mathematics is all memory.
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Don't know why you have that much negs. I am in the same position - I was outstanding in arithmetic in primary school. And always used to get 20/20, 19/20... Now, I need to work my but off to get an A* in maths - and I do get the grade at the. I don't know why this is happening to me. But at AS/A2 I am pretty confident I am going to fail.
PS: I am for some reason extremely good at science now. :s Can't explain this either. I understand science at a whole new level. I explain to my teacher what stuff means etc. etc.
PS: I am for some reason extremely good at science now. :s Can't explain this either. I understand science at a whole new level. I explain to my teacher what stuff means etc. etc.
(edited 11 years ago)
My point is that if you are good in primary school, then, generally, you should not find maths that hard in secondary school. At least, the clever ones in my primary school (those who got 5A) found maths very easy and are finished their GCSE. I am the only one who got 5A and am struggling.
And two years old can't do complex arithmetic, I used to be able to do hard, very hard ones without even memorizing it.
And two years old can't do complex arithmetic, I used to be able to do hard, very hard ones without even memorizing it.
(edited 11 years ago)
What a ridiculous thing comparing GCSE/A-Levels to maths. 
Original post by punkski
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
fun
but not all of it.
Original post by sputum
fun
Original post by Brevillemonkey
It is a module in subjects like physics. There are mathematics courses because mathematics is far from being complete.At extremely high levels, there are still new discoveries being made, and there needs to be people developing new methods and techniques that can and probably will be applied to some other field such as computer science, physics, engineering etc, much later down the line. I mean, take calculus for instance. Mathematics has been around since about 1900 BC, and calculus wasn't discovered (or invented, doesn't make a difference the point is it showed up) until 1500-1600 AD, and it basically revolutionized all of physics and how physics is done. Who's to say that some obscure mathematical concept discovered today wont be useful in 100 years? Advancements in mathematics feed into the science and engineering subjects and provide new 'tools' for people in those fields to use. I mean, if we just ceased all mathematics in classical Greece after we figured out a big of geometry, we wouldn't know half as much as we do now about the world or the cosmos, and the technology we have no would be beyond our imagining.
As for why mathematics is a requirement for a lot of courses; success in maths shows that the person can grasp abstract concepts, can apply them in problem solving situations and that they are capable of memorising fundamental techniques.
As for why mathematics is a requirement for a lot of courses; success in maths shows that the person can grasp abstract concepts, can apply them in problem solving situations and that they are capable of memorising fundamental techniques.
Original post by Fallen
I agree, although think the OP is just a troll.
Original post by silentlife
Is this a joke? - I don't really find it funny though.
(second thought: the OP was trying to compete to see how many negs he could get - damn it I let him get away with it (I negged him))
Is this a joke? - I don't really find it funny though.(second thought: the OP was trying to compete to see how many negs he could get - damn it I let him get away with it (I negged him))
Original post by punkski
nope, not a 'troll'. being unable to explain something that most people just choose to accept does not mean you have to dismiss me as a 'troll'.
Given that you haven't responded to any of my arguments, and indeed I have made the same point as in the "only helpful response" implies you are a troll or you can't read.
Either way, not worth more time.
Original post by punkski
something that most people just choose to accept does not mean you have to dismiss me as a 'troll'.
You haven't responded to any of the arguments people have given you - so the one who is refusing to 'accept' is certainly not us.
Original post by punkski
more importantly, why is mathematics even a university course? it could be a module in bigger subjects like physics and chemistry, but it has little practical application or value on its own.
more importantly, why is mathematics even a university course? it could be a module in bigger subjects like physics and chemistry, but it has little practical application or value on its own.
lol, good effort. 7/10
Original post by Fallen
Given that you haven't responded to any of my arguments, and indeed I have made the same point as in the "only helpful response" implies you are a troll or you can't read.
Either way, not worth more time.
Either way, not worth more time.
perhaps it covers up some inadequacy on your part to explain what mathematics really is, or perhaps you yourself just don't know. and no, there were no 'arguments', there was you telling me maths is a means and blablabla, doesn't really explain why it's more than a uni module then.Maths is the basis of all subjects..... you will find EVERY subject you know,, from art to drama to science to languages. Maths has it's inputs.
However the maths subject on it's on is to develop your skills in Mathematics and be used to investigate how something is and how it proves itself than to understand why it is so. e.g. physics theories are produced on the basis of mathematical functions.
