Oxbridge Admissions

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No University prefers 4 A levels - whatever you have heard.

Reply 2

Admit-One

21

What tends to happen is that students who don't have any experience of admissions processes assume that four or more AL's must make you a better candidate, because it's a competitive process. They then look at data which shows that circa half of Oxbridge offer holder took 4 AL's, (this isn't an exact figure).

However, this doesn't take into account that the data doesn't show you why they were made an offer, or that Oxbridge candidates tend to be academic high fyers where 4 AL's is more commonplace.

Quoting myself from elsewhere, here's what Oxford say:

Original post by Admit-One

You have to read between the lines a bit, but the answer is that it's probably not going to make enough of a difference to be worthwhile.

https://uni-of-oxford.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/542/p/27/c/248

"Offers will normally only be made for three A-levels regardless of how many you are taking, though the offer may specify in which three subjects we want the required grades. A-level requirements range between A*A*A and AAA, depending on the course. Please look at your chosen course page for detailed admissions requirements.

Any additional A-levels that you choose to take will be considered, and can help to demonstrate your ability to handle a large workload. However, we recommend that you think carefully before taking on any additional A-levels as this may reduce the time you have to read around your chosen subject beyond your school or college work. You may like to refer to our suggested subject resources page for ideas.

We advise candidates not to spread themselves too thinly across too many subjects, where they may risk dropping a grade or two in their results. Our offers are made on the basis of exam grades rather than UCAS Tariff points, so three A*/A grades would be sufficient to meet most conditional offers, but two A*s and two Bs would not."

Reply 3

Original post by McGinger

No University prefers 4 A levels - whatever you have heard.

This is not exactly correct. While moslty the case, Cambridge for stem will often prefer you to take 4 a levels when you take further mathematics. In Oxford the admissions are more centralized but I still heard conflicting views for engineering, some saying 4 a levels show you can handle more workload.
At the end of the day this may not be causation, but there’s definitely an association between a levels taken and chance of offer, where for engineering people taking 3 a levels have way lower, below 10% chance of getting accepted.

Reply 4

Based on recent discussions with Oxford tutors, my understanding is that taking four A levels confers no distinct advantage when seeking a place at Oxford. It may be better to take three A Levels in rigorous subjects and aim to do very well in each of those three subjects. If you prefer a broader range of study and do not mind a high workload, and your school offers the IB, consider doing the IB. Bear in mind that the workload of undergraduates at Oxbridge is high, but the notion that Oxbridge undergraduates have no time for fun is a myth.

Miss S Byng MA (Oxon)

Reply 5

thegeek888

Original post by mango night

I'm a Year 11 looking for advice as I want to apply for a place in Oxbridge in the next few years and I've heard mixed advice when it comes to choosing my A-levels.
I heard from some that choosing 4 a-levels and getting 4 A* gives your application an advantage, but others say that these universities cannot deem an application with 4 A* higher than one with 3 A* because some sixth forms don't offer the option to take 4 A-Levels. Could someone please explain?

About 40% of all Oxbridge applicants who are made offers have 4 A-Levels. Private schools can offer more A-Levels than other schools. But a lot of State schools can also offer 4 A-Levels as well.

These are the fancy private schools sending the most students to Oxbridge (thetab.com)

These are the state schools sending the most students to Oxbridge in 2024 (thetab.com)

(edited 1 month ago)

Reply 6

Original post by thegeek888

About 40% of all Oxbridge applicants who are made offers have 4 A-Levels. Private schools can offer more A-Levels than other schools. But a lot of State schools can also offer 4 A-Levels as well.
These are the fancy private schools sending the most students to Oxbridge (thetab.com)
These are the state schools sending the most students to Oxbridge in 2024 (thetab.com)

OP, thegeek888 is probably trying to be helpful, but please bear in mind that he has as yet no personal experience of university admissions. He tells us that he has decided to do five A levels in two stages, and he appears to be keen to encourage others to do four or five. The reality is that three A levels in academic subjects are all the A levels you need for a credible application to Oxbridge and to other good universities.

You will also need good but not perfect GCSE grades, a strong personal statement, a good reference, a good performance in any subject-relevant aptitude test, and, if invited to interview, a good showing at interview.

Information about the schools which send several pupils to Oxbridge is of passing interest, but it is not evidently relevant to this thread.

Please also consider the several other good universities, so that, if the Oxbridge dice don't roll in your favour, you can study at another of the UK's excellent places of higher education.

(edited 1 month ago)

Reply 7

There are some circumstances where 4 a levels are recommended, namely connected to further maths, as per the Cambridge site;
Generally, Cambridge's advice is that quality is more important than quantity and that therefore three A Levels are enough. However, the one exception to this rule is when the three A Levels are Maths, Further Maths and Physics. Because of the synergies between these three subjects, they do not require as much work of a strong mathematician (which we hope our applicants are!) as three more disparate subjects. Therefore, if a student is only taking Maths, Further Maths and Physics, then this can raise concerns about their ability to handle a demanding workload. Taking a fourth A Level, even if it is not relevant to Engineering, provides reassurance that you can indeed handle a demanding workload.

Reply 8

Thanks for that helpful qualification to the general position, which makes obvious sense for those seeking to study engineering and physics. My understanding is that for humanities, social sciences, and life sciences, leading universities expect three strong A levels.

Reply 9

Original post by Stiffy Byng

Thanks for that helpful qualification to the general position, which makes obvious sense for those seeking to study engineering and physics. My understanding is that for humanities, social sciences, and life sciences, leading universities expect three strong A levels.

