Will you leave the country when England becomes an islamic leaning country?

4. Halal meat involves slitting the animals throat while concious to allow the blood to drain, often the animal isn't stunned. Normal slaughter methods involve a painless death.

5. Missing the point. The call to prayer is blared out 5 times a day from Mosques. Churches do not do anything of the sort (and no, church bells are irrelevant here as they are not played nearly as frequently.) Also, low numbers of Mosques in the UK mean that more people flock to the same ones, causing traffic pollution.

7. The Hijab has no place in British culture where people can express themselves and wear what they like. The Hijab says "I don't wish to integrate with your culture." Dressing modestly with a Hijab is not discussed in the Qur'an, it stems from Muslim men who raped women for not dressing modestly.

i doubt that will happen, ukip got 13% of the first try, next year were gonna win, trust in farage my friend trust in farage

I think this 35% statistic is a distortion of a Pew Research Poll conducted in 2007.

The poll asked whether suicide bombing and other forms of violence against civilian targets to defend Islam could be justified. It found that 70% of Muslims in Britain believed it could never be justified, 9% believed it could be justified rarely, 12% sometimes, and 3% thought it could be justified often.

So, it didn't exactly find that "35% of British Muslims think suicidal bombings are justified" but it did find far greater support than the 0.67% your own survey data revealed. (Pew interviewed 60,000 people which is a slightly larger sample than your 149!)

So the amount of support looks like 24% (assuming the abstainers can be counted with "nevers") That's a pretty alarming number I'm sure you'll agree!

I think what's just as alarming is that in a 2007 poll conducted by the PolicyExchange 36%of 16 to 24-year-olds British Muslims believed that those converting to another religion should be executed. Less than a fifth of those over 55 think thought the same. Make of this horrendous statistic what you will.

You can get a link to these polls through at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_attitudes_towards_terrorism
if you feel so inclined.

Can't tell you what a similar surveys would reveal today.

No, you're right, saying immigration is high doesn't make you a nationalist.

Complaining about 'people are predicting whites will be outnumbered by 2050' on the other hand, probably does make you a nationalist. Why does skin colour have any relevancy in this debate and is it really a big problem that the white population might not be the majority one day? What if all the non-white population fully integrated, would you still have a problem then?

With all the inaccurate posts you've made and I've read, I've long suspected you of being a troll. This confirms it.

Ah okay that actually makes a lot of sense! Thanks for clearing that up : ) I don't deny that there are backward Muslims out there in the world who migrate to the UK and settle here and that some of them may believe this but for the most part, I don't think the majority will ever follow suit to that. That's why I carried out my survey of, ahem, 150 Muslims who claimed to be British because I wanted to see for myself. Still, this is interesting stuff!

I'll check out the poll results. Thanks

Posted from TSR Mobile

This is such utter crap.

Do you ever stop and think about how the general UK population are making Muslims feel when you all talk like this!?!?

I don't see why a large amount of people see the Islam as such a 'bad' religon.Have you forgotten about Christianity and the KKK? We are blaming what a very small minority has done on the majority. For example, imagine seeing the headline 'White British Christian man shoots and kills 14 kids', you wouldn't think twice about his religion, ethnicity or even his gender. You would just call him a nasty and evil man. Why? Because he is a majority. Yet if you saw the same title but, instead of saying 'White British Christian man shoots and kills 14 kids' it said 'Immigrant Muslim man shoots and kills 14 kids' You would look at it and instantly blame Islam. Yet the only difference between the two situations are that the white British christian is a majority, and the Muslim immigrant is the minority.

Why, why, why are people so orientated around this notion of 'majority'? It doesn't matter if it's a 'majority' of Muslims who are this or that, 35% of young British Muslims is more than enough.

If history gives testimony to any notion, it's this: it's never, ever the majority which enacts radical social change, it always comes from the minority. Minorities influence policy, minorities dictate legislation, minorities control the narrative, minorities control the wealth, minorities force revolutions, minorities colonise or go to war with other nation-states, minorities determine the future direction of civilisation.

