Has Israel forfeited its right to exist?

They have probably been updated as more casualties have been recorded. I'll find better ones tomorrow. But suffice it to say that I think we are all relatively sure that the majority of the casualties were Hamas... I find that quite amazing given the population density of Gaza.

This map?

Links redone. (How's that stroke coming along?)

Bahrain back to Iran, Kuwait back to Iraq, Kurdish areas in Turkey into Kurdistan, Herat and hazarajat to Iran. Shia areas in Saudi into Iraq, I'd say scrap Jordan as well, merge that into Syria and Palestine.....and eventually we are getting there. Keep Israel, the Jews got to live somewhere

Bahrain back to Iran, Kuwait back to Iraq, Kurdish areas in Turkey into Kurdistan, Herat and hazarajat to Iran. Shia areas in Saudi into Iraq, I'd say scrap Jordan as well, merge that into Syria and Palestine.....and eventually we are getting there. Keep Israel, the Jews got to live somewhere

What about Kurdish areas in Iran?

And to underlined:

Good luck with that

Source please?

This thread is irredeemably stupid, as others have pointed out, as well as most other Israel/Palestine threads.

But the lazy mud slinging from both sides, the exaggerated outcry from Palestinian 'supporters', the worrying nationalism from Israeli 'supporters' and the fact that anyone could even attempt to argue that what has - and will - occur will change anything, or make anyone in the region any safer - is laughable.

More people will die, more martyrs will be made - on both sides - and the hatred will continue.

No one can seriously be labeling the Israeli airstrikes as a success, nor be fully suprised or outraged that they have occurred, can they? The comparisons to Dresden I've seen, in this thread or some other, just show how wrong the Israelis have gotten this airstrike - you are comparing your military strikes to ones made in a war with standing armies, ones made to destroy industrial targets and damage enemy morale. This is not going to work on the Gaza strip.

Even if you take the most generous assessment of the loss of life that has occurred and suggest that 'only' fifteen innocents have died, you have still failed, martyrs will be made out of this, whether they were 'innocent' or not. Hamas will gain further support and rockets will continue to be fired from the Gaza strip.

The same argument applies to a Hamas militant setting up a mortar, of course, but I'm tempted to say that the Israeli's, with greater democratic checks and balances and the bigger 'stick' really should be acting more...smartly and responsibly or this cycle of violence will never end.

People point out that Hamas are retaliating by firing rockets into civilian areas, how else do you expect them to respond? I'm sure if they had F-16s and tanks they would happily go toe to toe with the Israeli military, but they don't, so they'll fight back like any outgunned, outnumbered organisation would. It's stupid, but what else does Israel expect?

All in all, a very depressing situation. I guess the rampant partisanship, nationalism and plain idiocy in this thread is just a representative microcosm of the kind of psychology and jingoism that causes like this.

Bahrain back to Iran, Kuwait back to Iraq, Kurdish areas in Turkey into Kurdistan, Herat and hazarajat to Iran. Shia areas in Saudi into Iraq, I'd say scrap Jordan as well, merge that into Syria and Palestine.....and eventually we are getting there. Keep Israel, the Jews got to live somewhere

http://domino.un.org/unispal.nsf/9a798adbf322aff38525617b006d88d7/93037e3b939746de8525610200567883!OpenDocument

"The estimate of the statistical expert, which the Committee believes to be as accurate as circumstances permit, indicates that the refugees from Israel- controlled territory amount to approximately 711,000."

My bad, I hugely understated the number.

(I got to that source through wikipedia, but it's still a UNO source)

This thread is irredeemably stupid, as others have pointed out, as well as most other Israel/Palestine threads.

But the lazy mud slinging from both sides, the exaggerated outcry from Palestinian 'supporters', the worrying nationalism from Israeli 'supporters' and the fact that anyone could even attempt to argue that what has - and will - occur will change anything, or make anyone in the region any safer - is laughable.

More people will die, more martyrs will be made - on both sides - and the hatred will continue.

No one can seriously be labeling the Israeli airstrikes as a success, nor be fully suprised or outraged that they have occurred, can they? The comparisons to Dresden I've seen, in this thread or some other, just show how wrong the Israelis have gotten this airstrike - you are comparing your military strikes to ones made in a war with standing armies, ones made to destroy industrial targets and damage enemy morale. This is not going to work on the Gaza strip.

Even if you take the most generous assessment of the loss of life that has occurred and suggest that 'only' fifteen innocents have died, you have still failed, martyrs will be made out of this, whether they were 'innocent' or not. Hamas will gain further support and rockets will continue to be fired from the Gaza strip.

The same argument applies to a Hamas militant setting up a mortar, of course, but I'm tempted to say that the Israeli's, with greater democratic checks and balances and the bigger 'stick' really should be acting more...smartly and responsibly or this cycle of violence will never end.

People point out that Hamas are retaliating by firing rockets into civilian areas, how else do you expect them to respond? I'm sure if they had F-16s and tanks they would happily go toe to toe with the Israeli military, but they don't, so they'll fight back like any outgunned, outnumbered organisation would. It's stupid, but what else does Israel expect?

All in all, a very depressing situation. I guess the rampant partisanship, nationalism and plain idiocy in this thread is just a representative microcosm of the kind of psychology and jingoism that causes like this.

+1 but partition Iraqi into separate sunni and shia states.

This thread is irredeemably stupid, as others have pointed out, as well as most other Israel/Palestine threads.

But the lazy mud slinging from both sides, the exaggerated outcry from Palestinian 'supporters', the worrying nationalism from Israeli 'supporters' and the fact that anyone could even attempt to argue that what has - and will - occur will change anything, or make anyone in the region any safer - is laughable.

More people will die, more martyrs will be made - on both sides - and the hatred will continue.

No one can seriously be labeling the Israeli airstrikes as a success, nor be fully suprised or outraged that they have occurred, can they? The comparisons to Dresden I've seen, in this thread or some other, just show how wrong the Israelis have gotten this airstrike - you are comparing your military strikes to ones made in a war with standing armies, ones made to destroy industrial targets and damage enemy morale. This is not going to work on the Gaza strip.

Even if you take the most generous assessment of the loss of life that has occurred and suggest that 'only' fifteen innocents have died, you have still failed, martyrs will be made out of this, whether they were 'innocent' or not. Hamas will gain further support and rockets will continue to be fired from the Gaza strip.

The same argument applies to a Hamas militant setting up a mortar, of course, but I'm tempted to say that the Israeli's, with greater democratic checks and balances and the bigger 'stick' really should be acting more...smartly and responsibly or this cycle of violence will never end.

People point out that Hamas are retaliating by firing rockets into civilian areas, how else do you expect them to respond? I'm sure if they had F-16s and tanks they would happily go toe to toe with the Israeli military, but they don't, so they'll fight back like any outgunned, outnumbered organisation would. It's stupid, but what else does Israel expect?

All in all, a very depressing situation. I guess the rampant partisanship, nationalism and plain idiocy in this thread is just a representative microcosm of the kind of psychology and jingoism that causes like this.

It's becaust TSR shorten links, here you go:

1. Number of innocents killed

210/225 were Hamas Security Forces:

"More than 400 people were also wounded. Most of the casualties were security forces, but Palestinian officials said at least 15 civilians were among the dead."

Source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081227/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_palestinians;_ylt=AgRtWYge.Ke1ZeNPy4PukACs0NUE

Summary:
1. 15 innocents dead
2. Amazingly good accuracy
3. The amount of missiles that were fired, what did you expect? After the warnings etc

Indeed, you're an Iraqi is that what you would want? I dont see why Al-Anbar can't become part of a Greater Syria instead.