Remembrance Day . . . remembering what?
The people who gave life or limb to protect our freedom of expression . . . but I will not be watching the politicians at the Cenotaph, what are they remembering or learning?
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
If you dont want to wathc then dont... nobody forcing you.
Original post by Andrew97
If you dont want to wathc then dont... nobody forcing you.
Of course, but it was the failure of politics that lead to the carnage of World Wars 1 & 2, and politics maintains the Ukraine war. Think about it, all the people that suffered and died had nothing against each other beforehand!
I know German and Italian people, we just want to enjoy each other's culture and trade, no doubt our forefathers were the same, so do we just remain silent, saying nothing to or about the political leaders and their client media?
Wouldn't our forefathers be ashamed of us? Why did they suffer and die?
Original post by NJA
The people who gave life or limb to protect our freedom of expression . . . but I will not be watching the politicians at the Cenotaph, what are they remembering or learning?
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
You mostly certainly are not bearing the costs of the Ukraine war from the comfort of your computer.
That burden is on the Ukrainian people.
Original post by Gazpacho.
You mostly certainly are not bearing the costs of the Ukraine war from the comfort of your computer.
That burden is on the Ukrainian people.
That burden is on the Ukrainian people.
Wrong, oil and gas prices, supermarkets and vehicle part suppliers etc. are blaming the Ukraine war for price hikes and huge delays (also leading to price increases too). We relied on Ukraine for corn and sunflower oil which goes in many products. Post-pandemic growth generally is slowed, affecting investment, production and employment. Poorer countries are of course suffering more. If you understand economics you will know that using public money to pay people to house Ukrainian refugees will lead to future inflation . . and please don't say I am against helping people this way, I'm just saying if the war wasn't continuing it wouldn't be needed, I am sure these poor people would rather be back home re-building Ukraine.
At least I am lifting a finger to make a few people aware, a few politicians are also trying but I have never seen this clip from the European Parliament on mainstream media.
The purpose of Remembrance Day within the UK, the allies during the world wars and many other NATO member nations is to calmly & quietly remember those who died in service of their countries armed forces.
The people who have decided not to listen to, watch or participate in any remembrance services have that freedom.
The people who have decided not to listen to, watch or participate in any remembrance services have that freedom.
Original post by NJA
Wrong, oil and gas prices, supermarkets and vehicle part suppliers etc. are blaming the Ukraine war for price hikes and huge delays (also leading to price increases too). We relied on Ukraine for corn and sunflower oil which goes in many products. Post-pandemic growth generally is slowed, affecting investment, production and employment. Poorer countries are of course suffering more. If you understand economics you will know that using public money to pay people to house Ukrainian refugees will lead to future inflation . . and please don't say I am against helping people this way, I'm just saying if the war wasn't continuing it wouldn't be needed, I am sure these poor people would rather be back home re-building Ukraine.
At least I am lifting a finger to make a few people aware, a few politicians are also trying but I have never seen this clip from the European Parliament on mainstream media.
At least I am lifting a finger to make a few people aware, a few politicians are also trying but I have never seen this clip from the European Parliament on mainstream media.
Increased price of cooking is not at all comparable to the cost in lives that the Ukrainians are facing.
I get it is something of a zeitgeist to criticise Remembrance Day among the edgy, but you really aren't making a good case.
I agree that remembering people who have died in conflict is important. (Not just the death of combatants, but civilians too.) But I personally prefer not to do so by wearing a poppy or taking part in Remembrance day events. I can do so in my own way, and don't feel any need to be performative and tell the whole world about it.
I'm sure many people take part genuinely and in good faith, but it's a bit naive to assume that everybody does. Beneath the surface some of it seems very insincere and even hypocritical to me. The political elites and ruling classes typically use military power to further their own selfish agendas, and send expendable pawns to risk their lives and kill their fellow man for those causes. In order to win their blind loyalty to King and Country, they use propaganda to spin the narrative that it's the heroic forces of good versus the villainous forces of evil (though conflict is never as black and white as that). And instead of actually caring about their soldiers as human beings, looking after them in tangible ways or dare I say joining them to fight on the battlefield themselves, they repay their loyalty mostly with lip service and empty gestures. And then they encourage everyone else to virtue-signal and do the same. I don't agree with this and I don't think people should be fooled by it.
I believe that remembering war casualties is important, because it is a reminder to ourselves of how tragic war is. It results in absolutely needless loss of life, mostly of innocent people who just want to live peacefully, mind their own business, and probably don’t even care about the issue being fought over. Over a million people were killed in Britain’s war with Iraq, whose crime was merely to exist in the wrong place at the wrong time. People’s children, parents, spouses and siblings are taken from them and their lives are ripped apart, all for the sake of one government’s beef with another.
I'm reminded of Blaise Pascal's quote here: "Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a quarrel with mine, though I have not quarrelled with him?"
Unfortunately I don’t think Remembrance events embody any of this. They come across more as a “thank you” (of debatable sincerity) to those who join the armed forces and take part in war, instead of urging them not to go near it and not to have anything to do with it.
I'm sure many people take part genuinely and in good faith, but it's a bit naive to assume that everybody does. Beneath the surface some of it seems very insincere and even hypocritical to me. The political elites and ruling classes typically use military power to further their own selfish agendas, and send expendable pawns to risk their lives and kill their fellow man for those causes. In order to win their blind loyalty to King and Country, they use propaganda to spin the narrative that it's the heroic forces of good versus the villainous forces of evil (though conflict is never as black and white as that). And instead of actually caring about their soldiers as human beings, looking after them in tangible ways or dare I say joining them to fight on the battlefield themselves, they repay their loyalty mostly with lip service and empty gestures. And then they encourage everyone else to virtue-signal and do the same. I don't agree with this and I don't think people should be fooled by it.