The only time a majority is ever applicable is in the context of PURE democracy, a type which we don't even have in the UK, other than in the instance of a referendum.

Whether 'all feminists are like that' or 'all Muslims are like that' is utterly irrelevant, when very large minorities of them are.

More hiding behind the ever convenient 'minority' narrative. See my post above. It was also Democrats - the modern day 'progressives' - who formed the KKK.

As for your deference to double standards, I give you my example on the first page. Two white Americans were shot and killed by a black American - the BBC referred to him as 'mentally disabled' and kept reiterating that he was 'bullied and racially abused in the workplace.' It disgusts me - actually disgusts me - how they can appease it. It irritates the hell out of me how they can be so moral relativist (see my post on the first page).

Yet, in the other context - Charleston shootings, where black men were the victim - in near enough every single bit of coverage handed down by the BBC (and there was much more of it than the Virginia shootings), it was referred to as a 'hate crime.' It was cloaked in racial rhetoric.

This is the problem people have with unfettered mass immigration. It's not racism, it's ethnocentrism. People don't have a problem with people of other ethnicities, what they have a massive problem is when people of other ethnicities start revelling in the success of their own ethnicity, start making claims which would, if reversed, be nothing short of outright racism. What they have a massive problem with, in consideration of all this ethnocentrism displayed by non-white ethnicities and migrant groups, is the potential - nay, inevitability - of society being divided up along racial and cultural lines.

The majority does not want that. Minority groups are far more ethnocentric, far more culture-centric, than British residents. THAT is a massive problem, they type of problem which leads to homogeneous communities formed exclusively around ethnocentric identities, i.e., Tower Hamlets, Govanhill, areas in Luton, areas in Birmingham, etc. These communities have been decimated because migrants favour their own and have pronounced own-group biases. I don't want that society, I hate that type of society, that type of society is NOT British.

If migrant communities shifted away from conclaves and assimilated with wider British society, and stopped favouring their own or showing in-group biases, if everyone conformed to your morality (which is nice by the way), then there would be a problem. But here's your issue: 85% of the world (non Western civilisations), is remarkably tribal. Still.

This is the problem people have with unfettered mass immigration. It's not racism, it's the fact minority groups are FAR more ethnocentric than the resident population. People don't have a problem with people of other ethnicities, what they have a massive problem is when people of other ethnicities start revelling in the success of their own ethnicity, start making claims which would, if reversed, be nothing short of outright racism. What they have a massive problem with, in consideration of all this ethnocentrism displayed by non-white ethnicities and migrant groups, is the potential - nay, inevitability - of society being divided up along racial and cultural lines.

The majority does not want that. Minority groups are far more ethnocentric, far more culture-centric, than British residents. THAT is a massive problem, they type of problem which leads to homogeneous communities formed exclusively around ethnocentric identities, i.e., Tower Hamlets, Govanhill, areas in Luton, areas in Birmingham, etc. These communities have been decimated because migrants favour their own and have pronounced own-group biases. I don't want that society, I hate that type of society, that type of society is NOT British.

If migrant communities shifted away from conclaves and assimilated with wider British society, and stopped favouring their own or showing in-group biases, if everyone conformed to your morality (which is nice by the way), then there wouldn't be a problem. But here's your issue: 85% of the world (non Western civilisations), is remarkably tribal. Still.

I see where you're coming from. However this thread isn't about race, its about religion. Many Immigrants come to the UK to have a better life, and they adapt to the British way of life. I do agree with you on the parts about race. But Religion is a whole different subject.

So what you're saying the problem is tribalism. I agree with that 100%. And it does gives cause to d set up double standards like you've mentioned. But the problem is, you can't force people to live where you want them to live. They have freedoms to purchase land and settle where they see fit.

