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Point of Macs

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I find it quite interesting that your argument is empty rhetoric instead of actual facts.

Sorry, but your argument has no footing:

- PS3's CPU is more powerful. That's a given. It's also not very important.
- 360's GPU has many more pixel (48 vs. 24) and vertex (48 vs. 8) pipelines, on a unified architecture.
- nVidia has now migrated to unified pipeline architectures, which they wouldn't be doing if their dedicated pipelines were comparable.
- With the Cell (which nobody uses for graphics processing, therefore rendering it redundant) included, the 360 STILL wins out for GPU power.
- The Xenos has the daughter chip, which means it can produce higher level AA without a performance hit.
- PS3 suffers more overhead due to the lack of unified architecture in memory.

And, last but not least, comparisons show that for the vast majority of games, the 360 looks better and runs smoother.

I've no doubt that your mind will somehow convince you that you have a way to argue with this (most likely more meaningless rhetoric), but since it's definitely going to be garbage, I'm going to ignore it.

Reply 221

Planto

tomcuk123

There is NO SUCH THING as an 'Intuitive interface' !!

Yes there is, you tool. If you can use it without needing instruction, it is intuitive.

What you actually mean is FAMILIAR - (People say a car is intuitive- no its not!!)

Only idiots would say a car is intuitive. Nobody could use a car without prior instruction. That's completely unrelated to a computer system. If you have a thing on a table which moves a pointy arrow around and a button you'd have to be pretty idiotic not to be able to master simple navigation fairly easily. Beyond that it's simply a case of the interface being designed so that it implicitly guides you where you want to go.

If intuition was just familiarity, windowed operating systems wouldn't exist, because a command line would have been more familiar and, therefore, intuitive.

Reply 222

Planto

And on top of it all, you can't read. You can't argue my points so you're going to make up your own opponent, it seems.

You're an angry little fanboy child. You're spouting rhetoric and profanities, neither of which are worth a thing. You know that neg rep you've got? You don't have it because you're opinionated and up front. You have it because you're an absolute idiot. How, exactly, is a bunch of PS3s working in parallel to produce a picture of a car any kind of evidence for your "point"? It just isn't. Do you even know what raytracing is? Not that it's relevant.

Come back when you grow a brain.

I never said I know better than Crytek, iD and "numerous other devs", but I certainly know better than you. I give you facts, you return rhetoric. I'm wasting my time.

Reply 223

somebody else

Is this just the master fanboy rage thread now? It should be stickied so all pointless arguments can be put in one place.
Edit:

Reply 224

Planto

Jesus Christ, you're an absolute gibbering moron. Grow up. I didn't say the PS3 CPU was unimportant, you absolute cretin, I said that the difference between it and the 360's is unimportant to the difference in their capacities. The fact that PS3s in parallel can perform a bit of raytracing (as ANY multiprocessor can) is absolutely 100% irrelevant to its power as a gaming machine. You're throwing out videos which are evidence of precisely nothing (look at that video and ask yourself if anyone can draw a single bit of relevant, quantifiable information from it - not that you understand the concept of relevant information), much like an excited little boy would.

I did give you facts, and you gave me bile. Your profile says you're 21? You behave like a 12 year old.

For the record, I couldn't give two flying ***** which machine is more powerful. My platform of choice has 20 times the multiprocessing capacity of either machine. I'm speaking objectively, and you're wrong. You're also quite stupid.

When you've grown a brain and you can examine the facts I gave you in context without making stuff up about what I said and formulate a coherent, rational response that's in any way relevant to the topic, come see me. I won't be holding my breath.

Reply 225

m.grump

somebody else

Is this just the master fanboy rage thread now? It should be stickied so all pointless arguments can be put in one place.
Edit:

hahaha. awesome.

Reply 226

EvenStevens

Redemption

Yup that sure was hard.

Sucks paying a thousand pounds more for WORSE HARDWARE.

Lol macs.

