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Men, are you fed up of all the disrespect, blaming and hatred of men?
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Original post by Suetonius
Can you provide me with a direct quotation where the OP stated "Patriarchal civilisations are the most successful"?
he also flat out says that women working is bad for society and that they should instead be making babies.
Original post by drake10
For civilization to flourish, men must be motivated to work as hard as possible. This is done by rewarding hard working, productive men with status, wealth and a family.
(NOTE: men should not automatically be granted status. They should get status from doing what civilization needs them to do, i.e. provide for and protect women and children.)
Women do not need to work hard for civilization to flourish. Women need to make babies. Women are hypergamous, i.e. want to mate with men who are higher status than themselves. When women raise their status they find fewer men acceptable as mates, so the birth rate plummets.
Feminism has resulted in women taking jobs that could be done by men. By raising women's status and by removing some men's ability to provide, it has destroyed the birth rate; disincentivised hard work, risk taking and industriousness from men; and created a dysfunctional dating culture and society.
But as I say, the feminist chickens are coming home to roost. Feminism disincentivising men means women are going to have to take on more and more of the responsibilities and burdens of society, while more and more men drop out to play computer games and watch porn.
The low birth rate means we need to either remove feminism or import immigrants to keep the economy chugging along. Immigrants tend to come from more patriarchal societies and don't care about women's rights. Things cannot keep going in this insane direction.
Have you ever wondered why every successful civilization across the world has been patriarchal? Because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilization. Weaken Patriarchy and you disincentivise men, weakening the civilization until it gets taken over by a more patriarchal society.
(NOTE: men should not automatically be granted status. They should get status from doing what civilization needs them to do, i.e. provide for and protect women and children.)
Women do not need to work hard for civilization to flourish. Women need to make babies. Women are hypergamous, i.e. want to mate with men who are higher status than themselves. When women raise their status they find fewer men acceptable as mates, so the birth rate plummets.
Feminism has resulted in women taking jobs that could be done by men. By raising women's status and by removing some men's ability to provide, it has destroyed the birth rate; disincentivised hard work, risk taking and industriousness from men; and created a dysfunctional dating culture and society.
But as I say, the feminist chickens are coming home to roost. Feminism disincentivising men means women are going to have to take on more and more of the responsibilities and burdens of society, while more and more men drop out to play computer games and watch porn.
The low birth rate means we need to either remove feminism or import immigrants to keep the economy chugging along. Immigrants tend to come from more patriarchal societies and don't care about women's rights. Things cannot keep going in this insane direction.
Have you ever wondered why every successful civilization across the world has been patriarchal? Because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilization. Weaken Patriarchy and you disincentivise men, weakening the civilization until it gets taken over by a more patriarchal society.
Original post by lucaf
True, but Drake10 seems to think that marriage is a farce because women are able to divorce so easily. Does he want to make divorce impossible for both sexes, or just for women? Because he has never expressed any negative opinion about men being able to leave their wives.
I don't believe that he thinks marriage itself is a farce, rather the divorce laws are what breaks it.
Currently women can benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, whilst a man will suffer financially for leaving a marriage, either with or without cause (barring cases of serious abuse). It's that double skew (++ for women, -- for men) that makes it fundamentally flawed.
If women were unable to benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, but COULD benefit when leaving with cause, whilst men were penalised when being divorced for being abusive but NOT penalised when the woman just decided to leave, then it would be far fairer. And of course vice versa if the man divorces the woman with cause.
Plus alimony should change from "women get the child" to "the most stable and/or non-violent parent gets the child"
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by MarekK
I disagree. IMO I think false accusations are around 20% or more. And the crazy thing is the man accused can be fired with his livelihood destroyed just because some woman regrets ****ing him.
And while he's getting ****ed over by the media the woman is protected as a 'victim' and even when the accusation is proved to be BS the woman is let go free of punishment for making false claims.
And while he's getting ****ed over by the media the woman is protected as a 'victim' and even when the accusation is proved to be BS the woman is let go free of punishment for making false claims.
You think?
That has more to do with your misogyny than actual fact doesn't it?
Original post by Architecture-er
I don't believe that he thinks marriage itself is a farce, rather the divorce laws are what breaks it.
Currently women can benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, whilst a man will suffer financially for leaving a marriage, either with or without cause (barring cases of serious abuse). It's that double skew (++ for women, -- for men) that makes it fundamentally flawed.
If women were unable to benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, but COULD benefit when leaving with cause, whilst men were penalised when being divorced for being abusive but NOT penalised when the woman just decided to leave, then it would be far fairer.
Plus alimony should change from "women get the child" to "the most stable and/or non-violent parent gets the child"
Currently women can benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, whilst a man will suffer financially for leaving a marriage, either with or without cause (barring cases of serious abuse). It's that double skew (++ for women, -- for men) that makes it fundamentally flawed.
