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Area between two curves in a set limit - both curves below x-axis - what should I do?

I know that normally area between two curves is integration of upper curve with limits minus integration of lower curve with limits.

In this situation both curves are below x-axis. I will get negative area and then need to drop minus to get the answer.

I've tried taking integration of the lower curve minus integration of higher curve and I get rubbish.

Anyone help?

(edited 12 years ago)

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Reply 1
Original post by in_your_face


this is the question. part a is simple.

part b - rubbish.

I know we should use sin2x=2sinXcosX,

but if tan = sin/cos = 3/4 why do they get the answer sinX= 3/5 and cosX = 4/5

I know this is possible, but how do they arrive to this answer, where does the 5 come from? It could easily be 3/10 or 3/7 for all I know.

Anyone explain/help/solve?

I have the answer only from the past paper, but haven't got a clue on how to do it.
thanks.




i am not sure exactly whats the question, but if the question is

if tan = sin/cos = 3/4 why do they get the answer sinX= 3/5 and cosX = 4/5


then, think of a right angled triangle.



tan A = 3/4
do you know SOH CAH TOA? (sine=opposite/hypothenuse,cos=adjacent/hypothenuse, tan=opposite/adjacent)... opposite = length of line opposite to the angle. hypothenuse length = opposite right angle (longest length). adjacent=length of line that is at the angle x and 90degrees (if you know what i mean)
well tan A = opposite lenght/adjacent length = a/b
sincce tan A = a/b = 3/4 ... A=3, B=4.
using pythangoras you can find C = sq root (3^2+4^2) = 5
now sin A = opposite length/hypothenuse length = a/c = 3/5
and cos A = adjacent length/hypothenuse length = b/c = 4/5

hope you understand :/
Reply 2
Original post by argrao
i am not sure exactly whats the question, but if the question is

if tan = sin/cos = 3/4 why do they get the answer sinX= 3/5 and cosX = 4/5


then, think of a right angled triangle.



tan A = 3/4
do you know SOH CAH TOA? (sine=opposite/hypothenuse,cos=adjacent/hypothenuse, tan=opposite/adjacent)... opposite = length of line opposite to the angle. hypothenuse length = opposite right angle (longest length). adjacent=length of line that is at the angle x and 90degrees (if you know what i mean)
well tan A = opposite lenght/adjacent length = a/b
sincce tan A = a/b = 3/4 ... A=3, B=4.
using pythangoras you can find C = sq root (3^2+4^2) = 5
now sin A = opposite length/hypothenuse length = a/c = 3/5
and cos A = adjacent length/hypothenuse length = b/c = 4/5

hope you understand :/


aaaaaah, well I thought about the triangle being right-angled, but it's not mentioned in the question. So we were meant to deduce it from sin and cos - I know that we use cos and sin not only in right-angled triangles, so I got confused. sin and cos as relationship between sides is for right-angled triangles only, but we can use sine and cosine rule with any triangles, right?

Thanks a lot for the explanation.
Reply 3
Original post by in_your_face
aaaaaah, well I thought about the triangle being right-angled, but it's not mentioned in the question. So we were meant to deduce it from sin and cos - I know that we use cos and sin not only in right-angled triangles, so I got confused. sin and cos as relationship between sides is for right-angled triangles only, but we can use sine and cosine rule with any triangles, right?

Thanks a lot for the explanation.


yup, sine and cosine rules can be used with any triangles, but when you know sin x = a/b or somefin, you can use the right angle triangle to find cos x and tan x, and vice versa.. :smile:
Reply 4
Original post by argrao
yup, sine and cosine rules can be used with any triangles, but when you know sin x = a/b or somefin, you can use the right angle triangle to find cos x and tan x, and vice versa.. :smile:


great, thanks.
Reply 5
Original post by argrao
yup, sine and cosine rules can be used with any triangles, but when you know sin x = a/b or somefin, you can use the right angle triangle to find cos x and tan x, and vice versa.. :smile:


can I ask you an unrelated question since I opened a thread anyway?

If we have 3^(log34) does it just equal 4?

So is there a general formula x^(logxY) = Y ?

Thanks
Original post by in_your_face

If we have 3^(log34) does it just equal 4?

So is there a general formula x^(logxY) = Y ?

Thanks


yes
Reply 7

anyone help?
Reply 8

argh
Reply 9
break up the function:

4cos((3X+2)/6) - 1

the 4 doesnt affect period, just the maximum and minimum values
the -1 doesnt affect period either, it just shifts the graph down one

looking inside the cos, youve got:
cos( (3x+2)/6 )
this could be written as cos(3x/6 + 2/6)

does that help?
Reply 10
Original post by RK92
break up the function:

4cos((3X+2)/6) - 1

the 4 doesnt affect period, just the maximum and minimum values
the -1 doesnt affect period either, it just shifts the graph down one

looking inside the cos, youve got:
cos( (3x+2)/6 )
this could be written as cos(3x/6 + 2/6)

does that help?


yes, your explanation is very helpful, thanks.
Reply 11
okay, nice one :smile:
Reply 12

i've got another question, anyone?
Original post by in_your_face
i've got another question, anyone?


Just state what it is!
Reply 14
Original post by baffled_mathman
Just state what it is!


it's at the top, sorry.

I'm trying to avoid spamming maths forum with new threads every time I get stuck on some question.

My maths exam is in a week and I'm rubbish at maths. I'm glad people help me out here :smile:
Original post by in_your_face
it's at the top, sorry.

I'm trying to avoid spamming maths forum with new threads every time I get stuck on some question.

My maths exam is in a week and I'm rubbish at maths. I'm glad people help me out here :smile:


You don't get where the limits came from?

Looks like they forgot to include them in the original question.
Reply 16
Original post by baffled_mathman
You don't get where the limits came from?

Looks like they forgot to include them in the original question.


oh, damn. Thanks for telling me that. I was starting to think I'd missed some major rule of integration.
Reply 17

help! please see original post.

Thanks.
Remember that the integral of sin x is - cos x

and when you integrate sin (2x-3), you have to differentiate the bracket to get 2 and divide the integral by it thus you get -1/2 cos (2x-3) + C

I think you're confused about the 2x-3 being a function of the sin... imagine y=2x-3, then the question is asking for the integral of sin y, not of sin (2x) - 3...
(edited 12 years ago)
Reply 19
Original post by sohanshah
Remember that the integral of sin x is - cos x

and when you integrate sin (2x-3), you have to differentiate the bracket to get 2 and divide the integral by it thus you get -1/2 cos (2x-3) + C

I think you're confused about the 2x-3 being a function of the sin... imagine y=2x-3, then the question is asking for the integral of sin y, not of sin (2x) - 3...


but if this is not integrating function of a function, why should we divide by 2?

if 2x-3 can be substituted by y, then it's integrating sinY = -cosY + C.

Why do we divide by 2, but don't put (2x-3) to the power of 2? I thought that was the principle of integration - we divide by the new power.

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