Santa is unfair
Ben and Josh are in the same primary school class and they both believe in Santa claus.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Original post by Anholm
Ben and Josh are in the same primary school class and they both believe in Santa claus.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
As they both seem to truly believe that Santa exists, Ben and Josh will probably not look to deep into the reason behind their gifts and whether it is related to their socio-economic situations. The most that may happen is that Josh could feel envious towards Ben, but if they are good friends, I'm sure he'll slowly forget about it by February(especially if Ben makes up for it by getting Josh a better birthday gift!)
Original post by Roses.Are.Red
As they both seem to truly believe that Santa exists, Ben and Josh will probably not look to deep into the reason behind their gifts and whether it is related to their socio-economic situations. The most that may happen is that Josh could feel envious towards Ben, but if they are good friends, I'm sure he'll slowly forget about it by February(especially if Ben makes up for it by getting Josh a better birthday gift!)
Josh will probably know nothing about socio economics but he will surely wonder why Santa gave Ben and the other people in the class the nice gifts and him not very much. I dont see what's wrong with just teaching children to be grateful, generous, and that Christmas is a time to see friends and family. Something that will become more important as they grow older. They will still receive presents and still have something to look forward to if we don't say Santa did it all. What does saying he exists do for the children?
Original post by Anholm
Ben and Josh are in the same primary school class and they both believe in Santa claus.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Santa is fair he visit every good little boy and girl in the world and eat a cookie and drink the milk.
It's parents who give children presents
Original post by Anholm
Josh will probably know nothing about socio economics but he will surely wonder why Santa gave Ben and the other people in the class the nice gifts and him not very much.
Of course he will but I won't insult you by explaining the joke.
Original post by Anholm
I dont see what's wrong with just teaching children to be grateful, generous, and that Christmas is a time to see friends and family. Something that will become more important as they grow older.
I agree, I see nothing wrong in this, if anything, I'd encourage this to be focused on more.
Original post by Anholm
They will still receive presents and still have something to look forward to if we don't say Santa did it all. What does saying he exists do for the children?
In my eyes, it's just a sweet little story for children's naïve little minds to make Christmas more magical and fun, comparable to the tooth fairy(although I'm aware that the Tooth Fairy only gives you a penny compared to a present).
Let's be honest, I don't think anyone seriously believed in Santa's existence above the age of seven. It is also around that age that they will actually understand the concept of generosity and selflessness and actually implement it themselves.
At the end of the day, the thought of Santa's existence doesn't deteriorate a child's life, and isn't inherently harmful.
Original post by Roses.Are.Red
Of course he will but I won't insult you by explaining the joke.
I agree, I see nothing wrong in this, if anything, I'd encourage this to be focused on more.
In my eyes, it's just a sweet little story for children's naïve little minds to make Christmas more magical and fun, comparable to the tooth fairy(although I'm aware that the Tooth Fairy only gives you a penny compared to a present).
Let's be honest, I don't think anyone seriously believed in Santa's existence above the age of seven. It is also around that age that they will actually understand the concept of generosity and selflessness and actually implement it themselves.
At the end of the day, the thought of Santa's existence doesn't deteriorate a child's life, and isn't inherently harmful.
I agree, I see nothing wrong in this, if anything, I'd encourage this to be focused on more.
In my eyes, it's just a sweet little story for children's naïve little minds to make Christmas more magical and fun, comparable to the tooth fairy(although I'm aware that the Tooth Fairy only gives you a penny compared to a present).
Let's be honest, I don't think anyone seriously believed in Santa's existence above the age of seven. It is also around that age that they will actually understand the concept of generosity and selflessness and actually implement it themselves.
At the end of the day, the thought of Santa's existence doesn't deteriorate a child's life, and isn't inherently harmful.
Sorry, your joke has flown right over my head.
To most children, it is harmless and fun. But there are a small number who would seriously benefit from knowing what is true rather that the made up story because it does cause stress. It is only fair that if some know he is not real, they all know so that they are all on a level playing field. Maybe I'm just over complicating it but I've seen some pretty disappointed kids before.
