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Fox Hunting for or against??
This poll is closed
Are you For fox hunting or Against?
For fox hunting40%
Against fox hunting60%
Total votes: 131
Me and my boyfriend debated this topic for ages last night.
I am for fox hunting and am against the ban of it, I see it as English tradition and something that has been apart of our culture since Henry VIII was around. I use to be part of a hunt mmy horse use to get so much enjoyment out of it and not to mention the hounds use to as well, since it has been banned it has not been the same.
My boyfriend however is really against fox hunting and glad it has been banned, he says it is cruel towards the fox although either way the fox is going to get killed anyway even though it has been banned (farmers shooting them, pest control).
Thought I would do a poll on here and see what you guys think and see how many people are for fox huting and how many people are against.
I am for fox hunting and am against the ban of it, I see it as English tradition and something that has been apart of our culture since Henry VIII was around. I use to be part of a hunt mmy horse use to get so much enjoyment out of it and not to mention the hounds use to as well, since it has been banned it has not been the same.
My boyfriend however is really against fox hunting and glad it has been banned, he says it is cruel towards the fox although either way the fox is going to get killed anyway even though it has been banned (farmers shooting them, pest control).
Thought I would do a poll on here and see what you guys think and see how many people are for fox huting and how many people are against.
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Middle of the road as not sure of the details of the law (we don't have foxes/English Law over here). I'm against planned hunts, prolonging the chasing of an animal before it dies is pretty cruel, but I'm not against the killing of foxes in terms of pest control.
Thinking of the myxi virus in rabbits, which was purposefully spread when they became a problem, allowing the shooting of foxes for this reason seems pretty kind in comparison. If they are causing a problem people are going to kill them one way or another, and if shooting them in this case is banned people are just going to come up with much worse alternatives eventually.
Thinking of the myxi virus in rabbits, which was purposefully spread when they became a problem, allowing the shooting of foxes for this reason seems pretty kind in comparison. If they are causing a problem people are going to kill them one way or another, and if shooting them in this case is banned people are just going to come up with much worse alternatives eventually.
I think the chasing of the animal and killing it is pretty cruel... especially if it wasn't causing a problem in the first place.
Totally against. It's just a violent bloodsport for the middle-upper classes. Why can't the toffs play polo or something and leave the poor foxes alone?
am against hunting it as game, but if it becomes a nuisance then you've got to.
I think your arguments for it are totally rubbish, but I'm undecided. Up until a year or two ago I was vehemently against it, but then someone finally (after years of "it's tradition"/"townies don't understand the countryside" baloney) gave me some really decent arguments, so since then I've been uncertain.
I also concur with people who think that tradition is a poor excuse to carry it on. Many traditons have to be out-dated sometime or other.
Jelkin
I think your arguments for it are totally rubbish, but I'm undecided. Up until a year or two ago I was vehemently against it, but then someone finally (after years of "it's tradition"/"townies don't understand the countryside" baloney) gave me some really decent arguments, so since then I've been uncertain.
What were these decent arguments, out of interest?
Jelkin
I'm not sure I could repeat them very eloquently. I'll try to find them in a sec.
OK. I am not saying there aren't decent counter-arguments. I'm just interested to see what they are.
I suppose saying foxes are "vermin and spread disease" is one.
But why not cull them humanely?
x-pixie-lottie-x
Just killing a farmers live stock... or familys pets...
they get into chickens and they will kill all they can get at for the fun of it...
or spreading disease...
i call that causing a problem...
and it isnt a "cruel" sport.. the fox dies pretty quickly... the hounds dont just get it for fun...
alternative to the hunts... shoot them.... leave them injured wandering around dying a slow and painful death? Now that is cruel...
generally speaking those that appear to be against fox hunting are people who dont live in the country, have never been to a hunt, havent had pets or livestock injured or killed by a fox ....they think poor cuddly cute mr fox just being killed for the fun of it... its not just tradition, or for fun, its pest control.
