What is "racism"?
Poll
What is "racism"?
Consider the following hypothetical
Tyrone Jackson is a member of the US black panthers today and regularly posts on social media about hating all white people and hoping they were all killed . One day he got drunk and deliberately ran over a white man and boasted about "finally killing whitey"
Choose from the following:
A: "liberal" MLK view of racism
Racism is bigotry towards someone because of their race. Simple as. Tyrone is racist.
B: "progressive" view of racism
Racism is bigotry towards someone because of their race PLUS ,"systemic power relations". In the above example, although it may be bad it is not racist because black men do not hold institutional power on their behalf in the US.
C: "Neoreactionary" view of racism
Racism (as opposed to mere racial bigotry) is simply a way to advance a narrative on a groups behalf such as "homophobia", "misogyny" and "anti-Semitism". This equates to basically "you are bad (and should be punished) and I'm a innocent victim"
In the above example Tyrone was racially bigoted but not "racist" as that doesn't mean anything beyond ad hominem. There may be certain extreme groups such as Neo-nazis, black nationalists and ultrazionists who do genuinely hate other races but these people are extremes
people will obviously mostly be familiar with A and B, but probably not with C which I will be happy to flesh out for people
Tyrone Jackson is a member of the US black panthers today and regularly posts on social media about hating all white people and hoping they were all killed . One day he got drunk and deliberately ran over a white man and boasted about "finally killing whitey"
Choose from the following:
A: "liberal" MLK view of racism
Racism is bigotry towards someone because of their race. Simple as. Tyrone is racist.
B: "progressive" view of racism
Racism is bigotry towards someone because of their race PLUS ,"systemic power relations". In the above example, although it may be bad it is not racist because black men do not hold institutional power on their behalf in the US.
C: "Neoreactionary" view of racism
Racism (as opposed to mere racial bigotry) is simply a way to advance a narrative on a groups behalf such as "homophobia", "misogyny" and "anti-Semitism". This equates to basically "you are bad (and should be punished) and I'm a innocent victim"
In the above example Tyrone was racially bigoted but not "racist" as that doesn't mean anything beyond ad hominem. There may be certain extreme groups such as Neo-nazis, black nationalists and ultrazionists who do genuinely hate other races but these people are extremes
people will obviously mostly be familiar with A and B, but probably not with C which I will be happy to flesh out for people
(edited 2 years ago)
Prejudice, discrimination and / or antagonism on the basis of someone's skin colour. Option A would be most fitting.
OP, did you vote Option C in your own poll?
OP, did you vote Option C in your own poll?
i chose A cause Life chances for blacks were severely diminished, “crippled” by racial segregation and widespread discrimination. Blacks were mostly poor ...
Option A is the only rationale one. 'systemic power' being nothing more than a connived cudgel to explicitly shift the narrative to, ironically, be racist in its own right.
As a case in point, people who advocate this rubbish will politely ignore a racist black person in South Africa/Rhodesia, despite the obvious power being in favour of them. Yet, an ethnic (although the fact this almost only ever applies to those of African extraction as opposed to any other ethnic is oddly notably) who is declined a job or some such is eo ipso a victim of systemic racism
.
However, that isnt to say certain elements of society dont have certain, shall we say, racial tinges to them. It is a matter of fact that blacks, for example, tend to be more harshly treated in the justice system. Whether that is an influence of US policy on British is up for debate though. The former never having really tried to hide explicitly racist laws (changing your police standard issue gun to a larger calibre to explicitly 'take down coked up *****es' is fairly self explanatory).
Slight detour there aside, B & C are absurd and little more than, bizarre examples, of some form of moral posturing and (god forgive me for saying this damn phrase) 'white guilt'.
As a case in point, people who advocate this rubbish will politely ignore a racist black person in South Africa/Rhodesia, despite the obvious power being in favour of them. Yet, an ethnic (although the fact this almost only ever applies to those of African extraction as opposed to any other ethnic is oddly notably) who is declined a job or some such is eo ipso a victim of systemic racism
.However, that isnt to say certain elements of society dont have certain, shall we say, racial tinges to them. It is a matter of fact that blacks, for example, tend to be more harshly treated in the justice system. Whether that is an influence of US policy on British is up for debate though. The former never having really tried to hide explicitly racist laws (changing your police standard issue gun to a larger calibre to explicitly 'take down coked up *****es' is fairly self explanatory).
Slight detour there aside, B & C are absurd and little more than, bizarre examples, of some form of moral posturing and (god forgive me for saying this damn phrase) 'white guilt'.
Original post by savageking
i chose A cause Life chances for blacks were severely diminished, “crippled” by racial segregation and widespread discrimination. Blacks were mostly poor ...
Wouldnt that only really apply to the South of the US? As opposed to, broadly, the north and none of the rest of the world?
Or, to actually acknowledge there are more than whites and blacks in this world, this doesn't really apply anywhere. After all, there are other races in every country globally, and in the US, as but one example.. the anti chinese laws in the US made the black population (at the time anyway) look like pillars of power in the community.
Original post by SHallowvale
Prejudice, discrimination and / or antagonism on the basis of someone's skin colour. Option A would be most fitting.
OP, did you vote Option C in your own poll?
OP, did you vote Option C in your own poll?
Yes I always vote in my polls,fir one it allows me to see the results!
Other than a show results option which I don't like
Original post by Napp
Slight detour there aside, B & C are absurd and little more than, bizarre examples, of some form of moral posturing and (god forgive me for saying this damn phrase) 'white guilt'.
Could you expand on why you disagree with option C? I don't see what white guilt had to do with it so perhaps I have not explained it well ..
To clarify option C ,(my view) believes that racism is just a ideological attempt to pathologise any opposition to group interests. This is different to racial hatred/ bigotry which is certainly real.
C. Of the 3, B is patent nonsense.
(edited 2 years ago)
TBF, A would be the way people generally understand it, B is the way the woke left would prefer it to be defined; C is IMO a more realistic view on what it ends up being in practice.
Original post by TCA2b
TBF, A would be the way people generally understand it, B is the way the woke left would prefer it to be defined; C is IMO a more realistic view on what it ends up being in practice.
PRSOM
Original post by Starship Trooper
Could you expand on why you disagree with option C? I don't see what white guilt had to do with it so perhaps I have not explained it well ..
To clarify option C ,(my view) believes that racism is just a ideological attempt to pathologise any opposition to group interests. This is different to racial hatred/ bigotry which is certainly real.
To clarify option C ,(my view) believes that racism is just a ideological attempt to pathologise any opposition to group interests. This is different to racial hatred/ bigotry which is certainly real.
Sorry, hasty reply on my part and didnt read C fully enough, just to make sure im on the same page as you can you expand on it a bit?
Original post by Napp
Sorry, hasty reply on my part and didnt read C fully enough, just to make sure im on the same page as you can you expand on it a bit?
Sure.
My view (C) is that racial Hatred exists, but "racism" does not, or to be more accurate it exists but in such a fundamental way that it is pointless or/and even harmful to try and "correct" it, esp if it's part of a ideological agenda by some group at the expense of others.
In a similar vein we automatically think about discrimination in a negative sense when actually it's rather a good thing which we all do - eg we discriminate with what partner we want, where we live, work, who were friends with etc.
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