The Student Room Group

Scroll to see replies

Reply 181
Original post by edwinemanuelposse
I think even 12 is a good age to vote, the younger one learns the better !


I believe 16 year olds can make a conscious vote but, in my opinion at least, 12 is pushing it a bit far. I 100% agree on the fact that the younger one learns the better, but perhaps including political education in the curriculum would be better than allowing 12 year olds the right to vote.

If I had it my way, a possibility would be, political studies since 12 and then at 16 the right to vote. :P
Original post by RBRo
True, at 16 you can go to work, start paying taxes and start living independently through your hard earned earnings. You can even join the army.

16 years olds are therefore more than deserving of their own vote.


I've answered an identical post to this one before, but I'll do it again. You can work and pay taxes before the age of 16, you'll struggle to live independently (you can't sign any of the documents until you turn 18, so you still have to have permission), and you can't actually be deployed to the front line until you're 18 in the military. Anyway, all these points aside, I think 2 years can make a lot of difference to maturity, particularly during the teenage years. At 16, I was certainly far less capable of making informed decisions about important matters than at 18.
Reply 183
I'm 18 and I think that 18 is too young to vote. You need to have lived without your parents for a few years in my opinion. 21 sounds like a reasonable minimum.
Original post by wig44
I'm 18 and I think that 18 is too young to vote. You need to have lived without your parents for a few years in my opinion. 21 sounds like a reasonable minimum.


Thats right, good that u know urself so well ! The human brain is only fulgrown when u reached the age of 23, and then a person can be wise anough to vote !!!
Original post by The Epicurean
Well I shall have to go against the grain and say yes it should be. Those who are 16 and aren't interested in politics will most likely not vote. Those who are interested and do understand will get to vote. Ignorance to politics is not something that is limited to 16 and 17 year old only. There are so many older people who are also completely ignorant. Surely if your logic is to stop ignorant people from getting the vote, you would be better off basing suffrage upon IQ :rolleyes:

I think there is too much negativity towards young people and everyone assumes that they are all uneducated and ignorant. I wouldn't agree with this and I think that there are many intelligent 16 year old more than capable of making good political decisions. Also, currently in politics, the baby boomer generation wields so much political power due to having large numbers who vote and obviously all political parties prioritise trying to appease the baby boomers generation. More young people from our generation should help make us a larger and more important demographic which would get politicans to recognise and to take more seriously issues effecting our generation as a whole.


But i could use that argument to say ten year olds should vote. After i remember i was interested in politics at 10, and "those who aren't interested in politics at 10 won't vote". I would disagree with that statement, as i would argue those who are misinformed about politics will still vote, but will simply vote for the wrong reasons. I think the point you raised is a problem applicable to all arbitrary age limits, but i think its fair to say we have to draw the line somewhere, and i really dont think that 18 is unreasonable.
Reply 186
Original post by wig44
I'm 18 and I think that 18 is too young to vote. You need to have lived without your parents for a few years in my opinion. 21 sounds like a reasonable minimum.


Most kids already spend plenty of time away from parents before they even move out. Going out with friends from as young as 12 (at least in my circle of friends), meeting many different people in these social outings, meeting your friends' parents who have different opinions to your own, etc.

In general our generation doesn't really spend much time listening to parents or even talking to them. In fact, when a parent tells you something there's that itch inside you that you just can't scratch unless you rebel a bit. (not to say we're all anarchists but hey, the idea to rebel is still there. XD)

So to say that until we move out at the age of 23, 20, 25, we don't become individuals who can make our own ideas and decisions is just unlikely.

Not to mention nowadays many of us have access to the internet which is an infinite source of information. Where you meet hundreds of people with just as many views and opinions.

I don't think parents are as influential as some people think.
Reply 187
Original post by RBRo
At 16 you CAN go to university. I have a friend who skipped to grades in primary hence finished early.
It's irrelevant though. Most might not go to university at 16 but you WILL in two years when the prices would have already been changed.
It's just a small example.


At 16, you CAN pay tax, you CAN go to University, you CAN do a lot of things.

The reality is that virtually all 16 year olds do not do any of those things.

Quite frankly, since they contribute zero to the system and are effectively leechers, they have no right to tell other people to pay more money into the system.
I'd say yes to lowering the age to 16. Where I am from (Guernsey) the voting age is 16 so I have voted before. To be fair from the people I've spoken to from my year group at the time of voting (the year of our election was the year we became 16), most people who were bothering to vote seemed to actually care about the politicians in question and actually think about who they were voting for.

In my opinion the bigger issue is that you can't trust the politicians to do what they claim to do if they get into power. That and many politicians manifestos were too fluffy i.e. trying to sound nice but not actually saying where they stand on issues. This was my personal experience of voting when I was 16 anyway :smile:
Just because I know how easily persuaded and naive I was at sixteen, I choose eighteen
Reply 190
No, they probably don't even know who is running.
Reply 191
Original post by Rgman27
At 16, you CAN pay tax, you CAN go to University, you CAN do a lot of things.

The reality is that virtually all 16 year olds do not do any of those things.