If women were unable to benefit from leaving a marriage without cause, but COULD benefit when leaving with cause, whilst men were penalised when being divorced for being abusive but NOT penalised when the woman just decided to leave, then it would be far fairer.
Plus alimony should change from "women get the child" to "the most stable and/or non-violent parent gets the child"
well the only reason women currently benefit (apart from custody bias, about which I completely agree with you that each parent should be given equal consideration) is because men tend to earn more, but that is not true for all couples. I take it your proposed changes would apply equally so men couldn't benefit from leaving without cause if the wife earned more? I suppose that could work, although personally I think it would be better to make prenup's legally binding (I am led to believe that is currently not the case in the UK?)
(edited 9 years ago)
Why not just accept the fact that masculinity and femininity are basically just social constructs and just words to describe things that don't necessarily exist. Why not just live your own life as you want it and choose to ignore what others think of you, since the human brain has lost mass equivalent to the size of a tennis ball over the past few thousand years or so, and the majority of the population is now as thick as pig s***. I was never fully aware of how ignorant, boring, sheep like and just simply thick people generally were until I started working part time in retail to support my studies. Most people will fail to open a plastic bag. My advice in life is to just simply ignore them, if a thicko disrespects you, regardless of gender, the disrespect is invalid and means nothing.
Original post by vickidc18
A more wealthy wife can loose everything too, divorce laws aren't biased towards either men or women, they are biased towards the less wealthy of the two and the primary caregiver.
I guarantee in most marriages the man has a higher income. Just research some stats
Original post by Cobbler
You think?
That has more to do with your misogyny than actual fact doesn't it?
That has more to do with your misogyny than actual fact doesn't it?
Quote:
A meta-analysis by Rumney (2006) suggests that between 10-50% of rape allegations are false. Kanin (1994) arrived at an estimate of 40%, using methodology that strikes me as more trustworthy than a simple count of police-recorded ‘malicious accusations’, since many false rape claims are ignored. Kanin’s unique process was as follows:
Kanin investigated the incidences of false rape allegations made to the police in one small urban community between 1978 and 1987. He states that unlike those in many larger jurisdictions, this police department had the resources to “seriously record and pursue to closure all rape complaints, regardless of their merits.” He further states each investigation “always involves a serious offer to polygraph the complainants and the suspects” and “the complainant must admit that no rape had occurred. She is the sole agent who can say that the rape charge is false.”
The number of false rape allegations in the studied period was 45; this was 41% of the 109 total complaints filed in this period. The researchers verified, whenever possible, for all of the complainants who recanted their allegations, that their new account of the events matched the accused’s version of events.
Original post by vickidc18
A more wealthy wife can loose everything too, divorce laws aren't biased towards either men or women, they are biased towards the less wealthy of the two and the primary caregiver.
well what leads to bitterness from some men is that both of those things tend to be the women, and so on average men are more likely to lose out on a divorce. But that does seem like the best way.
Original post by Suetonius
Can you provide me with a direct quotation where the OP stated "Patriarchal civilisations are the most successful"?
"Have you ever wondered why every successful civilization across the world has been patriarchal? Because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilization. Weaken Patriarchy and you disincentivise men, weakening the civilization until it gets taken over by a more patriarchal society.
"'Every successful civilization across the world has been pariarchal'
'because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilisation'
i don't think you'll find much ambiguity there.
Original post by MarekK
Quote:
A meta-analysis by Rumney (2006) suggests that between 10-50% of rape allegations are false. Kanin (1994) arrived at an estimate of 40%, using methodology that strikes me as more trustworthy than a simple count of police-recorded ‘malicious accusations’, since many false rape claims are ignored. Kanin’s unique process was as follows:
Kanin investigated the incidences of false rape allegations made to the police in one small urban community between 1978 and 1987. He states that unlike those in many larger jurisdictions, this police department had the resources to “seriously record and pursue to closure all rape complaints, regardless of their merits.” He further states each investigation “always involves a serious offer to polygraph the complainants and the suspects” and “the complainant must admit that no rape had occurred. She is the sole agent who can say that the rape charge is false.”
The number of false rape allegations in the studied period was 45; this was 41% of the 109 total complaints filed in this period. The researchers verified, whenever possible, for all of the complainants who recanted their allegations, that their new account of the events matched the accused’s version of events.