My neighbours chickens were all slaughtered by a fox, it wouldnt be so bad if it just killed what it ate, but they dont they dont think like that it killed 12 left 2 alive (they hid somewhere), they kill rabbits, cats, peoples pets.
....Whats next? .....
SAVE THE FISH STOP FISHING ITS CRUEL....
they get into chickens and they will kill all they can get at for the fun of it...
or spreading disease...
i call that causing a problem...
and it isnt a "cruel" sport.. the fox dies pretty quickly... the hounds dont just get it for fun...
alternative to the hunts... shoot them.... leave them injured wandering around dying a slow and painful death? Now that is cruel...
generally speaking those that appear to be against fox hunting are people who dont live in the country, have never been to a hunt, havent had pets or livestock injured or killed by a fox ....they think poor cuddly cute mr fox just being killed for the fun of it... its not just tradition, or for fun, its pest control.
My neighbours chickens were all slaughtered by a fox, it wouldnt be so bad if it just killed what it ate, but they dont they dont think like that it killed 12 left 2 alive (they hid somewhere), they kill rabbits, cats, peoples pets.
....Whats next? .....
SAVE THE FISH STOP FISHING ITS CRUEL....
Well said I live in the country and I am a farming girl, but townie folk never understand countryside issues and never will.
x_icefox_x
Well said I live in the country and I am a farming girl, but townie folk never understand countryside issues and never will.
I am from a farming area and many of my friends are for hunting (one of them owns horses) so I see that it is tradition, I just don't think it's a very humane thing to do! But each to their own.
Foxes exist in urban environments too. I am very much a city dweller. And I see where you are coming from by saying they kill chickens etc, but why the sport. Why not kill them humanely, as I said in another post?
Everything about the hunt turns my stomach.
Everything about the hunt turns my stomach.
jaydoh
OK. I am not saying there aren't decent counter-arguments. I'm just interested to see what they are.
I suppose saying foxes are "vermin and spread disease" is one.
But why not cull them humanely?
I suppose saying foxes are "vermin and spread disease" is one.
But why not cull them humanely?
I don't think there really is a humane way to kill a fox, or I would probably be for that. I can't find the exact post I meant so I will try to summarise as best as I can.
1) A healthy fox will stay away from humans and hunt rabbits/wild animals.
2) It is only an old/weak/sick fox (that cannot hunt effectively) that will risk going for farms. Obviously this is bad for the farmers, who will not just stand by, but they can't protect their livestock without locking the animals up cruelly, and if they try to kill the foxes themselves it will be through traps and poison - both of which would be nasty deaths and also target other animals.
3) Fox hunters only catch the foxes that are too slow to get away - so will get the ones that are likely to be attacking farm animals. So even though hunts don't kill that many foxes, they do get the "right" ones - placing traps and poison about the countryside would not discriminate between healthy foxes and sick or old ones. So it's better for the fox population to weed out the unhealthy ones.
4) I'm not sure about this one, but someone asserted that foxes aren't traumatised by the chase because they're wild animals and it's in their nature, or something like that. Some people also say the death would be painless, but I am sceptical.
Anyway, I'm not 100% pro fox hunting or anything - and I still find the idea that people do it for enjoyment pretty distasteful - but when I read the above arguments, probably better worded, I really began to question the views I'd held for so long.
the key arguements for:
Starting point: Foxes must be controlled because of the severe impact on farmers livestock (lamps, hens, ducks, geese etc)- in my view this is undisputable
Hunting has the advantage that it only kills older or unfit foxes - young fit ones will be able to out run the hounds in many cases.
Contary to what many people say; the fox is killed instantly and i have never heard of an injured fox escaping
Yes it is predominantly middle/upper classes who participate in the sport but this in itself should not be a reason to criticise it
And then when you compare fox hunting to the other options:
Shooting: No bias towards age/health so young healthy foxes are killed just as much as those that are older and in possibly suffering. Many foxes will not die instantly and some will survive for weeks/months after being shot.
