Being a former member of a political party causing trouble in my relationship

OP

Original post by tom476zf

i bet you're one of those people that think 'immigrants are coming over here and taking our jobs!' pahaha is so please get a basic grasp of global economics before you spout your racist views.
oh and btw theres no such thing as 'white racism' only prejudice, as the word 'racist' has meaning behind it due to years of black persecution. this does not apply to white people, in other words its impossible to actually be racist towards a white person.

This is the disgraceful sort of rubbish that proves what a self loathing mess a lot of the electorate is! Whites are the victim of the vast majority of racial prejudice in the UK (grooming, muslim conversion groups).

Reply 87

scrotgrot

16

Original post by ChaoticButterfly

Fascist economic policy is more like feudalism.

How so, I think it's pretty much the opposite of feudalism. Can't see where you're coming from there...

Reply 88

OP

Original post by Bizzyqueen

Troll away until your heart's content. I'm out of here.

:bee2:

Not trolling its just my opinions , sorry if I offended you

Reply 89

ChaoticButterfly

20

Original post by scrotgrot

How so, I think it's pretty much the opposite of feudalism. Can't see where you're coming from there...

How is a system where if I try and make a union that demands some kind of worker control for the proletariat gets me thrown in a concentration camp left wing? Unions are basis for which the working class can defend its class interest. It you can't do that then it certainly isn't socialist. You may as well say China is socialist.

In feudalism the lord and his peasants enter a contract. The Lord basically own the peasants and the land they work. The Lord looks after the peasants but he owns the peasants. Fascism is basically that but in an industrial setting. It has nothing to do with socialism. Socialism is everything to do with worker self autonomy in the economy. Fascists regimes put workers trying to exercise self autonomy up against the wall for a firing squad.

I'm not a serf and I'm not going to desecrate all the (mass) graves of working class people who thought against fascism by pretending fascist economics is somehow socialist.

I think you are confusion any sense of collectivisation with left wing. I'd rather neoliberal economics than fascist economics.

"Both the Left and the Right have advocated forms of collectivism. The word fascism derives from its symbolic use of the fasces of Ancient Rome, with rods bound together to signify collective strength. Fascism subjected individualism to the collective whole. Similarly, nationalism extols the nation over the individual. If you insist that collectivism is Left, be warned that fascism and nationalism also incline in the same collectivist direction."

http://newpolitics.apps-1and1.net/the-broken-language-of-left-and-right

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 90

scrotgrot

16

Original post by ChaoticButterfly

How is a system where if I try and make a union that demands some kind of worker control for the proletariat gets me thrown in a concentration camp left wing? Unions are basis for which the working class can defend its class interest. It you can't do that then it certainly isn't socialist. You may as well say China is socialist.

In feudalism the lord and his peasants enter a contract. The Lord basically own the peasants and the land they work. The Lord looks after the peasants but he owns the peasants. Fascism is basically that but in an industrial setting. It has nothing to do with socialism. Socialism is everything to do with worker self autonomy in the economy. Fascists regimes put workers trying to exercise self autonomy up against the wall for a firing squad.

I'm not a serf and I'm not going to desecrate all the (mass) graves of working class people who thought against fascism by pretending fascist economics is somehow socialist.

I think you are confusion any sense of collectivisation with left wing. I'd rather neoliberal economics than fascist economics.

"Both the Left and the Right have advocated forms of collectivism. The word fascism derives from its symbolic use of the fasces of Ancient Rome, with rods bound together to signify collective strength. Fascism subjected individualism to the collective whole. Similarly, nationalism extols the nation over the individual. If you insist that collectivism is Left, be warned that fascism and nationalism also incline in the same collectivist direction."

http://newpolitics.apps-1and1.net/the-broken-language-of-left-and-right

Then this is a left-wing argument, statist fascism versus worker democracy. Left-wing means planned or regulated economy, neither of these things are liberal economics are they?

Class interest is Marxist really, not socialist. I think you can be socialist without being Marxist in the sense that you see everything as a class struggle. Fascism from what I can tell tends to be like "ein Volk", there are no classes recognised and everyone is subject in usually a vaguely militaristic way to the state. As you say they are not allowed to form their own associations because the theory goes that the state has their well-being and solvency covered as long as everyone shuts up and gets on with their allotted role quietly.

I now see where your comparison with feudalism is coming from but I don't think it's meaningful to call it feudalism when there is only one "manor", i.e. the state.

"If you insist that collectivism is Left, be warned that fascism and nationalism also incline in the same collectivist direction."

Yes absolutely, that's why I said the BNP's economic policies were pretty left-wing. They are a fascist party, fascism is economically left-wing and that means socioeconomically collectivist.

As far as I can see the main advantage of fascism is a fascist state is very good at running infrastructure and strategic industries, the trains run on time as the famous quote goes. It's far from my favourite type of left-wing which would be more Green Party/Bernie Sanders direction but it's got some good stuff going for it. Of course we see the moderate version a lot around the world and in the post-war settlement but it is usually called statism or dirigisme or state capitalism.

I will say I have never quite understood why it has to come with ethnic nationalism as part of the package. Maybe because the Nazis cast such a long shadow culturally that most people in fascist parties are in it for the historical re-enactment rather than the underlying philosophies.

Reply 91

Original post by Lionel Hutzz

Well I obviously don't say that to them haha. I think politics is a bit over their heads they aren't the brightest

Well considering your comments on here, then they don't appear to be far off the mark. I highly doubt you will get them to change their opinion of you.

Reply 92

OP

Original post by 999tigger

Well considering your comments on here, then they don't appear to be far off the mark. I highly doubt you will get them to change their opinion of you.

How so ?

Reply 93

Original post by Lionel Hutzz

It doesn't bother me particularly just says a lot about them how uneducated they are to support left wing moronic views.

If it doesnt bother you, then why make the sad face and what was the point of the thread?

Reply 94

OP

Original post by 999tigger

If it doesnt bother you, then why make the sad face and what was the point of the thread?

It doesn't bother me they are uneducated and don't understand but it does bother me they are trying to influence her decision and take some sort of moral high ground

Reply 95

Original post by Lionel Hutzz

I still hold the views but I am no longer a member of the party as I know the leader personally as he is from near Darlington which is where I'm from and think he's taking the party in the wrong direction.

Perhaps their instincts about you is that you myst have held views they found objectionable before you joined the BNP and their hunch would be that , even though you left you might still have affinity for those views.

That hunch would appear to be correct.

Reply 96

Original post by Lionel Hutzz

Tbf my parents are UKIP voters .
My Dad is a policemen
Mum is a headteacher
Stepdad a dentist

They aren't bothered and fully supported me when I was involved in the BNP. It shouldn't matter to her parents either.

Her parents have different ideals and values to them ofc it matters if their daughter is dating someone who has objectionable views. How old are you both?

Reply 97

OP

Original post by 999tigger

Her parents have different ideals and values to them ofc it matters if their daughter is dating someone who has objectionable views. How old are you both?

I'm 25 and shes 23 which is why it's utterly ridiculous for them to be getting involved

Reply 98

Original post by Lionel Hutzz

Yes because non Brits often are involved with gangs and crime. It's well known that Africans and Caribbean people are highly represented in criminal activity in Britain.

What do you mean by Non Brits? Is that non whites or non indigenous whites?
How far do you go back to say someone is indigenous whites? Celtic Britains?
There are many reasons why people from ethnic minoritiesare more represented for certain crimes and caucasians are overrepresented in other crimes. Its pretty simplistic just to go on someones skin colour without looking at the underlying factors.

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 99