IMPORTANT - Grade ranges as Entry Requirements

Can this be stickied, please, mods? Or something like it?

The only exception to this, in my experience, is where lower offers are stated for students offering a particular subject. I know for some courses offers are made a grade lower for students offering more than one science subject. If this is the case, it will usually be stated very explicitly on the universities website. I agree with the advice to contact admissions if you are unsure at all.

Yes, this should definately be a sticky. Or we could just have a new sticky something like "Common mistakes made by applicants" which could include things like this, and some of the other problems applicants sometimes have (I can't think of any examples right now, but I know there have been some other common misconceptions this year).

I'm pretty sure we could put our heads together and come up with something useful. I think the most common thing this year with my own students was getting the fee code wrong.

I think something could definately be created. I'm sure there are some other people who could also contribute some useful advice.

Some advice about who (usually) counts as a home student could also be useful, as the rules aren't always clear and I think we've had a few questions about that as well this year.

Explaining the ABB quota rules might be useful, although they'll probably change again really soon =/.

Also maybe a bit about realism in predicted grades, with links to the evidence from unis as to why it matters would probably be good... Although with A-levels changing, again, I don't know how many application cycles this would work for? Are AS levels definately going in the very near future? Or is that still just something that could happen?

Tbh, I think part of the problem is that lots of things have changed fairly recently, and it makes it hard to keep up with what's going on, so people get and give incorrect advice that might have been a bit more applicable/correct a few years ago.

Generally I think more demystifying about how the application process actually works from the other side would be good.

All excellent ideas. I particularly endorse the realistic predicted grades one. It's horrible to see the results.

I agree that this is a major problem, and a lot of people seem to equate getting an offer with being able to go to the university, which isn't the case at all. Having five offers all out of the range of what you can realistically achieve helps no-one.

Completely agree. I am quite shocked at the compliance of some of the teachers as it is reported on here sometimes. We don't budge very often, as professional judgement really means something at our school, and sometimes you have to be prepared, as the adult, to take the unpopularity hit, but it doesn't seem like a universal practice.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-24625972 I know this bbc article (and the report it is based on) say that further education colleges are worse at predicting than other institutions. I wonder if part of the problem is that they don't know the students as well as teachers in a school sixth form do.

Currently, I think predicted grades are bit redundant, unless the applicant has extenuating/mitigating circumstances. However, with the proposed changes to A-levels, they will probably become more important again in the near future.

I do think some teachers seem like they would do anything for an easy life. Some of them are very badly informed about university applications as well, so they probably don't think through the consequences of overpredicting and may actually believe they are helping the student. Whilst I know that it is not the teacher's main job, I do think some individual teachers (like heads of sixth form) should try and be a bit more informed about the admissions process.

Well, since it's an independent school, that may account for our slightly better accuracy rate, according to the BBC. A bit mystified by that, tbh. However, our head of sixth did some number crunching and came up with the stats that we had been wrong in 4% of cases over the last 15 years, which is pretty good, I think. We do know the kids very well, it must be said.

I believe this is the report it's based on www.cambridgeassessment.org.uk/Images/109919-predicting-a-level-grades-using-as-level-grades.pdf. According to the report, it may be due to the higher attainment of students, as teachers are more accurate at predicting A grades. I wonder if it could also be due to generally having smaller student bodies than large sixth form colleges.

However, only getting 4% of predictions wrong is very impressive.

I believe this is the report it's based on www.cambridgeassessment.org.uk/Images/109919-predicting-a-level-grades-using-as-level-grades.pdf. According to the report, it may be due to the higher attainment of students, as teachers are more accurate at predicting A grades. I wonder if it could also be due to generally having smaller student bodies than large sixth form colleges.

However, only getting 4% of predictions wrong is very impressive.

That all makes sense, certainly. If I am only dealing with 12 students in U6 and another 12 in L6 and my colleague at the local 6th form college teaches, say, psychology or another A level only subject to, what, 150 - 200 kids across half a dozen classes, (figures I have completely grabbed out of thin air, but within the realms of probability) I am certainly going to know them better.

4% is certainly impressive and none of us questioned his maths. I am questioning my memory, though, as to whether it was 4% a year or 4% in total over 15 years. Either way, it's not too many.

I mean, to be fair, my teachers at an ordinary comprehensive sixth form managed to predict all my A2 grades accurately, but I had a very good relationship with most of my 6th form teachers, and had been taught by two of them since year 9. I don't know what their overall accuracy was like though.

I do think 6th form teachers have a hard job, between inspiring students to try their hardest and achieve the best grades they can, whilst also encouraging realism in university applications.

Crushing dreams is hard. Most kids are ok with taking advice, especially if you have a good relationship with them and they can see that you aren't trying to ruin their lives just for fun. (I do wonder what kind of classroom relationships some TSR members have with their teachers from what they report. Having done the job for 30 years now, in a number of schools, I can't honestly say I've met a lot of teachers whose main source of entertainment comes from sadistic treatment of students. I have met some students with a chip on their shoulder.) In an aspirational society where the message is pumped out that anyone can have what they want if they try hard enough, it comes as a shock to some that that isn't really how the world is, but we do try to be sensitive about letting them down gently. The massive elephant in the room, and I've noticed this a lot on TSR, is cognitive ability. Academic achievement isn't actually about working hard on its own.

I agree with a lot of this.

I also think one of the issues is the jump between GCSE and A-level (especially in subjects like science and maths). I think GCSEs are a) possible to get decent grades in without a true understanding of course content and b) easy for bright teenagers to pass with relatively little work. A-levels are a step up in that both hard work and ability is required in most subjects to get the top grades.

Of course, a lot of very bright students at top schools on TSR don't see that for some people getting a B/C in any subject at A-level represents the ceiling of their accademic ability, and it won't always be possible for them to pull these grades up just by sitting retakes and working harder.

I don't think students are very often encouraged to think realistically about where their accademic strengths lie, and what they feel is possible for them.

Unfortunately, I don't have the answers to these problems!

Haha, I wasn't suggesting you should have all (or any) of the answers! I don't think there are any easy answers.

I do think removing January exams probably won't help though.