...okay, clearly you didn't read my post. I didn't challenge you to do anything, nor did I defend anything about Macs :-/

I said they were more expensive. Get off your high horse.

Reply 227

EvenStevens

And you're fooling yourself because you can't read. I never implied a company couldn't make a more powerful PC for less. All I said is that prebuilds were expensive compared to doing it yourself, which is true.
It seems you're so hell bent on slating Macs that you've lost the ability to comprehend.

Reply 228

member159703

Just me or is the OP a bit of a fanboy who just started an argument for no reason.

Mad Vlad

Waits for Vlad to lock. Again.

Reply 229

m.grump

rorydaredking

Just me or is the OP a bit of a fanboy who just started an argument for no reason.

From what I've been reading, I think the sole point of macs is to piss Mazty off.

Reply 230

FranticMind

For rich people. Fashionable computing.

Reply 231

member159703

m.grump

From what I've been reading, I think the sole point of macs is to piss Mazty off.

Good call. And I couldnt be asked to read past page 1, but now the 360 and PS3 are somehow involved!
Also, Xeon > i7 in a way because of multiprocessor capability, which is why the new Mac Pro's will have 2 Xeon's for 12 cores supposedly.

Reply 232

Planto

EvenStevens

It's okay, he likes to make up his own responses to his points because that way he can argue with them (y)

Reply 233

Redemption

v-zero

That's not equivalent hardware. Don't try to pass off an i7 as equivalent to a basic Xeon workstation... Tell me, can you get a second i7 in there for eight cores? No? Sixteen cores? No?

Oh, well then, I guess the two are not equivalent.

Yes, you can exceed the basic performance of a Mac Pro with such a system. You can even mash OS X onto it, but it's still not an equivalent system.

The fact remains that the Mac Pro is quite competetively priced in the world of Xeon workstations, and that's the world it inhabits.

If you actually new anything about this, you'd know that the only difference between a modern Xeon and a modern i7 is ECC memory support. I can take that build and switch the Asus p6t motherboard for a dual-cpu motherboard, put in a Xeon (and a faster one than the one in the mac pro) instead of an i7, and still have it come out cheaper than a mac pro. Oh, and it'll have twice the storage, 12gb of ram, and two ATI 5870's. But of course, you'll tell me that those don't matter.

zippyRN

the comments aobut problems with Dell show the issues witht he WinPC architecture , Dell is often used by the WinPC fanboys to 'prove' that you get get pre-builts to your own spec for x less than a Mac etc ... it might be nailed together in a factory but it's still a kit car ...

How about I do what PrincessChickenBelly did. I am typing this from a Dell Vostro 1500 notebook right now. An hour ago, I played Modern Warfare 2 at maximum details. I bought this for £600 THREE YEARS ago. Since I have installed Windows 7, it has not crashed ONCE.

Tl:dr if you have an ounce of common sense, a dell pc is almost exactly as reliable as an apple pc.

Princesschickenbelly

I wouldn't really bother, if you look back I've had this exact same conversation with him already to no avail.

Nope, you just gave me some ad-hoc "my own experience" tale. I gave you a tale of a company running 500+ macs that I have worked at, and I know for a fact that they break down just as often as the pcs.

EvenStevens

...okay, clearly you didn't read my post. I didn't challenge you to do anything, nor did I defend anything about Macs :-/

I said they were more expensive. Get off your high horse.

[quote=EvenStevens]
I don't see what the point is. Building a computer from component parts is always going to work out cheaper than a pre-built anyway.

Find the same computer as in that post built by a company, and it'll be much more expensive.

I proved that for the same price as a mac pro, you could get a machine that would do the exactly the same job as a mac pro only about 40% faster. You then told me I couldn't get one premade for the same price. I found you a premade pc that will be almost 20% faster for LESS THAN HALF THE PRICE. Nice inconsistency there. Guess it must be the stress of being TOLD so much.