So why you feel that you learn and practise the idea?
Because the math you learnt in your pre years in schools was to introduce to you the idea of basic application such as add, sub, divide, multiply. GCSE was to enhance that further and also make your understanding strong from the work you did in your pre years. Now Alevel becomes different..... a lot of people think that it is just learning and practise, even so my chemistry teacher believes that.. BUT it does mean at all that the stuff is useless and has no implication. it feel that way because you have not stuided the subject at a very advance level to undertstand why it is so. If you go on to study it in uni level, then you will realise by the end of your year all the stuff you learnt in alevel.
However the maths subject on it's on is to develop your skills in Mathematics and be used to investigate how something is and how it proves itself than to understand why it is so. e.g. physics theories are produced on the basis of mathematical functions.
So why you feel that you learn and practise the idea?
Because the math you learnt in your pre years in schools was to introduce to you the idea of basic application such as add, sub, divide, multiply. GCSE was to enhance that further and also make your understanding strong from the work you did in your pre years. Now Alevel becomes different..... a lot of people think that it is just learning and practise, even so my chemistry teacher believes that.. BUT it does mean at all that the stuff is useless and has no implication. it feel that way because you have not stuided the subject at a very advance level to undertstand why it is so. If you go on to study it in uni level, then you will realise by the end of your year all the stuff you learnt in alevel.
Original post by punkski
hello.
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught? through repetition and good explanations, provided the subject has decent memory and an ability to retain information, what is there in mathematics that is 'difficult'? the reason i dropped out was a lack of interest and unwillingness to invest time in the subject, yet unlike subjects where writing is concerned, you are tested for your ability to find the 'correct' method or result. if you know how to do it, you can do it, simple as that. yes, you may make mistakes, but that's beside the point; the concepts can all be memorized. it takes personal skill to construct coherent argumentation in essays, but a good teacher or textbook to score high in maths. when i suggested this to my father, who himself studied mechanical engineering, he looked at me as if i was stupid. i am a law applicant. he has yet to provide a valid counterargument, has anyone got one here?
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught? through repetition and good explanations, provided the subject has decent memory and an ability to retain information, what is there in mathematics that is 'difficult'? the reason i dropped out was a lack of interest and unwillingness to invest time in the subject, yet unlike subjects where writing is concerned, you are tested for your ability to find the 'correct' method or result. if you know how to do it, you can do it, simple as that. yes, you may make mistakes, but that's beside the point; the concepts can all be memorized. it takes personal skill to construct coherent argumentation in essays, but a good teacher or textbook to score high in maths. when i suggested this to my father, who himself studied mechanical engineering, he looked at me as if i was stupid. i am a law applicant. he has yet to provide a valid counterargument, has anyone got one here?
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
Maths could, in a lot of cases particularly at school level, be broken down in to a lot of rules and facts to memorise. And memorising all of these would allow you to pass exams at this level. But
1) The more you study the more you would have to memorise meaning this could never take you to advanced study unless you have an amazing memory.
2) If you have the skills to actually understand the content then personally I think it's much easier and quicker to do that than to try to remember a load of rules. There are a lot of studies in to what skills are needed to be good at maths, I have only read a few. One I read was about viewing a process (eg. Division, differentiation) as an object (eg. A fraction, a derivative) in order to use that object in a different process. The study found that at a basic level (sums with young children) those who were able to view things in this way appeared to do much better.
3) When you get to higher level stuff (eg. parts of uni courses and actually doing maths for maths, not to pass an exam) you have to have the understanding to do well. Mathematicians don't sit there doing exams all day...they don't have questions. They have a huge body of previously found information and they just have to work with it and try to find something new. Memorisation here will only help them in not having to look stuff up if they're quoting a previous result. The maths has to come from their own understanding.
Xxx
posted from the TSR Android app
Original post by punkski
you may have to elaborate, i'm afraid you've lost me here
Take the assessment and deadlines away, study whichever bits of maths you find interesting.
If you don't find any of it interesting, no biggie. Taught maths below degree level is heavily skewed towards numbers and calculation and there is a huge amount of (imo) accessible maths that gets left out.
But the interested student can learn pretty much everything he needs online and I'm not that bothered about everyone else. There are plenty of interesting subjects (the relative numbers of 'my subject rocks' to 'your subject sucks' threads notwithstanding)
Maybe you learned more maths during your struggles than with the A team. It's a difficult subject (it's actually incredibly simple but our brains aren't well equipped imo) you have to struggle with it to understand it properly. Nobody tells you that 'By the end of this lesson you might not have...' but sometimes it takes a while. Sometimes longer than you have before the course finishes.