I kind of favor the American system of shipping kids to the other side of the city to make more "multicultural" schools. The only way to stamp out tribalism is through education and that means starting in the schools. What we should do is try to get rid of these all-black, all-white, all-brown schools and force integration through that. My opinion, anyway

Posted from TSR Mobile

England is already an Islamic leaning country. Our value systems are already being eroded as a result of our blind allegiance to the ideology known as multiculturalism (the idea that all value systems in society have to be appeased, even if they conflict with the majority value system, because 'different cultures come from different backgrounds' and we can't expect them to 'behave like us', that would be 'intolerant' and 'bigoted'.

For an example of what this looks like in practice, and what's in store for the UK, just take a look at Sweden.

Part of the problem is that the UK no longer has any consistent notion of what does and does not constitute 'morality', largely because it has spent decades redefining societal roles, determining that nothing is truly moral and pursuing an ideology of nihilism, that nothing is right, nothing is wrong, and to suggest otherwise is bigoted and racist.

In its place - upon the denunciation of religion, or rather Christianity, other religions are allowed to function without scrutiny - we've got moral relativism. We've got outcomes which suggest that suggest when a morality is applied in one context it's 'diverse' or 'tolerant' and when it's applied in another it's 'bigoted', 'racist', 'sexist', 'misogynistic', etc. What many seemingly fail to realise is that it's this cultural and moral abyss which is at the heart of every single frustration in British society.

Harriet Harman declares it would be 'rude' to interfere with a labour party event segregated along gender lines to appeal to Muslim voters. Change the context: gender segregation amongst white people = society goes mad.

Goldsmith University declares white men should be banned from attending diversity events. Change the context: black people being banned from diversity events. Society goes mad.

The BBC recently focused on the shooting of two Virginia reporters. They were shot by a black man. He was 'mentally ill' and 'being racially abused' at work. Change the context: the Charleston shootings. Black people were the victims, it received far more coverage, and it was deemed a 'hate crime' (these words were never used by the BBC in relation to Virginia).

Any time a white police shoots an unarmed black man, it's front page news. It's an example of 'systemic discrimination and racism.' Change the context: 93% of black people are killed by other black people. Black people are 13% of the population in the US, yet perpetrate 52% of all homicides. More unarmed white people are killed by the police every year than unarmed black people. No-one mentions these statistics, particularly not on the BBC.

The Independent creates a post entitled 'white men should never hold elected position in British Universities again.' Change the context: mass outrage. The response to this post was 'reverse racism isn't real. As white people hold all the power, it's impossible to be racist towards other white people.' Yep.

The BBC launches into a tirade against St Andrews golf club. It's sexist, archaic and discriminatory - it only admits men. Change the context: women-only networking groups, gyms, taxi firms, political party conferences, business conferences, etc. No-one cares.

The Irish referendum is hailed as a beacon of 'progressivism.' People all over vote in favour of the morality 'people should be free to marry whoever they choose' and exploit narratives like 'homophobia' to make everyone else conform to their narrow perspectives on what is 'right and wrong.' All who oppose will be kicked into social exile. Change the context: apply the same morality - 'people should be free to marry whoever they choose - in the context of incestuous marriage. Suddenly, all of those making accusations of bigotry appear just as bigoted as the people are accusing. 'Incestuous marriage is icky.'

Tim Farron was recently elected as leader of the Liberal Democrats. He was questioned incessantly about his views on homosexuality. Change the context: when was the last time you ever witnessed an Islamic politician or Lord, or an Imam, being questioned on their views on homosexuality? Trust me, they are 10 times worse.

I could literally be here all day.

However, we've created the conditions for ethnocentrism. Non-white groups, cultures and ethnicities are FAR more ethnocentric and tribal than white people (or, like women, are far more likely to demonstrate an own-group bias). Many journalists from minority groups openly assert they prefer their own ethnicity. When groups like the EDL profess this, it's the precise definition of racism. As far as the Guardian is concerned, it's 'progressive', and it's painted as such. Even though it's blatantly ethnocentric and verging on racism.

