My ideal society.

Original post by illegaltobepoor

Definition would be defined by the democracy as long that it doesn't break the constitution of basic needs.

Love it.

So what happens if the masses of shelf stackers vote for themselves to be in the top category and the doctors and engineers to be in the bottom category?

Reply 22

OP

Original post by Clip

Love it.

So what happens if the masses of shelf stackers vote for themselves to be in the top category and the doctors and engineers to be in the bottom category?

They can't go against anything written in the constitution.

Reply 23

Original post by illegaltobepoor

They can't go against anything written in the constitution.

You're just making it up as you go along. This is proper Animal Farm type stuff.

I love it.

Reply 24

OP

Original post by nohomo

Illegaltobepoor I thought you were actually a good guy from your defence of the vulnerable in other threads.

But what you seem to be advocating here is worse than death for me as a disabled person.

I don't want to be told I can only watch TV for an hour or use internet for.an.hour and be fed on a diet of stale bread and unsugared weetabix. The current system is actually better to me. I would be no more productive if you punished me for being disabled by taking away luxuries while doctors who I'd beaten at school got everything. I'd probably blow my head off if you didn't ****ing find a way to take that right away.

Also by limiting the disabled to very little internet you limit their political voice on matters which could be life or death for them.

Well I have only written a little bit of it. Let me clear up the responsibilities of disabled people.

Lets say for example you was born as a disabled person or become ill or had a accident. You would be assessed medically and then a Doctor would decide what you can and cannot do.

So for example. If you can use a computer but you can't walk then people would help you with your strengths.

The thing with Socialism is we focus on human potential to allow people to thrive.

And who says your going to be eating stale bread lol. The diet would mainly be high concentrations of healthy food.

As for contribution you could be a video call agent and help people find telephone numbers?

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 25

nohomo

5

Original post by illegaltobepoor

They can't go against anything written in the constitution.

Can you describe what I'd be allowed to do as someone who is mentally ill and cannot work?

What can I eat? Can I always be allowed to read books that interest me? Do I get any allowance for the little treats that help make my life bearable? Where so I live? Do I get a flat all to myself?

Reply 26

OP

Original post by nohomo

Can you describe what I'd be allowed to do as someone who is mentally ill and cannot work?

What can I eat? Can I always be allowed to read books that interest me? Do I get any allowance for the little treats that help make my life bearable? Where so I live? Do I get a flat all to myself?

You would have housing for yourself. 1 bedroom apartment with mobility adaptations if you need them. There would be a warden for every 20 households so you would at least get a hour of personalized care per day.

The diet would be everything what you would expect in a caffetteria. Things like Sunday roast or Pasta Bake.

There would be sufficient entertainment allowances but you would have to contribute a little. You could be a mentor for a younger disabled person and teach them how to manage their condition and form relationships to prevent them and yourself being lonely.

You will live in a community of disabled people but have access to the main town hub where you will enjoy social inclusiveness with other factions/classes.

Reply 27

nohomo

5

Original post by illegaltobepoor

You would have housing for yourself. 1 bedroom apartment with mobility adaptations if you need them. There would be a warden for every 20 households so you would at least get a hour of personalized care per day.

The diet would be everything what you would expect in a caffetteria. Things like Sunday roast or Pasta Bake.

There would be sufficient entertainment allowances but you would have to contribute a little. You could be a mentor for a younger disabled person and teach them how to manage their condition and form relationships to prevent them and yourself being lonely.

You will live in a community of disabled people but have access to the main town hub where you will enjoy social inclusiveness with other factions/classes.

Well it doesn't sound bad actually. Bit bizarre maybe...

Reply 28

OP

Original post by Clip

You're just making it up as you go along. This is proper Animal Farm type stuff.

I love it.

Yes. But its to see what kind of society we would want to live in and how we would make it work.

Reply 29

OP

Original post by nohomo

Well it doesn't sound bad actually. Bit bizarre maybe...

I've watched a lot of dystopia, sci-fi and doomsday films. At some point in the human races existence I hope we can move toward being benevolent beings.

Reply 30

Original post by illegaltobepoor

Yes. But its to see what kind of society we would want to live in and how we would make it work.

The problem you have is that you are trying to make up a political system and parachute it on to a society, because you think you have all the answers and you are so angry with what you perceive as the iniquities of what we have. It would be a disaster.

What we have was not introduced in such a way, and it grew up over many hundreds of years, and it works as well as it does.

When political systems are introduced in a hurry - you get nightmares like the old Soviet Union.

Reply 31

OP

Original post by Clip

The problem you have is that you are trying to make up a political system and parachute it on to a society, because you think you have all the answers and you are so angry with what you perceive as the iniquities of what we have. It would be a disaster.

What we have was not introduced in such a way, and it grew up over many hundreds of years, and it works as well as it does.

When political systems are introduced in a hurry - you get nightmares like the old Soviet Union.

I agree on the latter but Crony Capitalism does not work.

Reply 32

Original post by illegaltobepoor

I agree on the latter but Crony Capitalism does not work.

Yes it does. It's not perfect. but we're all still here. The other systems have failed and left chaos in their wake.

The socialist and "communist" systems of the world have been disasters.

Reply 33

plasmaman

18

Original post by nohomo

In my ideal society everyone gets paid based on school performance

Assuming you got 12 A*s then

Reply 34

DErasmus

3

Original post by plasmaman

Assuming you got 12 A*s then

i hope he was joking because its the most retarded idea ive ever heard, id rather have a cow as supreme leader than introduce that policy.

Reply 35

plasmaman

18

Original post by DErasmus

i hope he was joking because its the most retarded idea ive ever heard, id rather have a cow as supreme leader than introduce that policy.

If he wasn't joking lets hope he never gets into politics...
Although it would transform the school social hierarchy system

Reply 36

OP

Original post by Clip

Yes it does. It's not perfect. but we're all still here. The other systems have failed and left chaos in their wake.

The socialist and "communist" systems of the world have been disasters.

Well we have a while to go yet until QE3+4 takes the whole western world into hyper inflation.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 37

Lambrook

Original post by illegaltobepoor

Well we have a while to go yet until QE3+4 takes the whole western world into hyper inflation.

Well this is a pretence of knowledge. As I have mentioned elsewhere, if commercial banks don't expand the money supply to the demand of money, which did happen in USA and UK after the GFC. Then the FED can print money out of nothing so that the demand for money is meet. This can be done without hyperinflation ever occurring. On another note though, this quote comes to mind to critique your utopia.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design." - F. A. Hayek.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 38

zippity.doodah

3

I understand why you called it "ideal" because honestly, whether the principles are ideologically sound or not (e.g. pretty much communism from what you've described where the state controls how much you get and all that) it logically won't work - socialism isn't a competitive national society that brings in growth and production, it is one where those in charge aren#t affected by their economic actions because their pay is regardless of their efforts but based on "how hard their job is" (as opposed to private business) an therefore they can afford to make a lot more mistakes, those that are skilled will immigrate (and hence we'll run out of skilled people), those who want to make jobs will emigrate elsewhere because they'll make much more money, and if workers are paid more than their labour is worth, we will not be able to compete against others in the world and thus we will not only fail to gain money/materials, but we'll actively *lose* money because we won't be able to import or export effectively (north korea is a prime example of a country that tries to rely on its own economy/materials). this simply can't work if we want an increasingly productive and developed country; humans don't want to be communist, they want the most for themselves and that shouldn't be punished, both because their nature isn't immoral and their likely actions are lucrative to the country overall, especially long term

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 39