The Student Room Group

Schools encouraged to scrap gendered language like Sir and Miss

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I think using a title is a good idea, to distance the teacher from the kids and hopefully command some respect.

I don't see why they need to be "Sir" and "Miss", but I do think they need to be already established in our language with some connotation of respect to avoid mockery when the schools and teachers insist upon it. "Teacher" does not command respect in this country, and trying to enforce it as one will inevitably backfire.

I get that there are some very vocal people who want to pretend that boys and girls are identical and would grow up so if society didn't point out the differences, but some things that do distinguish are useful and you need to have a viable replacement for the thing you're scrapping.
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
https://www.lbc.co.uk/hot-topics/schools/scrap-sir-miss-adopt-gender-neutral-language-schools/

In a lecture organised by the National Education Union (NEU), Dr Elly Banes, chief executive of the Educate & Celebrate charity, said schools should aim to become more gender neutral - a model she said was "working very well" in a lot of schools.

Dr Barnes said teachers should be referred to as "teacher" or "headteacher", followed by their surname.

The advice was not limited to teachers, and ‘head boy’ could be replaced by ‘head pupil’ in future.


The only word that accurately describes this 'doctor' and situation starts with an 'r' and ends with 'etarded'
Personally I've always just thought teachers should introduce themselves to kids by their first name anyway.
It’s much easier to say sir or Miss,

Teacher surname just sounds a bit clunky.
Reply 24
It's just a harmless formality. There's nothing actually wrong with it.
Original post by caravaggio2
If the Tories had the sense to stand up to the onward march of the woke religion on principle they would walk the next election, regardless of partygate.

Up next.... no more Mr or Mrs.

There is the use of 'Mx' for people who don't use Mr or Mrs. Just because there is more common use of expanded language for people other than men and women, doesn't mean men and women are eradicated :redface:

I think 'Sir' and 'Miss' is old fashioned anyway. We had to use it at our school and I remember thinking it was really odd when I first joined.
Reply 26
Original post by Andrew97
It’s much easier to say sir or Miss,

Teacher surname just sounds a bit clunky.


this is actually quite funny to me. where i'm from you address your teacher (at least before uni) as Mr, Mrs, Ms, Miss and then with their surname (obviously if you're a woman you have variety of titles, cuz you're property :h: ). not clunky whatsoever. and certainly don't address a teacher as sir unless you're in the army.
Original post by parmezanne
I think 'Sir' and 'Miss' is old fashioned anyway. We had to use it at our school and I remember thinking it was really odd when I first joined.


Really? We didn’t have to use “Sir” and “Miss” at our school, but everybody did anyway just because a one-syllable word felt much easier than saying “Mr [surname] etc. every time.

If we were talking about them in the third person we’d normally use just their surname. Or sometimes we’d use their three letter initials e.g. JPD, (Mr Davies), TFC (Mr Cross), especially if it was in writing, but I think that was a tradition quite specific to my school.
Original post by tazarooni89
Really? We didn’t have to use “Sir” and “Miss” at our school, but everybody did anyway just because a one-syllable word felt much easier than saying “Mr [surname] etc. every time.

If we were talking about them in the third person we’d normally use just their surname. Or sometimes we’d use their three letter initials e.g. JPD, (Mr Davies), TFC (Mr Cross), especially if it was in writing, but I think that was a tradition quite specific to my school.

Yeah saying Miss in lesson is faster than saying Miss/Dr X each time.
Original post by anarchism101
Personally I've always just thought teachers should introduce themselves to kids by their first name anyway.

I agree - it's not like we won't find out anyways :biggrin:
Original post by Crazed cat lady
Schools have not been told. Someone of little relevance has suggest it.

But such details should not get in the way of identity politics obsessives and their need for their daily dose of outrage.

Although I’ve always found it a little weird that “Miss” is used to address a person in a position of authority.

But twitter said it so it must be true!
Original post by Joel 96
In our school, we addressed married female teachers as "Mrs" all the time. I thought that was standard.


Same, except there was always that edgy teacher who made sure to let everyone know at all times that she goes by 'MIZZ' (Ms) not Mrs

Original post by Thisismyunitsr

The advice was not limited to teachers, and ‘head boy’ could be replaced by ‘head pupil’ in future.

My school was an all girls school so we just head girl and deputy head girl
Original post by Crazed cat lady
Schools have not been told. Someone of little relevance has suggest it.

But such details should not get in the way of identity politics obsessives and their need for their daily dose of outrage.

Although I’ve always found it a little weird that “Miss” is used to address a person in a position of authority.

