general, over the last two decades. And I'm pretty sure what the queen's political views are rather apathetic towards them. Also I respect the fact that while she has the right to vote, she doesn't choose to get engaged in such issues.

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    (Original post by LETSJaM)
    I'm talking in general, over the last two decades. And I'm pretty sure what the queen's political views are rather apathetic towards them. Also I respect the fact that while she has the right to vote, she doesn't choose to get engaged in such issues.

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    She doesn't get engaged for good reasons

    1) All mainstream parties are pro monarchy so it doesn't affect her.

    2) If she expresses an opinion her popularity will decrease.

    The secret to her high ratings is if she doesn't have opinions people can't dislike her.
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    She doesn't get engaged for good reasons

    1) All mainstream parties are pro monarchy so it doesn't affect her.

    2) If she expresses an opinion her popularity will decrease.

    The secret to her high ratings is if she doesn't have opinions people can't dislike her.
    You can say 'If...' but she will never do it so that's just a flaw in your argument.

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    (Original post by LETSJaM)
    You can say 'If...' but she will never do it so that's just a flaw in your argument.

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    Everything that hasn't happened is an if what is your point how is that a flaw?
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    The old conservative definition no longer applies no conservative in their right mind would keep the country as it is now. An intelligent conservative always wishes to make the world the way it should be rather than simply keeping it the way it is. They can do this by preserving conservative economic policies and traditions; however, the monarchy is not a tradition it is an entity which is above all else which just happens to be old, so it is bunched together with traditional British values.

    The idea that an active monarchy with powers over the government generate tourism is a joke and there is no evidence to support the claim.
    so if, as you say, the monarchy "just happens" to be old, why exactly has it lasted so long? surely, from your explanation, nothing good comes of it and it just encourages people to be lazy, so why then does the Monarchy still exist? if there are so many "intelligent conservatives" out there, why havent they done something towards abolishing the monarchy?

    what powers does the monarchy have over the government?? aside from the ceremonial roles? i dont recall seeing her at last week's PMQT or any other for that matter.

    You see, we can argue on for days and weeks on end, fact is, the Monarchy is here to stay, whether you like it or not OP.
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    (Original post by Patriot Rich)
    A Monarchy is far more exciting than any bureaucratic Republic.
    Apart from Harry's bat **** crazy antics (which seem to be done with now), what the hell is exciting about the Monarchy?

    The last time I was excited about the Monarchy in any sense was when I saw Pippa Middleton's arse. :cool:
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    (Original post by internetguru)
    So most of us know that there will be a referendum on retaining the monarchy here in the virtual world of TSR. Recent real life polls indicate that conservatives are far more supportive of the monarchy than liberals. As a conservative I feel it is my responsibility to inform my fellow conservatives why they should be republicans.

    The tradition, financial, power arguments etc are all irrelevant in modern society as the only real purpose of the monarchy is to display a powerful message. Some have tried to distort that message but I believe the real message conveyed by having a monarchy is certainly not one a conservative can support. Traditional conservative values of hard work, taking care of yourself etc are all a contradiction to the monarchy. The royal family do not get where they are by working hard and they certainly do not take care of themselves. They got to where they were by just turning up at birth. We want to send the message to the people that to get anywhere you have to work for it you can't just laze about and hope for it to happen. Is it a surprize to any of you that we have so many scroungers and people unwilling to try in our country when the biggest scroungers of all the monarchy sit at the helm? The monarchy is a symbol of everything we conservatives resent, and we must join together and vote to rid our virtual country of them once and for all!
    You know, I'm a conservative, and I'm pro-monarchy, but you just might have convinced me otherwise. That was refreshingly logical, powerful, and short. That is something I'll think about for a few weeks now, but so far you have my vote.
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    (Original post by AYO)
    so if, as you say, the monarchy "just happens" to be old, why exactly has it lasted so long? surely, from your explanation, nothing good comes of it and it just encourages people to be lazy, so why then does the Monarchy still exist? if there are so many "intelligent conservatives" out there, why havent they done something towards abolishing the monarchy?
    You could've applied that 100 or so years ago to the female right to vote and, indeed, feminism as a whole, for prejudice and discrimination against women had, in those days, "lasted so long", even longer than the monarchy has today. Does that mean, like you seem to imply, that this discrimination against females is right? Just because it has lasted for thousands of year, and was an established fact back then, you would've opposed the women's right to vote, to work reasonably etc. because it had "lasted so long"?

    what powers does the monarchy have over the government?? aside from the ceremonial roles? i dont recall seeing her at last week's PMQT or any other for that matter.
    Theoretically, she has many powers. For instance, I'm sure you know that all legislation passed at Westminister requires "Royal Assent", which basically means the Monarch in question at the time giving it the go-ahead. Now, I'm the first person to say our current monarch wouldn't exercise said power in the wrong way (I hope), so this is really a ceremonial power, but could you tell me why she should have it?

    Besides that, regular meeting with the PM and other international figures, a privilege which she is near-unrivalled for, could count too.

    There's probably more I could list but I'm no expert and I'm sure others can mention them. Besides, what I really despise is the way she obtained these powers: through being born, which involved no real merit of her own which singled her out as the best in her field. Do tell how you can justify anything like this as hard work which we so want to encourage, when she is merely surviving (and surviving lavishly, it goes without saying) and automatically obtaining all this?

    You see, we can argue on for days and weeks on end, fact is, the Monarchy is here to stay, whether you like it or not OP.
    I'm sure people may have said similar things about the aforementioned female right to vote and feminism, or perhaps the slave trade, which I could've also applied to your earlier argument. You see, you never know...

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