Doodling through stuff you like the look of in your own time is a different ballgame entirely
Lol at all these A level students thinking they know everything about maths.
Original post by punkski
hello.
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught? through repetition and good explanations, provided the subject has decent memory and an ability to retain information, what is there in mathematics that is 'difficult'? the reason i dropped out was a lack of interest and unwillingness to invest time in the subject, yet unlike subjects where writing is concerned, you are tested for your ability to find the 'correct' method or result. if you know how to do it, you can do it, simple as that. yes, you may make mistakes, but that's beside the point; the concepts can all be memorized. it takes personal skill to construct coherent argumentation in essays, but a good teacher or textbook to score high in maths. when i suggested this to my father, who himself studied mechanical engineering, he looked at me as if i was stupid. i am a law applicant. he has yet to provide a valid counterargument, has anyone got one here?
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught? through repetition and good explanations, provided the subject has decent memory and an ability to retain information, what is there in mathematics that is 'difficult'? the reason i dropped out was a lack of interest and unwillingness to invest time in the subject, yet unlike subjects where writing is concerned, you are tested for your ability to find the 'correct' method or result. if you know how to do it, you can do it, simple as that. yes, you may make mistakes, but that's beside the point; the concepts can all be memorized. it takes personal skill to construct coherent argumentation in essays, but a good teacher or textbook to score high in maths. when i suggested this to my father, who himself studied mechanical engineering, he looked at me as if i was stupid. i am a law applicant. he has yet to provide a valid counterargument, has anyone got one here?
edit: neg me all you want, haters gon' hate. what is maths then, if it's not memorisation and practise?
The text in red explains nothing. The text in blue explains everything.
Original post by Hypocrism
Sure, you remember methods that have been worked out in the past and apply them to different scenarios. But isn't that kind of obvious? Are you saying we should re-derive the method for integration every time we need to use it? No. We have a bank of knowledge and "maths" is applying that knowledge to new scenarios.
Not sure quite what you're saying.
It's not (always) like using an enzyme to break down something. Sometimes it is. Sometimes it's applying an existing method in a clever way. Sometimes it's making up a whole new method. Sometimes it's finding the problem that is the problem - realising that it is important. Sometimes it's finding a new and novel way to solve an old problem.
In that respect mathematics is no different to life in general. It just has certain unusual properties e.g. pathological = normal.
Original post by wanderlust.xx
Lol at all these A level students thinking they know everything about maths.
Original post by punkski
Lol at you thinking you're a mathematician.
When did I ever imply I thought I was one? All I've done is an undergrad degree, but that's still countless more experience with actual mathematics compared to someone who's done a few C4 papers.
OK so I read the OP properly
hello.
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught?
Why did you restrict your thoughts to mathematics particularly? Because it's the subject you struggled in. Do you think this might colour your thoughts?
Do no work - get low marks
Do a lot of work - get good marks
The rest is in your head.
Just let it go and get on with what you do want to do.
EDIT: one good thing about maths is it shows up how terribly illogical humans are.
Original post by punkski
before i start, allow me to explain a bit about myself. as a young child, i was outstanding in basic arithmetic work. sometime in middle school, however, i began to fall behind, and a lack of interest and motivation had me struggling against failing scores throughout my upper education. i excelled in the so-called 'social' subjects, such as languages and history. yet it came to a point where i began to find mathematics genuinely 'difficult' to cope with.
in the IB, i began in the Maths Standard Level class, before dropping down to Maths Studies, the lowest tier. i continued to fail, to the extent that my diploma was in danger. this is when i began to go 'all out'; i hired two different tutors, and also received help from a friend once a week. i bought books, watched tutorials, did everything i could. and the result? i aced the two papers, 7/7 marks on both.
and this had me thinking: what is there in mathematics that cannot be taught?
Why did you restrict your thoughts to mathematics particularly? Because it's the subject you struggled in. Do you think this might colour your thoughts?
Do no work - get low marks
Do a lot of work - get good marks
The rest is in your head.
Just let it go and get on with what you do want to do.
EDIT: one good thing about maths is it shows up how terribly illogical humans are.
(edited 11 years ago)
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