Are Science degrees valued the same as Humanities; I think not

Science students are not taught to question, but rather accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 1

C-rated

2

Yeah, but at least it will get us a job.

Reply 2

Implication

18

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather than accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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not entirely true (e.g. proving things in physics and being told historical facts), but the generalisation does work quite roughly i guess

depends what you're asking though. they're valued differently by different people.

Reply 3

username853993

21

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather than accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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I am going to assume you dont study science or maths as being taught to question why things work and discovering how the work is the whole point of science!

If you just accepted how the science works then youd actually make a terrible scientist/researcher

I think stem and non stem should be valued equally both have their merits, the 2 areas are just different (and again within those areas there are still huge differences between specific subjects)

Reply 4

ODES_PDES

18

http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=4066987

Reply 5

floury

OP

2

Original post by C-rated

Yeah, but at least it will get us a job.

Haha that's what you think. I honestly don't see the point in a degree where you're not encouraged what's told to you.

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Reply 6

Maker

20

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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You are incorrect. Humanities have no objective truth so it depends on consensus as to what is right or wrong. If someone does not agree with consensus, they are wrong and get marked down accordingly.

Science has more objective truth so there is a real right and wrong and many people have questioned what is right and wrong. For example, string theory is still hotly debated, many people try to disprove relativity and evolution and in any gathering of scientists, there is a lot of debate over how facts are interpreted and what conclusions can be drawn.

If you want to start threads, its useful to be at least have a little knowledge of what you are talking about.

Reply 7

Implication

18

Original post by Maker

You are incorrect. Humanities have no objective truth so it depends on consensus as to what is right or wrong. If someone does not agree with consensus, they are wrong and get marked down accordingly.

Science has more objective truth so there is a real right and wrong and many people have questioned what is right and wrong. For example, string theory is still hotly debated, many people try to disprove relativity and evolution and in any gathering of scientists, there is a lot of debate over how facts are interpreted and what conclusions can be drawn.

If you want to start threads, its useful to be at least have a little knowledge of what you are talking about.

what makes you think this is so?

Reply 8

username1539513

21

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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I don't think you understand what science and maths actually are. They are objective truths with can be proven and replicated time and time again based on the availability of current and past evidence.

Non science degrees are based primarily on subjects which are subject to interpretation and cannot be proven. Thus they are subjective truths, not objective, provable truths (with maybe the exception of history and archaeology)

Reply 9

Comus

10

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

Perhaps at the lower level (say primary and secondary education), but certainly from A level onwards, there's a lot of evaluating the methodology and conclusions of studies and the like. The scientific method - itself a product of epistemology - is all about questioning: 'does the evidence support the hypothesis?', 'is the sample representative?', 'what conclusions can be drawn from these observations?'.

That's not to say that the humanities aren't useful but they pose a very different set of questions.

Reply 10

chemting

16

I'm afraid you're terribly confusing science with engineering...

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Reply 11

Jebedee

17

So are you advocating the government forcing employers to take on people with qualifications or "skills" which they may feel are not relevant?

Reply 12

JamesN88

20

Original post by floury

Science students are not taught to question, but rather accept what is told to them. Whereas it is the opposite for English and History students.

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So how does Science and Technolgy keep advancing if what you say is true?

Reply 13

Implication

18

Original post by Comus

Perhaps at the lower level (say primary and secondary education), but certainly from A level onwards, there's a lot of evaluating the methodology and conclusions of studies and the like. The scientific method - itself a product of epistemology - is all about questioning: 'does the evidence support the hypothesis?', 'is the sample representative?', 'what conclusions can be drawn from these observations?'.

That's not to say that the humanities aren't useful but they pose a very different set of questions.

i'm just about to finish a masters degree in a natural science and there's has been a negligible amount of this in any of my science classes. in fact there was far more of this in half a term of my psychology a-level than in my entire science 'career'!

Reply 14

floury

OP

2

Original post by Mathemagicien

You have no experience of STEM beyond A-level I'm guessing...

Correct, as it doesn't teach you to critically think, other than what you're told.

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Reply 15

username853993

21

Original post by floury

Correct, as it doesn't teach you to critically think, other than what you're told.

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this isnt true, the whole point of science is to think critically, whether that be from deciding the errors that have the biggest effects in experiments, proving statements in mathematics, to think why a result happened and what it tells you, deciding which chemicals to use in a reaction (catalysts for example have lots of pros and cons between the different ones), in engineering you need to think about how to cost effectively solve problems and how to solve a problem in the first place.

Stem at A-level teaches you nothing really skill wise in critical thinking but as soon as you get to degree level if you dont develop the ability to think critically you will fail.

I mean the whole way understanding is developed is by thinking critically, memorizing information will get you no where in science at uni

While the stem fan boys are immature and closed minded about stem vs non stem, you are acting exactly the same by using that untrue statement and if I am honest shows that you cant 'think critically' about this topic

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 16

Comus

10

Original post by Implication

i'm just about to finish a masters degree in a natural science and there's has been a negligible amount of this in any of my science classes. in fact there was far more of this in half a term of my psychology a-level than in my entire science 'career'!

If your experience is representative of anything near a singnificant minority then I'll be honest, that's quite troubling.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 17

nerdling_CompSci

18

I joined TSR in 2014. This topic is draining now

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Reply 18

JamesN88

20

Personally I value Humanities and STEM despite studying the latter because IMO as a society we need both to continue.

I'll point out though that I'm quite capable of thinking critically and questioning things by myself, I don't need someone to teach me to do it.

Reply 19

Implication

18

Original post by Comus

If your experience is representative of anything near a singnificant minority then I'll be honest, that's quite troubling.

I don't know about other disciplines, but I'm fairly confident this is representative in physics. I don't study at Oxbridge or anything but my institution is fairly highly ranked in the UK under research, employment etc. and IIRC is in the top 70 QS world ranking. It is RG.

There is actually one module that I took with about fifteen other students last semester that focused on the politics and philosophy of physics. The teacher of that class was actually quite concerned about the lack of education that physics students receive with regard to the philosophy etc. underpinning the scientific method, current theories, peer review etc. The problem is what we do about it. There's a common joke in physics about the current 'crisis': modern physics has now got so complicated that by the time you've trained someone to understand all the previous theory, they're already too old to do any new research! It is a slight exaggeration, but the fundamental problem is really there. It's all very well saying 'well clearly physics students need to do more of the underpinnings' (and they do - most first year philosophy undergrads probably know more about philosophy of science, scientific epistemology etc. than most science graduates do, even if they aren't fully aware of the context), but how do you fit this in? Skip over differential equations? Tensor calculus? Electromagnetism? Wave theory? It just wouldn't work!

So yeah I think the state of affairs really is quite interesting - and yes, troubling.

Are Science degrees valued the same as Humanities; I think not

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