Can I just congratulate you for spelling naïve correctly. That's the first time I've seen someone do it online!
Original post by Anholm
Sorry, your joke has flown right over my head.
To most children, it is harmless and fun. But there are a small number who would seriously benefit from knowing what is true rather that the made up story because it does cause stress. It is only fair that if some know he is not real, they all know so that they are all on a level playing field. Maybe I'm just over complicating it but I've seen some pretty disappointed kids before.
Can I just congratulate you for spelling naïve correctly. That's the first time I've seen someone do it online!
To most children, it is harmless and fun. But there are a small number who would seriously benefit from knowing what is true rather that the made up story because it does cause stress. It is only fair that if some know he is not real, they all know so that they are all on a level playing field. Maybe I'm just over complicating it but I've seen some pretty disappointed kids before.
Can I just congratulate you for spelling naïve correctly. That's the first time I've seen someone do it online!
Thank you! I should also be thanking you for having a civil debate with someone who happens to not completely agree with you (something that's quite rare nowadays).
Whilst there may be a small number who may benefit from knowing, ultimately, they will all know eventually so there is actually no point in telling some and 'ruining the magic' for others. I feel like we tend to underestimate children's knowledge of the world around them a lot of the time.
Original post by Roses.Are.Red
Thank you! I should also be thanking you for having a civil debate with someone who happens to not completely agree with you (something that's quite rare nowadays).
Whilst there may be a small number who may benefit from knowing, ultimately, they will all know eventually so there is actually no point in telling some and 'ruining the magic' for others. I feel like we tend to underestimate children's knowledge of the world around them a lot of the time.
Whilst there may be a small number who may benefit from knowing, ultimately, they will all know eventually so there is actually no point in telling some and 'ruining the magic' for others. I feel like we tend to underestimate children's knowledge of the world around them a lot of the time.
Thanks, I really hope people continue to have conversations and constructive debates about things they don't have in common. Social media platforms like Facebook or YouTube have these algorithms that are designed to keep people hooked as long as possible by feeding them content they want to see. This is particularly problematic when it comes to politics and misinformation where people see what they want rather than what's true - furthering tribalistic mindsets and intolerance.
Anyway, enough of that, it's easy to forget what we did and didn't know when we were younger so people do underestimate a child's understanding of the world.
Original post by Anholm
Thanks, I really hope people continue to have conversations and constructive debates about things they don't have in common. Social media platforms like Facebook or YouTube have these algorithms that are designed to keep people hooked as long as possible by feeding them content they want to see. This is particularly problematic when it comes to politics and misinformation where people see what they want rather than what's true - furthering tribalistic mindsets and intolerance.
Anyway, enough of that, it's easy to forget what we did and didn't know when we were younger so people do underestimate a child's understanding of the world.
Anyway, enough of that, it's easy to forget what we did and didn't know when we were younger so people do underestimate a child's understanding of the world.
I agree. I like listening to other perspectives: it's boring if you put yourself in situations where you're always seen as correct!
(edited 2 years ago)
I wouldn’t really see the benefit in teaching my children that Santa Claus is literally real.
It’s true that to do so brings out many happy emotions i.e. love and excitement and admiration from them, however it’s all directed towards a fictional character, because they believe he is bringing them gifts. It’s far better in my view for all those emotions to be directed towards the people who are actually bringing them gifts; i.e. their parents and other friends and family members. Those gifts are also being given to them specifically rather than every child in the world, which is a more special kind of love. It also means that they never have to be disappointed later on to find out that it isn’t real, because all of this is real. I don’t think this takes away from any of the happiness they experience - if anything it should add to it.
