Have the police lost control?
The rate of crime is going up, people do not fear the police anymore, they know the police won’t catch them
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Doesn't sound accurate. Why are you so sure they cant catch you?
Original post by ALEreapp
It’s not even about being caught, it’s the fact they know the punishment will be a slap on the wrist. Steal hundreds of thousands from people through fraud? A year in prison not even having to pay a penny back… seems like they haven’t lost anything really 😬
Well we've raised our prison pop by about 20% since last year, so we're apparently jailing people for something.
Original post by StriderHort
Well we've raised our prison pop by about 20% since last year, so we're apparently jailing people for something.
Going to prison does not mean it’s not a slap on the wrist, people go to prison for a year for rape that doesn’t make it sufficient punishment
Original post by ALEreapp
Going to prison does not mean it’s not a slap on the wrist, people go to prison for a year for rape that doesn’t make it sufficient punishment
It doesn't mean it IS a slap on the wrist either? It's easy to cherry pick and sensationalise results you didn't like. I'm seeing a few sources claim the average UK rape sentence is actually 4-11 years - so your example of 1 year sounds a somewhat extreme outlier surely?
Like I'm not saying you can't come back here quoting a story of someone who got 1 year for whatever reason, but it feels a bit dishonest not to make clear if that's not the norm.
Original post by StriderHort
It doesn't mean it IS a slap on the wrist either? It's easy to cherry pick and sensationalise results you didn't like. I'm seeing a few sources claim the average UK rape sentence is actually 4-11 years - so your example of 1 year sounds a somewhat extreme outlier surely?
Like I'm not saying you can't come back here quoting a story of someone who got 1 year for whatever reason, but it feels a bit dishonest not to make clear if that's not the norm.
Like I'm not saying you can't come back here quoting a story of someone who got 1 year for whatever reason, but it feels a bit dishonest not to make clear if that's not the norm.
You act like 4-11 years is enough for such a disgusting act (especially with there being a massive difference in that) lol so my example is quite literally irrelevant to the point that it’s a slap on the wrist.
I should probably add aswell a sentence vs how long is actually served are very different things, it’s very common for people to serve half their sentence inside then the rest outside.
(edited 5 months ago)
I’d also disagree quite strongly that people should fear the police. That rather misses the point of them being public servants.
Original post by ALEreapp
You act like 4-11 years is enough for such a disgusting act (especially with there being a massive difference in that) lol so my example is quite literally irrelevant to the point that it’s a slap on the wrist.
I should probably add aswell a sentence vs how long is actually served are very different things, it’s very common for people to serve half their sentence inside then the rest outside.
I should probably add aswell a sentence vs how long is actually served are very different things, it’s very common for people to serve half their sentence inside then the rest outside.
No I didn't act like that, I drew your attention to a stated average sentence vastly different to your example. I'm somewhat grimly amused that I was correct you would try and immediately move the goalposts to 'no punishment is enough' etc when challenged on 1 year being an outlier. % of sentence served in prison or not, factors beyond the crime itself affect this both positively and negatively, but again you don't want to mention that someone can serve longer than their sentence because it doesn't suit.
Original post by StriderHort
No I didn't act like that, I drew your attention to a stated average sentence vastly different to your example. I'm somewhat grimly amused that I was correct you would try and immediately move the goalposts to 'no punishment is enough' etc when challenged on 1 year being an outlier. % of sentence served in prison or not, factors beyond the crime itself affect this both positively and negatively, but again you don't want to mention that someone can serve longer than their sentence because it doesn't suit.
I never stated what I said was an average, I simply stated *people* go to prison for a year for rape which is accurate and there was no correction at all. You made an assumption of something I never said, I never set a goalpost either so I didn’t move anything.
People do not just serve longer than their sentence eg it’s extended, there is always a reason but serving longer is far far rarer than serving less than.
(edited 5 months ago)
The police are certainly part of the problem because they are much too lax in their duties (BLM protests for example) but less per capita growth in police funding over the past decade has been a larger factor in the reason that policing has deteriorated.
The other big problem though as has been pointed out is the judicial element. Judges are much too liberal being part of the high income metropolitan class and legislation allows for overly weak sentencing since it's not something that is typically a priority issue for the electorate.
The other big problem though as has been pointed out is the judicial element. Judges are much too liberal being part of the high income metropolitan class and legislation allows for overly weak sentencing since it's not something that is typically a priority issue for the electorate.
Original post by Thislife100121
The rate of crime is going up, people do not fear the police anymore, they know the police won’t catch them
What are you basing this idea on? ONS seems to think we are at record lows both in reported crime and crime experienced
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67161967
Original post by StriderHort
Doesn't sound accurate. Why are you so sure they cant catch you?
Because there are none. Crime has basically been legalised. I hope those on the left are happy, their wish of defunding the police has happened without them lifting a finger after a successive string of governments decided to line their grubby little pockets instead of investing in public infrastructure.
Kings speech here will be the last grasp of hope. Tougher sentencing, building a lot more prisons. That’s what I’d like to see.
Those like myself can’t win. The ‘Conservatives’ have given up on law and order and when Labour get in it’ll be all cuddly and rehabilitative. I’ve never ever felt so outcast from politics.
Original post by Rakas21
The police are certainly part of the problem because they are much too lax in their duties (BLM protests for example) but less per capita growth in police funding over the past decade has been a larger factor in the reason that policing has deteriorated.
The other big problem though as has been pointed out is the judicial element. Judges are much too liberal being part of the high income metropolitan class and legislation allows for overly weak sentencing since it's not something that is typically a priority issue for the electorate.
The other big problem though as has been pointed out is the judicial element. Judges are much too liberal being part of the high income metropolitan class and legislation allows for overly weak sentencing since it's not something that is typically a priority issue for the electorate.
