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Clareification in trouble?

What Union is this? Is this some kind of debating soc?
Hmmmm. Well, the notion that Islam and "Western Liberalism" are diametrically opposite is absolute codswallop. Though I'd still like to know what arguments were employed to reach this conclusion of incompatibility.

Reply 21

Jerby

Have you never head of the Cambridge Union? :eek:

Reply 22

FadeToBlackout

15

Jerby

Have you never head of the Cambridge Union? :eek:

I hadn't until fresher's week. And I've still never been there.

Reply 23

Epicurus

15

Oh the "Cambridge Union." So they actually discuss other stuff than how to launch their political careers? :eek:

Reply 24

groovy_moose

1

It's often quite good, you should try it sometime. And they actually didn't reach the conclusion that they are incompatible; that was just the motion proposed for debate. defeated by 129 votes if memory serves. It also doesn't say they're diametically opposite, just that they're incompatible - doesn't mean to say that one or the other is right (although, as someone pointed out, if you think about western liberalism that way, without passing any value judgement over what's right or wrong, then liberalism is also incompatible with itself...)

Reply 25

Epicurus

15

Well it's good to hear it was defeated. I may well try it when I get there.

Reply 26

jason_88

i think that many muslims are used to being suppressed or supressing others and so are not used to expressing an anti islam view. however, in the west, we are open to debates discussing religion without fear of prosecution. therefore it is hard for many muslims to accept criticism of their faith of any kind. it is not the west's fault that they have insulted islam, it is islam's fault for not taking it in the light in which it was intended, as a joke. they must just be lacking in a sense of humour.

Reply 27

Cexy

Hold on, let me get this straight. Your argument is "Islamic countries have different traditions and expectations to the West when it comes to religious debate. Neither side has respected the other's traditions, and therefore Muslims are wrong and we are right."

Is that about it? Gosh, you must have spent hours coming up with that one.

Reply 28

Bingo Jesus

Epicurus

Well it's good to hear it was defeated. I may well try it when I get there.

Please don't, I'm not sure my brain can put up with this again.

Reply 29

Taiping

Bingo Jesus

Please don't, I'm not sure my brain can put up with this again.

Indeed. I wanted to slap him after reading that post.

Is he still bringing his car? :confused:

Reply 30

Epicurus

15

Uh no im not bringing my car.

But as for that argument bingo jesus/taiping that was perfectly clear. Just because your brain couldn't hack it bingo jesus it doesn't mean it's not a sound argument. If you have valid objections why not present them?

Funny isn't it taiping that you've repped me for my participation in that thread? how hypocritical. Why don't you leave out the "slapping" comments and go and play with your Pokemon in the Pokemon soc.

Reply 31

Jigglypuff

16

Epicurus

Uh no im not bringing my car.

But as for that argument bingo jesus/taiping that was perfectly clear. Just because your brain couldn't hack it bingo jesus it doesn't mean it's not a sound argument. If you have valid objections why not present them?

Funny isn't it taiping that you've repped me for my participation in that thread? how hypocritical. Why don't you leave out the "slapping" comments and go and play with your Pokemon in the Pokemon soc.

Don't knock Pokemon please or I'll vinewrap your Charmander with my Venasaur, biatch.

Reply 32

Epicurus

15

^^Don't push me or I'll get my gyarados or lapras (his hp cannot be matched) and for extra strength my metagross, you'll won't be able to match me, biatch. My pokemons eat charamanders for breakfast and for that matter, venusaurs as a light midnight snack. :wink:

Reply 33

coldfish

12

Well, his argument was "sound" of sorts. Just because two cultures are different doesn't mean that one can't be wrong and the other right.

It's still a stupid argument though.

Reply 34

Cexy

coldfish

Well, his argument was "sound" of sorts. Just because two cultures are different doesn't mean that one can't be wrong and the other right.

It's still a stupid argument though.

Aye, I realise that. He wasn't self-contradictory (which is about the only good thing you can say about that post) but it was absolute rubbish. He jumped straight to the conclusion without letting annoying things like a chain of logic or a coherent argument get in the way.

Reply 35

Tonheuru

Wasn't his argument more based on his position as a member of "The West"?
If you're looking at it from a cultural relativist perspective there's nothing wrong with his argument per se (although I do object to the pejorative terms he uses e.g.

many muslims are used to being suppressed or supressing others

) since he's saying as a member of "The West" it is culturally normal for me to behave in this way. Any people not of "Western" culture living in "The West" should accept it's cultural values. This position I think can be defended, in the same way as anyone of "Western" culture going somewhere else should respect that place's cultural values.

Reply 36

jason_88

Taiping - i'll slap you round the face, and you won't get up!!!

Cexy - don't be so condecending. who the hell are you anyway? don't try to miss represent my argument to make yourself look better than me, who the hell are you?

anyway, i thought i would clear a few things up. my argument is saying the west is right because it allows freedom of speech and allows us to criticise religion and other issues, which is our right. in islamic countries, they do not have as many rights and are not as free to put their point of view across due to the suppression, espically of women. therefore, when people from those countries experience western culture, they do not realise that any view we express should not be shouted down, playing the race card, just because they disagree.

Reply 37

Ditting Suck

8

Epicurus

Well it's good to hear it was defeated.

Reply 38

Ditting Suck

8

jason_88

therefore, when people from those countries experience western culture, they do not realise that any view we express should not be shouted down, playing the race card, just because they disagree.