Reply 234

Mr Mime

My master's Pokédex runs neither! :biggrin:

Reply 235

Princesschickenbelly

Redemption

And all I care about is my experience. Your Macs crashed you say? Oh God I better get rid of mine RIGHT NOW THEN!

Why should I care what experience you have had with a Mac? In my experience the Mac I have is head and shoulders above ANY PC I have EVER had and therefore I prefer the Mac. That's ALL that matters.

And yes, that is in fact the same conversation so unless you have a real reason for not being able to read you're an idiot if you believe it's not.

And if the company is using 500+ computers I'm guessing they are running some complicated **** and therefore have no comparison to a regular joes everyday computer.

Reply 236

EvenStevens

Redemption

I proved that for the same price as a mac pro, you could get a machine that would do the exactly the same job as a mac pro only about 40% faster. You then told me I couldn't get one premade for the same price. I found you a premade pc that will be almost 20% faster for LESS THAN HALF THE PRICE. Nice inconsistency there. Guess it must be the stress of being TOLD so much.

I never asked you to beat the specs of a Mac Pro. I didn't actually ask you to do anything - it was merely a rhetorical statement. I know Macs are overpriced and you can build an equivalent and better machine for less money. Though, after saying this many times, you still feel the need to prove something, for some reason. Superiority complex I guess.

Also, if I was asking anything, it was to find a pre-build of the machine you posted earlier for cheaper than you found it.

^_^

Reply 237

tomcuk123

SouthernFreerider

no, you're wrong.

take someone who has never used a computer OS before.

they would have no familarity with either. yet they would still find one easier to use than the other...

WTF you on about?
NOTHING about a computer is 'Intuitive'.
The definition of 'Intuitive' is this:
"Automatic, without requiring conscious thought; easily understood or grasped by intuition; having a marked degree of intuition."

Now, you are trying to tell me that people can just walk up to a computer, and know exactly what to do (Ya know.... because you even said it was Intuitive yourself!).. THEY FRICKING CANT!!!

Windows is familiar to some, Mac OS X is familiar to some, Linux is familiar to some.... the only thing htat makes something 'easy to use' is familiarity... we find it easy to use because we KNOW ROUGHLY WHAT TO DO!

Are you telling me that the shortcut [CTRL] + [V] is the INTUITIVE thing to do if you want to paste something?
NO- its NOT... but it is familiar to many, so that is the 'convention' (if you like) on how things are done.

What subject do you study?
I hope to God it is not Computer Science- you would get laughed out of the lecture theatre!

Reply 238

tomcuk123

Planto

Yes there is, you tool. If you can use it without needing instruction, it is intuitive.

You fricking tool! Not EVERYONE can use a computer without instruction!
WHY THE HELL do you think people need computer LESSONS?

If intuition was just familiarity, windowed operating systems wouldn't exist, because a command line would have been more familiar and, therefore, intuitive.

You are not exactly making a point there- but intuition is NOT familiarity- you are confusing the two things.
Intuition is automatic, without requiring conscious thought; easily understood or grasped by intuition; having a marked degree of intuition" ... Windowed OS's are NOT intuitive and Im not even arguing that!

I just cant see the login behing "Zomgz!!!111!!!eleventy-one! Computers are intuitive!".... they are NOT!!

You know what parents are like, for NOT UNDERSTANDING COMPUTERS??? Eh??

http://www.collegehumor.com/tag :tongue:

arents-just-dont-understand/articles

Have a look through them- IF computers were intuitive, those articles would not exist.

You fricking moron.

Reply 239

MrBez

Maybe some of the PC guys could help me out on here.

I am looking for a desktop, and I currently have a MBP.

I was just going to buy an iMac, £820 with student discount.

I was thinking of the iMac as I do love the Mac, ease of use etc. I have had around 7 desktops in the past, had all the problems with viruses, slowing down within a month of using it, plus the space they take up.

So say for £600, what kind of PC could I get, and it must have a 22" TFT. The smaller tower, the better.