Snares: Again no bias as to the health of the fox. Fox can be held for up to 24 hours before the snare is checked in great pain/suffering. Risk of catching other animals such as badgers who may die before anyone checks the snare.
So if we must control foxes then surely hunting is the best option for an unpleasant task?
Starting point: Foxes must be controlled because of the severe impact on farmers livestock (lamps, hens, ducks, geese etc)- in my view this is undisputable
Hunting has the advantage that it only kills older or unfit foxes - young fit ones will be able to out run the hounds in many cases.
Contary to what many people say; the fox is killed instantly and i have never heard of an injured fox escaping
Yes it is predominantly middle/upper classes who participate in the sport but this in itself should not be a reason to criticise it
And then when you compare fox hunting to the other options:
Shooting: No bias towards age/health so young healthy foxes are killed just as much as those that are older and in possibly suffering. Many foxes will not die instantly and some will survive for weeks/months after being shot.
Snares: Again no bias as to the health of the fox. Fox can be held for up to 24 hours before the snare is checked in great pain/suffering. Risk of catching other animals such as badgers who may die before anyone checks the snare.
So if we must control foxes then surely hunting is the best option for an unpleasant task?
x-pixie-lottie-x
Just killing a farmers live stock... or familys pets...
they get into chickens and they will kill all they can get at for the fun of it...
or spreading disease...
i call that causing a problem...
they get into chickens and they will kill all they can get at for the fun of it...
or spreading disease...
i call that causing a problem...
Foxes don't kill for fun, WTF? They just don't realise they can't go back later. If you had to hunt for your own food and had the opportunity to easily kill a lot of it at once, I'm sure you would. I hate the way people try to portray foxes as "evil".
and it isnt a "cruel" sport.. the fox dies pretty quickly... the hounds dont just get it for fun...
alternative to the hunts... shoot them.... leave them injured wandering around dying a slow and painful death? Now that is cruel...
alternative to the hunts... shoot them.... leave them injured wandering around dying a slow and painful death? Now that is cruel...
I agree about the last point, but why is it that the fox kills for fun but the hounds don't?
generally speaking those that appear to be against fox hunting are people who dont live in the country, have never been to a hunt, havent had pets or livestock injured or killed by a fox ....they think poor cuddly cute mr fox just being killed for the fun of it... its not just tradition, or for fun, its pest control.
My neighbours chickens were all slaughtered by a fox, it wouldnt be so bad if it just killed what it ate, but they dont they dont think like that it killed 12 left 2 alive (they hid somewhere), they kill rabbits, cats, peoples pets.
My neighbours chickens were all slaughtered by a fox, it wouldnt be so bad if it just killed what it ate, but they dont they dont think like that it killed 12 left 2 alive (they hid somewhere), they kill rabbits, cats, peoples pets.
I live in the country and I've had rabbits killed by foxes (when I was pretty young too, so it was upsetting), but I was still against fox hunting for a very long time. I could say, "most of the people for fox hunting have been brought up either doing it or with the idea that it's okay," and it would be true, and probably the main reason these people are for it, but that by itself doesn't make a pro-hunt argument invalid. It annoys me when people use the "townies are ignorant" argument. People have opinions on loads of things they've never experienced themselves and it's okay.
x-pixie-lottie-x
but foxes dont kill for food... they kill for fun...
Only humans kill for fun. A fox is stimulated to kill by the presence, sound, smell and movement of a prey animal. If there is one such animal it will kill one. If there are thirty the instincts of the fox tell it to keep killing. Bear in mind that nowhere in nature would a prey species be congregated and confined in such a small area. The fox lacks the foresight to understand how many it can and can't eat. It is operating on a purely instinctive level.
(http://www.helpwildlife.co.uk/PestFoxes.html)
x-pixie-lottie-x
but foxes dont kill for food... they kill for fun...
Not neccessarily.
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