Weak spineless sentencing is by far my biggest issue. They have some of the powers but totally reject using them. Build more prisons, build a new type of category ‘A’ prisons for lifetime inhabitants similar to a cesspit and get lifetime offenders through the courts. Those with 60 or so convictions haven’t learned their lesson and should be locked up for life.
Of course this happens in other countries such as Singapore and the Middle East. In before ‘but the ones in charge are those committing the crimes.’
Original post by imlikeahermit
Because there are none. Crime has basically been legalised. I hope those on the left are happy, their wish of defunding the police has happened without them lifting a finger after a successive string of governments decided to line their grubby little pockets instead of investing in public infrastructure.
Kings speech here will be the last grasp of hope. Tougher sentencing, building a lot more prisons. That’s what I’d like to see.
Those like myself can’t win. The ‘Conservatives’ have given up on law and order and when Labour get in it’ll be all cuddly and rehabilitative. I’ve never ever felt so outcast from politics.
Kings speech here will be the last grasp of hope. Tougher sentencing, building a lot more prisons. That’s what I’d like to see.
Those like myself can’t win. The ‘Conservatives’ have given up on law and order and when Labour get in it’ll be all cuddly and rehabilitative. I’ve never ever felt so outcast from politics.
Bearing in mind I know fine well you are a crime & punishment extremist and would never be happy... claiming there's no police, crime is legalised and the police have been defunded is just obviously and demonstrably dishonest. By all means say you aren't happy, but don't wildly exaggerate if you want to be taken in any way seriously. Likewise trying to paint this as left or right.
13 years of Conservative governments + Effectively criminalising protests = tHE LefT HaVe HAD TheIr Way
Original post by StriderHort
Bearing in mind I know fine well you are a crime & punishment extremist and would never be happy... claiming there's no police, crime is legalised and the police have been defunded is just obviously and demonstrably dishonest. By all means say you aren't happy, but don't wildly exaggerate if you want to be taken in any way seriously. Likewise trying to paint this as left or right.
Want appropriate punishment for crime = extremism. Wow.
But quite frankly, are you in denial? I know you absolutely love to play devils advocate but are actually suggesting that the police haven’t been defunded by successive governments?
Did you then also miss the headlines about shoplifting under £200 basically being legalised? Police just don’t bother.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/inside-town-shoplifting-ruins-lives-30635013#
Can’t stand all this just pure denial. Bizarre.
(edited 5 months ago)
Original post by imlikeahermit
Because there are none. Crime has basically been legalised. I hope those on the left are happy, their wish of defunding the police has happened without them lifting a finger after a successive string of governments decided to line their grubby little pockets instead of investing in public infrastructure.
Kings speech here will be the last grasp of hope. Tougher sentencing, building a lot more prisons. That’s what I’d like to see.
Those like myself can’t win. The ‘Conservatives’ have given up on law and order and when Labour get in it’ll be all cuddly and rehabilitative. I’ve never ever felt so outcast from politics.
Kings speech here will be the last grasp of hope. Tougher sentencing, building a lot more prisons. That’s what I’d like to see.
Those like myself can’t win. The ‘Conservatives’ have given up on law and order and when Labour get in it’ll be all cuddly and rehabilitative. I’ve never ever felt so outcast from politics.
Why are you blaming the left when fault lies with the Conservative government and those who voted for them who are responsible for the state of the country over the last 13 years?
Why are sitting there passively waiting for someone else to bring about political change?
Your perspective highlights both the intellectual and moral failure of the current British right: it’s abject abandonment of any sense of personal responsibility, that is why you are becoming such outcasts.
Original post by Gazpacho.
Why are you blaming the left when fault lies with the Conservative government and those who voted for them who are responsible for the state of the country over the last 13 years?
Why are sitting there passively waiting for someone else to bring about political change?
Your perspective highlights both the intellectual and moral failure of the current British right: it’s abject abandonment of any sense of personal responsibility, that is why you are becoming such outcasts.
Why are sitting there passively waiting for someone else to bring about political change?
Your perspective highlights both the intellectual and moral failure of the current British right: it’s abject abandonment of any sense of personal responsibility, that is why you are becoming such outcasts.
I’m not blaming the left at all. I’ve been very clear both on here in the past and now that the fault lies with the current administration and the halfwit voters that voted it back in. However, I’m simply saying I hope the left are happy. The extreme left wanted the police defunded and that’s exactly what they’ve got.
Original post by imlikeahermit
Want appropriate punishment for crime = extremism. Wow.
But quite frankly, are you in denial? I know you absolutely love to play devils advocate but are actually suggesting that the police haven’t been defunded by successive governments?
Did you then also miss the headlines about shoplifting under £200 basically being legalised? Police just don’t bother.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/inside-town-shoplifting-ruins-lives-30635013#
Can’t stand all this just pure denial. Bizarre.
But quite frankly, are you in denial? I know you absolutely love to play devils advocate but are actually suggesting that the police haven’t been defunded by successive governments?
Did you then also miss the headlines about shoplifting under £200 basically being legalised? Police just don’t bother.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/inside-town-shoplifting-ruins-lives-30635013#
Can’t stand all this just pure denial. Bizarre.
Your definitions of appropriate punishment are in excess of the norm, we both know it. (You mentioned something about intentionally building 'cesspits' for people earlier?)
I'm not denying for a second the UK has issues with crime, funding, police conduct and the legal system, but frankly I'm a bit too aware and educated to fall for or accept all this emotive exaggeration. You can cherry pick newsworthy articles to your hearts content but the majority of police & court work never reaches your ears and you've no motive to seek it out.
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