I also wouldn’t want to teach them that Santa gets them gifts “for being good”. It’s not really a gift at all then, it’s more of a payment or bribe. They'll be less grateful for what they get, and more disappointed/confused when they don't get what they want because they think they’ve done something to earn and deserve those gifts (with no clear scale as to how that is measured either). It also fosters a “what’s in it for me?” model of morality, which doesn't translate well into the real world, because the answer to that is usually "nothing". I believe morality needs to be taught as a virtue in and of itself, rather than something done for the sake of a selfish reward. As they say, "be good for goodness sake". So again I think it’s far better for them to know that their gifts come from their parents, representative of their unconditional love rather than conditionally earned by their actions.
It’s true that to do so brings out many happy emotions i.e. love and excitement and admiration from them, however it’s all directed towards a fictional character, because they believe he is bringing them gifts. It’s far better in my view for all those emotions to be directed towards the people who are actually bringing them gifts; i.e. their parents and other friends and family members. Those gifts are also being given to them specifically rather than every child in the world, which is a more special kind of love. It also means that they never have to be disappointed later on to find out that it isn’t real, because all of this is real. I don’t think this takes away from any of the happiness they experience - if anything it should add to it.
I also wouldn’t want to teach them that Santa gets them gifts “for being good”. It’s not really a gift at all then, it’s more of a payment or bribe. They'll be less grateful for what they get, and more disappointed/confused when they don't get what they want because they think they’ve done something to earn and deserve those gifts (with no clear scale as to how that is measured either). It also fosters a “what’s in it for me?” model of morality, which doesn't translate well into the real world, because the answer to that is usually "nothing". I believe morality needs to be taught as a virtue in and of itself, rather than something done for the sake of a selfish reward. As they say, "be good for goodness sake". So again I think it’s far better for them to know that their gifts come from their parents, representative of their unconditional love rather than conditionally earned by their actions.
(edited 2 years ago)
i never had a Santa Claus but don't remember kids in my class believing what they received on Christmas was based on their good behaviour; seemingly (at least) the parents in my neighbourhood did not teach their kids that gifts were seriously dependent on performance cuz everyone looked forward to Christmas and weren't panicked that they weren't good enough for Santa 
they must've also received unconditional love on Christmas Day cuz no one complained after the break 
bearing in mind i grew up in a very working class neighbourhood where no one had a university education nor any privilege so maybe we had low expectations of what presents on Christmas Day meant
idk how long believing in Santa honestly goes on for (cuz like i said never had one). talking to my small neices and nephews tho they apparently fake it for long after they stopped believing in it.
they must've also received unconditional love on Christmas Day cuz no one complained after the break bearing in mind i grew up in a very working class neighbourhood where no one had a university education nor any privilege so maybe we had low expectations of what presents on Christmas Day meant
idk how long believing in Santa honestly goes on for (cuz like i said never had one). talking to my small neices and nephews tho they apparently fake it for long after they stopped believing in it.
(edited 2 years ago)
Original post by Anholm
Ben and Josh are in the same primary school class and they both believe in Santa claus.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Ben lives in a large farmhouse with happy, hard working, wealthy parents. But Josh lives in a small council house with 6 other brothers and sisters and an unemployed single mum.
After the holidays, Ben and Josh are talking about what they got for christmas
"I got a huge Lego crane, a remote controlled helicopter and a microscope" says Ben "exactly what I wanted"
"I got a packet of crisps and a yoyo" says Josh. Of course this Is not what he asked for.
Bearing in mind they are both well behaved, how is it fair to tell a child that presents come from an omnipotent, loving, generous, magical person when really, what they receive is dependent solely on the economic status of their parents.
Josh will go home believing santa doesn't think he deserves all the things Ben got and somehow is not as good a person as Ben. When this is entirely untrue.
We shouldn't tell children Santa exists, we should tell them Christmas is a time for generosity, an excuse to see people you haven't seen in ages, a time to contact distant family, rest and eat mince pies. (Ben and Josh do exist and things like this happen every year. Of course, I haven't used their real names)
Cut the magical nonsense out of it.
Whats your issue with Christmas?
Its a bit of fun for children, just like the easter bunny and the tooth fairy. No one cares if kid x's family are poor and cant afford the same presents as another family its a fact of life and one few children would look upon.Quick Reply
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