A meta-analysis by Rumney (2006) suggests that between 10-50% of rape allegations are false. Kanin (1994) arrived at an estimate of 40%, using methodology that strikes me as more trustworthy than a simple count of police-recorded ‘malicious accusations’, since many false rape claims are ignored. Kanin’s unique process was as follows:
Kanin investigated the incidences of false rape allegations made to the police in one small urban community between 1978 and 1987. He states that unlike those in many larger jurisdictions, this police department had the resources to “seriously record and pursue to closure all rape complaints, regardless of their merits.” He further states each investigation “always involves a serious offer to polygraph the complainants and the suspects” and “the complainant must admit that no rape had occurred. She is the sole agent who can say that the rape charge is false.”
The number of false rape allegations in the studied period was 45; this was 41% of the 109 total complaints filed in this period. The researchers verified, whenever possible, for all of the complainants who recanted their allegations, that their new account of the events matched the accused’s version of events.
So you choose to take this as fact, but not the many, many analyses that point to false allegations being very small?
figures!
Original post by Cobbler
So you choose to take this as fact, but not the many, many analyses that point to false allegations being very small?
figures!
figures!
Notice how I said I think the percentage is 20% not like in the quote 40%.
Also, I have some personal experience - my friend was accused of rape when the girl bought the condom.
Original post by MarekK
I guarantee in most marriages the man has a higher income. Just research some stats
The man might have a higher income in the marriage but this can be due to females taking time out of the workplace to raise offspring, men can now take additional paternity leave after a child is born if the female decides to return to work but we need to change societies views that child rearing is solely a woman's job.
Original post by vickidc18
The man might have a higher income in the marriage but this can be due to females taking time out of the workplace to raise offspring, men can now take additional paternity leave after a child is born if the female decides to return to work but we need to change societies views that child rearing is solely a woman's job.
Why should we ? Women can look after their own children.
Original post by Old_Simon
Why should we ? Women can look after their own children.
Well in biology it takes both a man and a woman to produce a child, so the child belongs to both of them.
Original post by Suetonius
That's not a direct quotation where he says "Patriarchal civilisations are the most successful". Also, where does he 'flat out' say that "women working is bad for society and that they should instead be making babies"? Nothing in the OP remotely suggests that.
What? You think "Have you ever wondered why every successful civilization across the world has been patriarchal? Because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilization" isn't saying patriarchal civilizations are the most successful?
as for the second part, "Women do not need to work hard for civilization to flourish. Women need to make babies." and "Feminism has resulted in women taking jobs that could be done by men. By raising women's status and by removing some men's ability to provide, it has destroyed the birth rate; disincentivised hard work, risk taking and industriousness from men; and created a dysfunctional dating culture and society." are pretty clear in their message that women should be making babies, and that them working instead is a bad thing.
Why are you trying to defend him? His intent is pretty transparent.
edit: did you delete your post?
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Old_Simon
Why should we ? Women can look after their own children.
not just their children
Cobbler
X
Original post by lucaf
What? You think "Have you ever wondered why every successful civilization across the world has been patriarchal? Because Patriarchy is required for a successful civilization" isn't saying patriarchal civilizations are the most successful?
as for the second part, "Women do not need to work hard for civilization to flourish. Women need to make babies." and "Feminism has resulted in women taking jobs that could be done by men. By raising women's status and by removing some men's ability to provide, it has destroyed the birth rate; disincentivised hard work, risk taking and industriousness from men; and created a dysfunctional dating culture and society." are pretty clear in their message that women should be making babies, and that them working instead is a bad thing.
Why are you trying to defend him? His intent is pretty transparent.
as for the second part, "Women do not need to work hard for civilization to flourish. Women need to make babies." and "Feminism has resulted in women taking jobs that could be done by men. By raising women's status and by removing some men's ability to provide, it has destroyed the birth rate; disincentivised hard work, risk taking and industriousness from men; and created a dysfunctional dating culture and society." are pretty clear in their message that women should be making babies, and that them working instead is a bad thing.
Why are you trying to defend him? His intent is pretty transparent.
Sorry, I responded to the wrong person. But no I was referring to the original post. Hence, why I said 'nothing in the OP'. I'm not defending anybody. If you actually engaged your critical faculties you would see that I was responding to a post that preceded the OP making those comments later in the thread, so you're being dishonest.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Suetonius
Sorry, I responded to the wrong person. But no I was referring to the original post. Hence, why I said 'nothing in the OP'. I'm not defending anybody. If you actually engaged your critical faculties you would see that I was responding to a post that preceded the OP making those comments later in the thread, so you're being dishonest.
no you said:
Original post by Suetonius
Can you provide me with a direct quotation where the OP stated "Patriarchal civilisations are the most successful"?
you didn't ask where in the OP he said it, you asked for a quote where he said it. and you were responding to this post:
Original post by Cobbler
LOL! Maybe the whole 'Patriarchal civilisations are the most successful' thing gave us a clue. 
that was made six pages after drake10 made those comments
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