Quite frankly, since they contribute zero to the system and are effectively leechers, they have no right to tell other people to pay more money into the system.


a) most people are 'leechers' as you call them, until they actually start working, more or less at the age of 23-25 which is when they finish university. (for those that DO go to university) Not to mention that not everyone gets a job straight after graduating.

b) The ones who are paying more into the 'system' is US now, and the 16 year olds when they DO get into university (again, those that decide to go to university). We're paying triple university prices. To help the economy? What would help the economy is if the government hadn't given massive tax cuts to the corporations that caused most of the economic mess in the first place. Corporations are not 'people'. Hence they should pay their share instead of having the CEOs giving themselves massive bonuses whilst their employees are laid off in the process of driving the economy to the ground.

£27,000 in debt when most of us graduate (if we only do a 3 year course)
As opposed to £9,000. All this whilst those wonderful CEOs spend a nice vacation somewhere tropical. Don't you just love democracy?
It is a difficult one. There are some odd anomalies in the law in this country. For example, a 16 year old is allowed to consent to sex, yet is not allowed to buy sex aids until they are 18. Is it just me, or does that not make sense? At the end of the day, a person at 16, can pay tax, NI, and be called up to the Armed Forces, so if a 16 is paying tax, then surely they should have a say who is in charge of the country.
No. Most 16 year olds don't have the maturity.
Original post by charliemac41
But i could use that argument to say ten year olds should vote. After i remember i was interested in politics at 10, and "those who aren't interested in politics at 10 won't vote". I would disagree with that statement, as i would argue those who are misinformed about politics will still vote, but will simply vote for the wrong reasons. I think the point you raised is a problem applicable to all arbitrary age limits, but i think its fair to say we have to draw the line somewhere, and i really dont think that 18 is unreasonable.


I agree that we have to draw the line somewhere, but I disagree with the reasoning a lot of people provide within this thread. Most responses so far in this thread have been that 16 year olds are ignorant ergo 16 years olds shouldn't vote. If this is the logic we should follow, then surely we should base suffrage upon IQ (not a perfect way of measuring lack of ignorance but shall suffice for this example) as many older people of voting age are also ignorant.

Obviously you are implying the Argument of the Beard or the Continuum Fallacy, whereby it is impossible to draw a line between X and Y. My main reasoning was less based upon the case of ignorance but upon the fact that the generation that represents the baby boomers wield more political clout due to their numbers. The increase in numbers of voters within the demographic representing us through the extension of suffrage to those who are 16 and 17 years old would get politicans to recognise and to take more seriously issues effecting our generation as a whole.

I was merely claiming that denying 16 year olds the vote based upon ignorance isn't a proper argument and one can easily construct a 'Reductio ad Absurdum' argument, which you did in your case of the 10 year old you, and thus prove ignorance and age to be unrelated factors which do not help us solve the problem as to where the arbitrary age limit should be placed along the continuum.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by The Epicurean
I agree that we have to draw the line somewhere, but I disagree with the reasoning a lot of people provide within this thread. Most responses so far in this thread have been that 16 year olds are ignorant ergo 16 years olds shouldn't vote. If this is the logic we should follow, then surely we should base suffrage upon IQ (not a perfect way of measuring lack of ignorance but shall suffice for this example) as many older people of voting age are also ignorant.

Obviously you are implying the Argument of the Beard or the Continuum Fallacy, whereby it is impossible to draw a line between X and Y. My main reasoning was less based upon the case of ignorance but upon the fact that the generation that represents the baby boomers wield more political clout due to their numbers. The increase in numbers of voters within the demographic representing us through the extension of suffrage to those who are 16 and 17 years old would get politicans to recognise and to take more seriously issues effecting our generation as a whole.

I was merely claiming that denying 16 year olds the vote based upon ignorance isn't a proper argument and one can easily construct a 'Reductio ad Absurdum' argument, which you did in your case of the 10 year old you, and thus prove ignorance and age to be unrelated factors which do not help us solve the problem as to where the arbitrary age limit should be placed along the continuum.

I completely agree with everything you say above, I would merely differ in opinion as to where along the continuum the age limit should be placed. I would argue that since an overwhelming majority of 16 year olds don't have jobs or don't earn enough to pay tax, and a huge majority of them are still in school, that 16 is too early to say all people would vote, although obviously, this disadvantages those 16 year olds who are educated politically and could vote.
I believe this thread will make a difference to our daily lives and the voting situation. Not.

Cut off point is fine at 18! Only a minority of 16 year olds will be educated in politics maybe those who choose history/politics at GCSE. Why change the vote age for a minority.


Posted from TSR Mobile
Reply 197
The type of 16 year old who use this site, most probably yes

When I was 16 I was trying to get laid, not engaging in silly debates that bare no relevance in society
Reply 198
The 16/17 years old who actually bother to vote will be unlikely to be ignorant. Turnouts already very low among the young.

It might also help give the young a little more political bargaining power against the grey block.
Reply 199
To be fair, it seems like the general population themselves seem jaded about politics. I'd hazard to say the people who truly have a coherent grasp of all political aspects are in the minority, and very few people even follow it consistently.

Latest

Trending

Trending