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Next import cheap Polish workers for Xmas jobs before even advertising them in the UK

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Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Or we could raise min wage, in doing so giving more financial incentive to work, and reduce the welfare bill that is making up what employers should be paying their workers. Or replace welfare with universal basic income, then that way as you work you work tops up your income compared to where you lose benefit money as you gain wage money.

Full employment was discarded ages ago. It is official policy to have at least 2 million unemployed people (or something like that).

Raising min wage, means employers have to pay more money, which means they raise prices on goods- which has just now cancelled-out the increase in min wage and also increased inflation.

So, you cant make a poor person wealthier through min wage unless they make themselves more attractive to employers.....
Original post by billydisco

So, you cant make a poor person wealthier through min wage unless they make themselves more attractive to employers.....


Therefore?? What is it you're suggesting again?

How are you planning to get the feckless and underclass to work?
Original post by Alfissti
Therefore?? What is it you're suggesting again?

How are you planning to get the feckless and underclass to work?


Do you even have much contact with the unemployed or do you just believe what you see in the Daily Fail?

Many unemployed people want a job. The 'feckless' and 'underclass' you speak of are a minority.


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Original post by datpiff
Do you even have much contact with the unemployed or do you just believe what you see in the Daily Fail?

Many unemployed people want a job. The 'feckless' and 'underclass' you speak of are a minority.


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I run businesses, we've seen plenty that have come through our doors that don't meet your statement of "unemployed people want a job"

Minority? I highly doubt it else there won't be as big an influx of Polish, Romanians and other EU-10 countries nationals in UK doing all the minimum wage jobs.

In fact these days, there is just as big an influx of "coloured Nordics" going over to UK for work because they are essentially unemployable in Scandinavian countries but somehow manage to gain employment in UK.
Original post by Alfissti
I run businesses, we've seen plenty that have come through our doors that don't meet your statement of "unemployed people want a job"

Minority? I highly doubt it else there won't be as big an influx of Polish, Romanians and other EU-10 countries nationals in UK doing all the minimum wage jobs.

In fact these days, there is just as big an influx of "coloured Nordics" going over to UK for work because they are essentially unemployable in Scandinavian countries but somehow manage to gain employment in UK.


So your business is representative of every business in the UK? I'm guessing you're in the warehousing business (which I like to call slavery)? Well I am actually from the area in which the Next factory is and I can tell you now that there is no lack of people in that area who want a job.

I have worked in warehousing for a good while before I got a better paid and respectable job (research) and it just isn't worth the long term health problems that it can cause and the low pay. A lot of warehouses and agencies just reach for bare minimum standards which I find disgusting. I found cleaning toilets to be better than warehousing. Least I got treat like a human being. In warehouses you're not viewed as being human. You're an ant, but if enough ants revolt they can take over the colony.

IMO the recruitment industry (job agencies) need more tight regulation. It's like any tosser can set up a recruitment business. The only thing we can do is name and shame crap agencies and businesses that deal with them.


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(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by billydisco
Raising min wage, means employers have to pay more money, which means they raise prices on goods- which has just now cancelled-out the increase in min wage and also increased inflation.

So, you cant make a poor person wealthier through min wage unless they make themselves more attractive to employers.....


Then stop complaining when the state has to prop up their income. That was also why Natural monopolies and other sectors that provide the essentials were taken over by the government in Keynesian times. To stop mindless profiteering of essentials. Proper regulation can create better and more efficient capitalism. They is no reason why food prices or rent prices can't be regulated. Housing is another example, the state is paying people's rent and it could cost less for the tax payer to put people in council houses. Raise min wage or don't, you've got heavy state interference either way. My way reduces the benefits bill as it puts the burden on the employers to pay people properly rather than have the state subsidize their profits. Your way is far more bureaucratic and statist with all the means testing and handing out of welfare. Your right wing minimizing the state is a lie. Of course you could be one of those that is happy for people to starve in their Aryn Rand dystopia. In which case you have absolutely no social conscience (which I imagine makes you proud as I hear they hate that term) and I feel quite justified in ignoring your "solutions".

The fact Australia has a min wage above £10 and they are doing just fine proves it is more complicated than you made out. Australia does prove wrong the view that raising the min wage is somehow fundamentally catastrophic and will make the economy implode as they are doing just fine (better than us). Min wage clearly isn't like pushing the big red nuclear button.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Alfissti
Therefore?? What is it you're suggesting again?

How are you planning to get the feckless and underclass to work?

Ive said it about four times now- they should be offered these Next jobs and if they refuse, remove their benefits.
Original post by datpiff
So your business is representative of every business in the UK? I'm guessing you're in the warehousing business (which I like to call slavery)? Well I am actually from the area in which the Next factory is and I can tell you now that there is no lack of people in that area who want a job.


As a small hotelier, what I face isn't too different from the rest. As the one involved in boutique real estate development, problems faced isn't that different from the big boys. One of the businesses I'm also involved in is cold-chain logistics, cold warehouse environment that collects, repacks and ships out seafood abroad, funny you'd think that is slavery considering all the lifting and moving are done by machines, no doubt it is cold in there but slavery like conditions? I'm pretty sure none of my Polish workers think so. It's attitudes like yours' that today in UK plenty of employers prefer workers from EU rather than home grown ones.

Why didn't Next take in all those nearby then since it is an area where people "want a job"? If these 3000 Polish were taken in through an agency it would have cost the same or less to take on a British worker.


