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Reply 60
eleenia
equal pay in all occupations is still a grey area i believe, issues of maternity rights and child care too and the rights of women across the world not just in this country.

That is right, but quite honestly I think the figures are not always very sincere. But fact is, many employers are afraid of women getting pregnant, that is aa problem.

I can see a debate coming up about women´s rights in Islam again... i don´t fully agree I´m afraid. Women´s rights across the world are not necessarily our problem, other cultures have other customs. But in some cases I agree.
Reply 61
claire1985
Please tell me you are joking.........? You honestly don't see anything wrong with a woman not getting a job when they are of childbearing age, just in case they get pregnant and they have to pay them maternity leave? If you don't see anything wrong with that, there is no hope...


Somefield supermakets ask on their application form if a woman has excercised her right to maternity leave to enable them to discriminate on these grounds. Outrageous... write to your local MP!
Reply 62
eleenia
The word feminist gives such a distorting impression of women who wear dungarees and don't shave their pits.

LOL :biggrin:
Reply 63
ben2111
That is right, but quite honestly I think the figures are not always very sincere. But fact is, many employers are afraid of women getting pregnant, that is aa problem.

I can see a debate coming up about women´s rights in Islam again... i don´t fully agree I´m afraid. Women´s rights across the world are not necessarily our problem, other cultures have other customs. But in some cases I agree.


Interesting, what makes you think the figures are not sincere? I think the 'culture' clause is a tricky one - one the one hand i don't think its enough to say 'hey, it's their culture and we should respect that' but on the other hand i'd be nervous about trying to impose our cultural norms/ideals on another people.
Reply 64
ben2111
That is right, but quite honestly I think the figures are not always very sincere. But fact is, many employers are afraid of women getting pregnant, that is aa problem.

People seem to be forgetting one minor detail here - men get paternity leave as well! Employers do not ask men if they have exercised their right to paternity leave do they?!?!? Also not all women choose to take their fully maternity leave! There are occasions when fathers take longer leave than the mother as the mother would rather get back to work!
Reply 65
eleenia
Somefield supermakets ask on their application form if a woman has excercised her right to maternity leave to enable them to discriminate on these grounds. Outrageous... write to your local MP!

That isnt actually allowed anyway. Employers must be seen to be equal when hiring staff, so they cannot ask things like, "Are you thinking of starting a family soon?" etc.
Reply 66
JamesF
That isnt actually allowed anyway. Employers must be seen to be equal when hiring staff, so they cannot ask things like, "Are you thinking of starting a family soon?" etc.

I know, but i think there must be some legal loophole otherwise how could they get away with asking that on their application form? Or do they hope that the people that apply for the jobs will be too stupid/desperate or whatever to give a damn or notice. Frankly, i think its outrageous and i would boycote the shop if my pathetic need for nicotine didn't drag me daily to their garage down the road.
Reply 67
gemma1811
People seem to be forgetting one minor detail here - men get paternity leave as well! Employers do not ask men if they have exercised their right to paternity leave do they?!?!? Also not all women choose to take their fully maternity leave! There are occasions when fathers take longer leave than the mother as the mother would rather get back to work!


I don't get your point, sorry.
Reply 68
SasunD
you try typing on a laptop keyboard where the keys are closer together, all same level, not as reised as traditional keyboards, and the mousepad messes up the mouse (its a touchpad for a mouse).

Don't get me started on that - i could set up a whole new thread on spelling fascists. what does it matter? communication is the key issue. Do you understand me less if i write 'pepul shud be aloud to spewl how vey like?'
Reply 69
SasunD
fine, you don't want complimet, won't get compliment.
lets replace the word 'caring' with emotional.
women are more emotional, or don't hide, or leanr to hide as men do. you don't want a perosn in the army who gets shocked or cries for ages kos his/her friend died.

same with PM. you don't want a PM, who cires kos people died in the 9/11 attacks. no. sure, there are women who as said before, will be like the men in terms of the characteristics mentioned, but generally speaking women tend to be more emotional.