That is as far as I can tell correct including oxbridge, for humanities majority take 3 a levels and it is enough, just some stem subjects have it different - at the end of the day depends on what OP wants to study, but for humanities 3 A levels are definitely enough

Reply 10

Razzledazzle310

9

Hi, I received an offer from Cambridge for medicine this year, and the A level subjects I took were Physics, Chemistry, Biology and Computer Science. I also took Maths a level and Further Maths a level in year 10 and 12 respectively.

Despite my seemingly absurd a levels, I really don't think oxbridge (or at least cambridge) care much about 4 or more a levels. My offer requirements are A*A*A in physics chem and bio, but only a C in computer science. They don't seem to take into account my maths or further maths a level at all, which I got both A* in, although that may be due to taking them early.

The C in computer science requirement makes me think they may not care that much about a 4th a level, although this might just be because I already did maths

Reply 11

Original post by Razzledazzle310

Hi, I received an offer from Cambridge for medicine this year, and the A level subjects I took were Physics, Chemistry, Biology and Computer Science. I also took Maths a level and Further Maths a level in year 10 and 12 respectively.
Despite my seemingly absurd a levels, I really don't think oxbridge (or at least cambridge) care much about 4 or more a levels. My offer requirements are A*A*A in physics chem and bio, but only a C in computer science. They don't seem to take into account my maths or further maths a level at all, which I got both A* in, although that may be due to taking them early.
The C in computer science requirement makes me think they may not care that much about a 4th a level, although this might just be because I already did maths

Hello, I believe the reason for this is that iirc for medicine all a levels / offer has to be met in one year, so they would not take into account past qualifications if they don’t make you already meet your offer.

Reply 12

Razzledazzle310

9

Original post by JustBenjamin

Hello, I believe the reason for this is that iirc for medicine all a levels / offer has to be met in one year, so they would not take into account past qualifications if they don’t make you already meet your offer.

Ok, that explains the maths but I still feel weird about the C in computer science, it just seems very out of character for Cambridge.

Reply 13

Original post by Razzledazzle310

Ok, that explains the maths but I still feel weird about the C in computer science, it just seems very out of character for Cambridge.

Probably because with you already having had done maths and all they are confident in your abilities so just want you to meet the standard offer and do okay in your 4th subject

Reply 14

Sakai04

I'm being honest here, unless it's STEM and it's furthermaths along with maths and 2 or even 3 sciences, they don't care. It's not true that they do not have a preference for people with 4 A levels, if the 4th is another science or fm for stem.

Reply 15

Original post by Razzledazzle310

Ok, that explains the maths but I still feel weird about the C in computer science, it just seems very out of character for Cambridge.

Relax! They want you! Well done!

Cambridge tutors may trust their own judgments more than they trust the judgments of A level examination boards.

Back in the days when Oxford and Cambridge set their own entrance examinations, if you came up to standard in the exams and the interview, the standard offer in every subject was "just get (or already have) two Es at A level". A person can get two Es if that person can spell his or her own name. This explains why I and some other people at my sixth form college spent the months between receiving offers from Oxford or Cambridge in December and taking our A levels in the following June either drunk or asleep. We turned up for the A level exams, but not one of us had done a stroke of work for the previous six months. I didn't read half of the books on my A level English course until some years after taking the exams (I was pleased to discover that they were very good books). To this day, I remain slightly hazy about the second half of the sixteenth century in Europe, although I am pretty good on the first half, and I never did quite finish Thucydides*. Maybe I shall when I retire.

*Hey, neither did Thucydides.

(edited 3 weeks ago)

Reply 16

McGinger

Original post by JustBenjamin

This is not exactly correct. While moslty the case, Cambridge for stem will often prefer you to take 4 a levels when you take further mathematics. In Oxford the admissions are more centralized but I still heard conflicting views for engineering, some saying 4 a levels show you can handle more workload.
At the end of the day this may not be causation, but there’s definitely an association between a levels taken and chance of offer, where for engineering people taking 3 a levels have way lower, below 10% chance of getting accepted.

Preferring both Maths and FM for STEM is not the same as preferring applicants taking 4 subjects for all degree subjects - and the assumption that anyone taking 4 subjects has an automatic advantage over others only doing 3.

Reply 17

Original post by McGinger

Preferring both Maths and FM for STEM is not the same as preferring applicants taking 4 subjects for all degree subjects - and the assumption that anyone taking 4 subjects has an automatic advantage over others only doing 3.

I agree, but Just Benjamin has not suggested that taking four A levels is preferable save in very specific contexts relating to a narrow group of degree subjects.

Posters such as thegeek888 (who hasn't re-taken A levels yet, having, he says, obtained low or no grades on his first attempt) relentlessly spread the myth that top universities prefer all applicants to do four or even five A levels, when those universities plainly don't. The myth can lead students to become anxious and commit themselves to taking more A levels than they need, potentially damaging their chances of obtaining places at the top universities, because they have placed themselves under needless extra pressure.

I truly can't tell if thegeek888 is just a misguided enthusiast who thinks that everyone should do what he says he is doing (taking numerous A levels for no readily apparent reason), or if he is a troll (he gives misleading advice on a variety of topics). I think the former, but I'm not sure. His writing style varies from appalling to reasonably good, and perhaps he is not quite the ingenue that he sometimes seems to be.

Reply 18

thegeek888