Original post by datpiff

I have worked in warehousing for a good while before I got a better paid and respectable job (research) and it just isn't worth the long term health problems that it can cause and the low pay. A lot of warehouses and agencies just reach for bare minimum standards which I find disgusting. I found cleaning toilets to be better than warehousing. Least I got treat like a human being. In warehouses you're not viewed as being human. You're an ant, but if enough ants revolt they can take over the colony.


LOL. Little wonder Next took in the Polish.

Original post by datpiff

IMO the recruitment industry (job agencies) need more tight regulation. It's like any tosser can set up a recruitment business. The only thing we can do is name and shame crap agencies and businesses that deal with them.


You really think so?

What's your experiences been with these agencies then?
Original post by billydisco
Ive said it about four times now- they should be offered these Next jobs and if they refuse, remove their benefits.


Why should they as a company take on people that obviously don't WANT to work there, isn't fit to work there and an abhorrent waste of good money to take on to work there?

You do realize unproductive workers eventually also cause prices of goods to go up don't you?
Original post by Alfissti
You do realize unproductive workers eventually also cause prices of goods to go up don't you?

You do realise admitting 2 million low-skilled immigrants requires building new:

-Roads
-Railways
-Schools
-Houses
-Hospitals

-Power/water

and for what? Nothing. This country is not wealthier- the only people who have benefits are the Eastern Europeans.

Every low-skilled immigrant who comes here brings us hardly anything and adds additional pressure to the demand on housing....
Original post by billydisco
First bold part- shoot them with rubber bullets. If a few die- we'll decrease the benefits bill and remove a few idiots in the process.

Second bold part- I keep repeating myself, take away their benefits and starve them. They either work- or they starve (this is for people who have refused a job offered to them).


What a ****ing cop-out. You must have no semblance of conscience if you fail to argue against my points yet continue your flawed way of thinking. Enjoy the hell you've made for yourself on earth.
Original post by Alfissti
One of the businesses I'm also involved in is cold-chain logistics, cold warehouse environment that collects, repacks and ships out seafood abroad, funny you'd think that is slavery considering all the lifting and moving are done by machines, no doubt it is cold in there but slavery like conditions? I'm pretty sure none of my Polish workers think so. It's attitudes like yours' that today in UK plenty of employers prefer workers from EU rather than home grown ones?


Errm actually no. Of course there is some work done by machines, but a lot of the work such as packing are done by hand on production lines. Have you even been in the Next and Amazon warehouses? I have worked at Next and Amazon and this is pretty much the same. My gripe is at productivity rates and long long working hours. Next weren't too bad but Amazon are the WORST to work for. I shouldn't really have to go into detail about what working at Amazon is like because there's a lot of research and articles out there telling the same story. Type it into Google and you'll find a ton of horror stories.



If you really prefer Polish workers why don't you just move your business to Poland instead of whining and bitching about British workers? Seriously. From what I've heard you don't sound like a good employer to work for anyway.



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I find it astounding in this day and age that Next are allowed to get away with bringing workers in from the continent when they have not advertised the jobs in the UK. Even if the minimum wage is all which is being paid it makes a mockery of unemployment in this country being side lined in preference for overseas workers. What people forget is that when big companies set up there large operations they do it in consultation with the Local Authorities and where unemployment is high. Usually they get grants from the Government and Local Authorities to encourage them to do this. I don't know if Next got such a deal here in the UK, but if they didn't maybe they should have set their operation up in Poland instead? Having now heard what is happening with this I will certainly be boycotting Next from now on until they change their policies in employment. I would encourage others to do the same.
Original post by 6Jesus6Christ6
What a ****ing cop-out. You must have no semblance of conscience if you fail to argue against my points yet continue your flawed way of thinking. Enjoy the hell you've made for yourself on earth.

Erm, let me understand you correctly......You think its wrong to:

-Shoot people with rubber bullets who are rioting?
-Remove benefits from those who were offered a job?

:rolleyes:

Care to tell me which one of the above is wrong and why exactly?
Original post by billydisco
Erm, let me understand you correctly......You think its wrong to:

-Shoot people with rubber bullets who are rioting?
-Remove benefits from those who were offered a job?

:rolleyes:

Care to tell me which one of the above is wrong and why exactly?


You think it's right to take away someone's bread just so that they become a slave to some multi-million pound corporation?

You think that forcing someone into work who doesn't care for their responsibilities will result in a productive workforce? That this won't lead to more economic problems down the line? If you were a business owner, would you hire any member of the underclass?

I'd like to ask, what kind of job do you do?
Original post by 6Jesus6Christ6
You think it's right to take away someone's bread just so that they become a slave to some multi-million pound corporation?

Slaves aren't paid the national minimum wage mate ..... :wink:
Original post by billydisco
Slaves aren't paid the national minimum wage mate ..... :wink:


Slaves are fed and housed in order to work.
Boycott the place then.
Original post by billydisco
Slaves aren't paid the national minimum wage mate ..... :wink:


Guess you don't work either?
Original post by 6Jesus6Christ6
Slaves are fed and housed in order to work.

So you agree- slaves arent/werent paid the national minimum wage?

Are you proposing every person in the UK who doesn't like their job should refuse to work and claim benefits and the minority who enjoy their jobs be taxed 90% to fund the lazy ****s?
(edited 9 years ago)

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