I believe that remembering war casualties is important, because it is a reminder to ourselves of how tragic war is. It results in absolutely needless loss of life, mostly of innocent people who just want to live peacefully, mind their own business, and probably don’t even care about the issue being fought over. Over a million people were killed in Britain’s war with Iraq, whose crime was merely to exist in the wrong place at the wrong time. People’s children, parents, spouses and siblings are taken from them and their lives are ripped apart, all for the sake of one government’s beef with another.
I'm reminded of Blaise Pascal's quote here: "Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a quarrel with mine, though I have not quarrelled with him?"
Unfortunately I don’t think Remembrance events embody any of this. They come across more as a “thank you” (of debatable sincerity) to those who join the armed forces and take part in war, instead of urging them not to go near it and not to have anything to do with it.
(edited 5 months ago)
Original post by NJA
The people who gave life or limb to protect our freedom of expression . . . but I will not be watching the politicians at the Cenotaph, what are they remembering or learning?
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
They are remembering that we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of WWI nor WWII.
Original post by TiBFS
They are remembering that we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of WWI nor WWII.
What effects are they bearing?
What is the point in remembering history if we don't learn from it?
The elephant in the room is why was the non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato?
Since you know what they were thinking, please tell me!
Original post by NJA
The people who gave life or limb to protect our freedom of expression . . . but I will not be watching the politicians at the Cenotaph, what are they remembering or learning?
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The level of self-indulgence you're exhibiting here is astounding.
Ukraine, regardless of where anyone stands on it - is something of a reminder of what limited war actually means, and is something that hasn't been seen in Europe since WWII. Pretty much every male in the country is stood up to fight to the death and often that's going to be the result. There's no saying "not my war" or going out to protest. That's a luxury for the spoilt children of Western Europe, Australia, Canada, the US and of course this country.
All the criticism of politicians becomes quite irrelevant. There's war and that's the end of it.
Original post by NJA
What effects are they bearing?
What is the point in remembering history if we don't learn from it?
The elephant in the room is why was the non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato?
Since you know what they were thinking, please tell me!
What is the point in remembering history if we don't learn from it?
The elephant in the room is why was the non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato?
Since you know what they were thinking, please tell me!
Huge cut in wealth and living standards. Those two world wars destroyed sterling and sent debt soaring.
Oh, and the dead...
Original post by NJA
What effects are they bearing?
What is the point in remembering history if we don't learn from it?
The elephant in the room is why was the non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato?
Since you know what they were thinking, please tell me!
What is the point in remembering history if we don't learn from it?
The elephant in the room is why was the non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato?
Since you know what they were thinking, please tell me!
The non-Nato membership deal rejected by them and Nato because Nato didn't exist. Just as the non-WEF membership deal rejected by them and WEF because WEF didn't exist.
Original post by tazarooni89
I agree that remembering people who have died in conflict is important. (Not just the death of combatants, but civilians too.) But I personally prefer not to do so by wearing a poppy or taking part in Remembrance day events. I can do so in my own way, and don't feel any need to be performative and tell the whole world about it.
I'm sure many people take part genuinely and in good faith, but it's a bit naive to assume that everybody does. Beneath the surface some of it seems very insincere and even hypocritical to me. The political elites and ruling classes typically use military power to further their own selfish agendas, and send expendable pawns to risk their lives and kill their fellow man for those causes. In order to win their blind loyalty to King and Country, they use propaganda to spin the narrative that it's the heroic forces of good versus the villainous forces of evil (though conflict is never as black and white as that). And instead of actually caring about their soldiers as human beings, looking after them in tangible ways or dare I say joining them to fight on the battlefield themselves, they repay their loyalty mostly with lip service and empty gestures. And then they encourage everyone else to virtue-signal and do the same. I don't agree with this and I don't think people should be fooled by it.
I'm reminded of Blaise Pascal's quote here: "Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a quarrel with mine, though I have not quarrelled with him?"
I'm sure many people take part genuinely and in good faith, but it's a bit naive to assume that everybody does. Beneath the surface some of it seems very insincere and even hypocritical to me. The political elites and ruling classes typically use military power to further their own selfish agendas, and send expendable pawns to risk their lives and kill their fellow man for those causes. In order to win their blind loyalty to King and Country, they use propaganda to spin the narrative that it's the heroic forces of good versus the villainous forces of evil (though conflict is never as black and white as that). And instead of actually caring about their soldiers as human beings, looking after them in tangible ways or dare I say joining them to fight on the battlefield themselves, they repay their loyalty mostly with lip service and empty gestures. And then they encourage everyone else to virtue-signal and do the same. I don't agree with this and I don't think people should be fooled by it.
I'm reminded of Blaise Pascal's quote here: "Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a quarrel with mine, though I have not quarrelled with him?"
What is happening in Gaza is just like this. The rulers are killing ordinary people for no reason but their own plans for power. And when people protest against what they are doing people say they are supporting the other side.
Original post by NJA
The people who gave life or limb to protect our freedom of expression . . . but I will not be watching the politicians at the Cenotaph, what are they remembering or learning?
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
The policy to maintain the war in Ukraine which we were not consulted about, but bear the effects of.
It's a charade, a game.
I appreciate this is a bit out of date but I attended this year's Remembrance at our local spot. The sermon was spot on. We have freedom, but that freedom is not free. And the people who paid for that freedom are who we remember each year.
The soldiers of the Ukraine are paying for the freedom of their nation. The Israelis and Palestinians are both paying for their freedom (or lack of it). Freedom in some parts of the world is a very costly business, but the least we ordinary citizens who enjoy our freedom can do is to once every year, join together, remember and give thanks.
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