One of my teachers at secondary school considered being called "Miss" to be an insult and woe betide you if you used it instead of "Ms Lastname." It wasn't an easy habit to break when we'd been calling every female teacher "Miss" for over half our lives.
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
https://www.lbc.co.uk/hot-topics/schools/scrap-sir-miss-adopt-gender-neutral-language-schools/

In a lecture organised by the National Education Union (NEU), Dr Elly Banes, chief executive of the Educate & Celebrate charity, said schools should aim to become more gender neutral - a model she said was "working very well" in a lot of schools.

Dr Barnes said teachers should be referred to as "teacher" or "headteacher", followed by their surname.

The advice was not limited to teachers, and ‘head boy’ could be replaced by ‘head pupil’ in future.

Seriously? This is just ridiculous.
I cba to read the whole thread, but while I think scrapping all gendered language is just stupid and trying to fix a problem which isn't there, I defo think the whole 'sir/ miss' thing is rly vulgar and rude - in what way is 'miss' a suitable way to adress a woman?? Just say mr/miss/mrs/ms and then their name - how hard is it to remember a title and one last name lol?
Reply 34
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
https://www.lbc.co.uk/hot-topics/schools/scrap-sir-miss-adopt-gender-neutral-language-schools/

In a lecture organised by the National Education Union (NEU), Dr Elly Banes, chief executive of the Educate & Celebrate charity, said schools should aim to become more gender neutral - a model she said was "working very well" in a lot of schools.

Dr Barnes said teachers should be referred to as "teacher" or "headteacher", followed by their surname.

The advice was not limited to teachers, and ‘head boy’ could be replaced by ‘head pupil’ in future.

I agree - elevating a male to the knighted status of Sir, while degrading the status of a woman to a Miss widens the gender equality gap. Let me explain, in the old days men were seen to be of higher status than women, and among women married women were of higher status than unmarried women (simply because they are married to a man!) So each time you respectfully say 'Sir' to a man, and 'Miss' to a female teacher you are actually exacerbating the problem. Some countries already refer to their teachers as Teacher, irrespective of gender and marital status - as it should be in my opinion. It does not matter if you are married or not, or what gender you are - as long as you can teach your subject.
We see this in everyday practice in our Hospitals, Dr this etc. Nurse, etc. Our police officers are referred to as PO ....
Why should teachers be any different? I would go so far as to say they shouldn't be and indeed, while students are young and impressionable they should be taught the 'correct' titles and the reasons why.
Male Teacher
Original post by TeacherE
I agree - elevating a male to the knighted status of Sir, while degrading the status of a woman to a Miss widens the gender equality gap. Let me explain, in the old days men were seen to be of higher status than women, and among women married women were of higher status than unmarried women (simply because they are married to a man!) So each time you respectfully say 'Sir' to a man, and 'Miss' to a female teacher you are actually exacerbating the problem. Some countries already refer to their teachers as Teacher, irrespective of gender and marital status - as it should be in my opinion. It does not matter if you are married or not, or what gender you are - as long as you can teach your subject.
We see this in everyday practice in our Hospitals, Dr this etc. Nurse, etc. Our police officers are referred to as PO ....
Why should teachers be any different? I would go so far as to say they shouldn't be and indeed, while students are young and impressionable they should be taught the 'correct' titles and the reasons why.
Male Teacher

Isn't bad that students won't know the correct gender of their teachers? This could have unforeseen consequences later in life.
Original post by TeacherE
I agree - elevating a male to the knighted status of Sir, while degrading the status of a woman to a Miss widens the gender equality gap. Let me explain, in the old days men were seen to be of higher status than women, and among women married women were of higher status than unmarried women (simply because they are married to a man!) So each time you respectfully say 'Sir' to a man, and 'Miss' to a female teacher you are actually exacerbating the problem. Some countries already refer to their teachers as Teacher, irrespective of gender and marital status - as it should be in my opinion. It does not matter if you are married or not, or what gender you are - as long as you can teach your subject.
We see this in everyday practice in our Hospitals, Dr this etc. Nurse, etc. Our police officers are referred to as PO ....
Why should teachers be any different? I would go so far as to say they shouldn't be and indeed, while students are young and impressionable they should be taught the 'correct' titles and the reasons why.
Male Teacher

Oh give over, so much fuss about nothing. People are going to continue to use ''sir'' and ''miss'', it's efficient, easy and quick. No one's going to just refer to their teacher as ''teacher'', that sounds weird and unnatural in English.
Original post by Thisismyunitsr
Isn't bad that students won't know the correct gender of their teachers? This could have unforeseen consequences later in life.

Students will know the teachers' sex because you can still tell visually whether someone's male or female and I guarantee that '''sir'' and ''miss'' will continue to be used.
Original post by Sorcerer of Old
Students will know the teachers' sex because you can still tell visually whether someone's male or female and I guarantee that '''sir'' and ''miss'' will continue to be used.

Given the wokeness of today's generation I am not sure this will be the case for everyone very soon.
They're dropping gender.

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