The meek feminised culture which has been taught decades worth of self-loathing - largely by groups eager to exploit narratives or accentuate only one side of the narrative to produce an outcome which resembles whiteness = racism, heterosexuality = homophobia and maleness = sexism - is absolutely incapable of standing up for itself in the face of a true threat. It doesn't know how to look evil in the eye and deal with it. All it knows is 'tolerance' and 'diversity', 'evil white man' and white male = pathological.

What's the outcome? 170,000 instances of FGM, forced marriages, welfare payments for polygamous marriages, Sharia patrols in London boroughs, extensive 'white flight' from our national capital city, the gradual implementation of a separate legal system (Sharia courts, there are now upwards of 100 all across the country), 100 extremists being admitted onto the Government's 'prevent' programme or deradicalisation training every single week, electoral fraud in Tower Hamlets, the sexual molestation of thousands of white girls - based purely on the colour of their skin - by Pakistani grooming gangs in 27+ towns and cities all over the UK, the Islamification of British schools in Birmingham (by covert measures), communities being overtaken by Islamic culture (ie, Tower Hamlets is now 32% Bangladeshi and is certainly NOT 'multicultural' and a lot more besides.

All the while, certain minority groups spend all of their time being ethnocentric and telling the majority population how s**t and evil they are. Being the self-loathing society we now are - we always bow to a false accusation or shaming tactics - we sit there and take it.

Of course, this is hardly the whole picture. We'd have to look at the mountain of surveys to see that.

60% of Muslims would reject homosexuals as friends.

66% of Muslims believe that religious law is more important than the law of the land in which they live.

45% of Muslims think Jews can’t be trusted.

75% of Muslims believe there’s only one legitimate interpretation of the Koran.

45% of Muslims believe Western Civilisation is out to destroy Islam.

http://www.wzb.eu/en/press-release/islamic-fundamentalism-is-widely-spread

The survey was conducted across six European countries and solicited responses from 9,000 Muslims.

35% of young Muslims in Britain believe suicide bombings are justified.

42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified.

22% of young Muslims in Germany believe suicide bombings are justified.

29% of young Muslims in Spain believe suicide bombings are justified.

http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

40% of Muslims want Sharia Law introduced in the UK.

20% of British Muslims (520,000 people) sympathise with 7/7 bombers.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-40pc-of-Muslims-want-sharia-law-in-UK.html

An alternative survey suggests as many as 25% of British Muslims sympathise with the 7/7 bombers.

28% of British Muslims hope the UK will become a religious fundamentalist Islamic state.

78% of British Muslims support punishment for those who publish cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed.

62% of British Muslims believe free speech shouldn’t be protected when it offends religious groups.

68% of British Muslims support the arrest and prosecution of British people who insult Islam.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/many-british-muslims-put-islam-first/

Since when did Britain First rebrand itself? Bunch of rets in this thread I swear...

Completely agree

Addressed in my previous post. You can't educate this out of them, we aren't all-powerful. It's utter naivety to believe you can control thought processes, or the pressure imposed by a lifetime of cultural indoctrination. Very few people leave Islam, Islam is innately tribal. You can't change that. You can't engineer it. You aren't God.

As long as people exist they will pursue own-group biases, it's natural, it's ingrained. All human beings extend trust to outsiders with a great deal of caution - you can't defeat that, particularly when, as far as Islam is concerned, the outsider is 'western civilisation.'

Some cultures propagate it (tribalism) more than others, but all people are tribal to one degree or another. Even if you could 'educate it out of them' - and faith isn't something I'm happy to engage in, which is what you're asking of me - you can't keep up with it. You can't get to the Muslim community, they don't want you to. They want you to leave them alone. If we could have engineered it out of them, we would have done it already - yet they are still congregating together, marrying within and socialising within, all over the UK. Nothing has changed. They don't want to assimilate, they never will assimilate, because they are far, far more attached to their value system than the rest of the population is to its value system.

There's also nothing worse as far as I'm concerned than unleashing a religion as tribal as Islam on a society which has pursued a course of moral apathy for the last 5 decades. It's - western civilisation - ripe for exploitation.