That's just pathetic. Men have suffered extreme psychological effects from seeing their friends die in warfare. As for women being more emotional - what planet are you on? Have you never met a woman who never cries or a man who weeps? I think your stereotyping and closed-mindedness is a very good reason for need for feminism in itself.
Reply 70
mik1a
No, I'm saying that an already pregnant woman is asking for discrimination when she applies for a job knowing she will get 1 year's free pay. I would go as far as to say it's an insult to the company's intelligence even thinking they would pay you.
Then you're attacking a straw man.

Claire, or anyone else, never argued that.
Reply 71
eleenia
Somefield supermakets ask on their application form if a woman has excercised her right to maternity leave to enable them to discriminate on these grounds. Outrageous... write to your local MP!

Thats riduculous! They shouldn't be allowed to discriminate like that!
Reply 72
mik1a
No, I'm saying that an already pregnant woman is asking for discrimination when she applies for a job knowing she will get 1 year's free pay. I would go as far as to say it's an insult to the company's intelligence even thinking they would pay you.

Fact: in law you have to have been working for a company for 6 months before you are allowed maternity pay, this can be extended to a year in some sectors. Of course i'm not saying you should get a job when you are pregnant and then expect maternity pay, it is highly unlikely that given the 6 month clause, the dates would tally anyway. What i'm saying is women shouldn't be passed over for jobs when they are of childbearing age out of fear.
Reply 73
eleenia
That's just pathetic. Men have suffered extreme psychological effects from seeing their friends die in warfare. As for women being more emotional - what planet are you on? Have you never met a woman who never cries or a man who weeps? I think your stereotyping and closed-mindedness is a very good reason for need for feminism in itself.

Here Here. This assumption that women can't get on in politics is complete rubbish, I think there is a need for women to be in politics otherwise half the country is not being adequately represented. The same goes for blacks, jews etc, a multicultural society cannot be achieved if it is governed by white, Christian males.
Reply 74
*wanders in*

OK, so I'm not exactly an expert in feminism. Most of what I do know, I learnt in *gasp* A Level Media Studies. But I think there are way too many generalisations on this thread... women aren't interested in Politics, women are more emotional, men are never emotional, etc, etc. Everybody is different, and I know just as many men as women who couldn't give a s**t about Politics.

I think feminism isn't as relevant as it once was, because we have come a lot closer to equal rights than we once were, but I still don't think we're totally equal, and I still think there are valid concerns about how women are portrayed in the media.

As for women taking time off for maternity leave. Hello, we need to have babies for the future of the whole human race. There's simply no way around it. We didn't ask to be the sex that was born with that particular responsibility, it's just the way it is. I bet men wouldn't be complaining about maternity leave if they were the ones having babies.
Reply 75
eleenia
equal pay in all occupations is still a grey area i believe, issues of maternity rights and child care too and the rights of women across the world not just in this country.

There is also the issue of domestic violence still to be solved.
Reply 76
eleenia
I don't get your point, sorry.

Well everyone is saying that women can't get good jobs because they may feel pregant and employers are worried, however people seem to forget that men also get leave when their partner has a child! There time is shorter, however some men become house husbands. Yes a woman can fall pregant and have a baby, but it doesnt mean that she will necessarily give up work for weeks/months!
Reply 77
claire1985
a multicultural society cannot be achieved if it is governed by white, Christian males.
white, christian, middle class males.
Reply 78
llama boy
white, christian, middle class males.

Indeed, sorry missed that one. My point still stands, though
Reply 79
I definitely wouldn't call myself a radical feminist, but I don't think men and women are equal in our society. There are no longer laws discriminating against women (although I do agree that divorce custodial laws are now discriminating against men), it's the attitudes that cause problems.

Well everyone is saying that women can't get good jobs because they may feel pregant and employers are worried, however people seem to forget that men also get leave when their partner has a child! There time is shorter, however some men become house husbands. Yes a woman can fall pregant and have a baby, but it doesnt mean that she will necessarily give up work for weeks/months!


But people expect her to! Women are made to feel guilty by politicians and certain newspapers if they want to go back to work after they have a child.

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