Uk following Australia with Immigration

Sorry, with what statistics and evidence (other than anecdotal)?

Because anecdotes don't prove ****e.

You said no-one with a family to support would do it. You were wrong.

Semantics. I should have said 'not many people'.

It is true for those with families. Who is going to endanger their families well-being with moralistic notions of 'I must work, it is the right thing to do!'. No-one.

If you can better provide for your family with benefits, you will take the benefits. Ideals don't come into it.

Actually, I know a couple. But anecdotal evidence isn't good enough for you right.

No, I'm 20, I don't have kids. And yep you're right about the pride thing, it's a matter of principles. If you can work, you work.

How do you know that my family aren't working class? Can I see some statistics about the plight of working class people being worsened as a result of immigration? Is there a direct correlation?

When you mention the WC people, are you referring solely to white British working class people? You seem to have a very us vs them ideology.

Firstly, Segat, stfu. I know this isn't D&D so you can just sit there sounding like a 14 year old, but please don't, it's terrible form.

Secondly, tehjonny, stfu. There is no working class anymore. I live in a single parent family, my dad fixes washing machines all day and I worked at Mcdonalds for two and a half year. Yet we all have mobile phones, we have Sky, we don't thieve benefits and a car. The working class is a myth.

As for people doing labourish jobs having their markets flooded, so what? That's exactly what happened when conveyer belt manufacturing was invented, machines essentially flooding the market of the people who previously did that job. Shall we get rid of machines so people don't lose jobs.

How many cobblers do you know now? What about all the people that used to rear horses for carts? They became mechanics. If you want to keep your living, you need to evolve. Neither the world nor the government owe you a living, and if you can't provide something that people want or can't get anywhere else, you won't get paid. This has always been the case. If Polish immigrants are able to do the working class jobs for less than the British and still survive, then so can the British. If the British aren't willing to take the financial hit, they need to find a new job. Competition creates efficiency and meritocracy. I couldn't give a **** what happens to those who aren't efficient nor meritting of my money.

Basically, stop moaning.

I wasn't referring to white unemployment, I was referring to unemployment of the working class in general. Stop thinking that I'm always attacking white people or something ffs, I'm not. And I haven't suggested laziness of anyone else at all, I just said the assertion you made that EVERYONE would go on benefits if they could get more money from it than working was false, and I used myself as an example. I'm not claiming to be speaking for an entire class in Britain here.

Right, so you're not even sure if there is a correlation between immigrants coming in and an increase in working class unemployment, yet that's what you've been ranting about on this thread. You're blaming unemployment in this country on immigrants when you're not even sure of the facts.

This again has nothing to do with immigration, more so discussing the welfare state.

'Blame the immigrant' mentality again. Yes of course in terms of economics, the more demand there is for houses, with a lack of supply, the higher the prices go. There are many reasons for house prices increasing as dramatically as they have done though and simply pinning the entire blame onto immigrants is absurd.

I'm inclined to suggest that those rich fat cats who buy up 10 houses and put them up for rent, and then sell them a couple of years down the line when prices have gone up even more are more responsible for driving up house prices.

Right, so immigrants coming here for economic gain, and then living in ****ty conditions, and as such forcing the workers already here to take a hit in wages and as such living conditions, is a good thing for everyone now?

No, it's not good for everyone. It's good for the people willing to compete, and those who reap the benefits of an efficient and competitive market. The people that do not benefit are those who were used to a comfortable lifestyle free from competition and now find that their own laziness has earned them the inability to compete.

When people complaim about people taking their jobs, what they're actually complaining about is the fact that a lot of people have come along who are better at their job than they are. If they weren't, they wouldn't get work.

Right. So saying 'all polish are this' is wrong. However, saying 'all english are that' is right. I do wonder...

In actual fact, both are false. It does say much that you've no problems with generalised attacks on the English, whilst railing against the similar against Poles.

Where do they live that, upon working 50 hours a week, they can only just feed and house themselves? Even at minimum wage thats about £1k a month. You said feed and house themselves, where are they living, a Penthouse in Chelsea?

What are the alternatives? Stop immigration just because your chums aren't good enough at their job to fend off competition? In that case, he's the only one that gains, where as the Polish chap who's better at his job is stuck in a presumably saturated market, the consumers here are getting a worse product for their money, and our depleted industries, such as dentistry and engineering, are being starved of well-qualified european workers. Yeah, that sounds better.

Either that, or the government offers subsidies and protection to a dying industry. Because, as i'm sure you know, France's economy is an absolute power house at the moment.

So, if the British government introduced legislation that aided 10m Africans, but put 5m Brits in the dole queue, you would support it fully?

Christ...I thought you understood economic principles...

Their is a good reason manufacturing collapsed in this country. We can't compete with emerging economies that can produce the same goods on the cheap via paying their workers less. Unskilled manufacturing is dead in this country because it isn't competitive for companies to engage in. Why in HELL would a company manufacture here, when they can do it Bangladesh for a third of the costs?

Minimum wage is what, 5.85 now? 5.85x40 = 234 squids.

I ask you mizzy, do you advocate an entirely open border policy, regardless of the social and economic ramifications? Why are we allowing mass immigration if we aren't sure what it will cause? I don't like the idea that my government operates a 'cross your fingers a hope' policy in regards to this issue.

I don't dislike immigrants. I don't have a problem with people coming here to do better for themselves. I do have a problem with people saying any form of immigration control would make us 'racist'. Most western countries have a FAR stricter immigration policy than we do. I don't hear them getting branded racist.

Minimum wage is what, 5.85 now? 5.85x40 = 234 squids. That is 936 quid a month. 300 rent. 636. 100 on food. 536. Keeping a car in order, say 200. 336. Tax etc, probs about 150 quid. 186. Divided by four is 46.50 a week to spend on yourself. Wow, what a life that must be. A whole 50quid to spend on yourself a week! Thats like, a draw, a couple of packs of ciggies, and perhaps a trip to the cinema. My, I truly envy them. Those are crap figures, but they give you an idea. It isn't poverty, but it isn't a happy life either. So you work 50 a week. That is still 100quid for yourself. Who knows what will come up? You might have to spend all your leisure money in a month on a trip to the dentists, or to get a new tyre for your car!

My chums work in shops mainly. You don't need any skills . Again, you are assuming the only reason someone can lose their job is because they are bad at it. What if the boss justs find someone he can pay much less, cash in hand stylie?