The Libertarian Society of TSR.
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Is it?
If a neigbourhood is private property, they can set their own rules as to how the property is administered. This would include maintenance of the roads, pavements, etc.
In gated communities, the residents all pitch in to provide upkeep of the roads in that community. They even have their own security forces.
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
If a neigbourhood is private property, they can set their own rules as to how the property is administered. This would include maintenance of the roads, pavements, etc.
In gated communities, the residents all pitch in to provide upkeep of the roads in that community. They even have their own security forces.
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
Privatise the fire service
There is a very good reason for the fire brigade being publically owned, and that is so they can provide a universal service. Which is fair.
Otherwise you'd end up in the situation where people who had more money could pay more and get a superior fire service. And poor people's houses would burn down.
How is that desirable? i'm all for having more control and freedoms but a universall fire service is a very good thing.
As for private roads, that would suck too. Nationally owned roads allow freedom of movement. if a road was owned by a local community they could in theory stop people using it. Or charge for it.
If that happened people wouldn't be able to get from A to B, or you could become stuck surrounded by groups that wouldn't allow you to use their roads.... or exploit you for the privilidge.
There is a very good reason for the fire brigade being publically owned, and that is so they can provide a universal service. Which is fair.
Otherwise you'd end up in the situation where people who had more money could pay more and get a superior fire service. And poor people's houses would burn down.
How is that desirable? i'm all for having more control and freedoms but a universall fire service is a very good thing.
As for private roads, that would suck too. Nationally owned roads allow freedom of movement. if a road was owned by a local community they could in theory stop people using it. Or charge for it.
If that happened people wouldn't be able to get from A to B, or you could become stuck surrounded by groups that wouldn't allow you to use their roads.... or exploit you for the privilidge.
Members may also be interested in joining the TSR Secularist Society which fellow libertarian member, RhiddynUK, has just set up.
You can already get charged for using roads... or for going to certain places (London for example). Plus it's simply bad economics for this to happen - a bit like shopping centres offering free parking, business would want a good route to their retail areas.
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
As a libertarian, I think government should be limited since government is force.
Government should be limited to protecting rights to the person and property. This includes a police force, a standing army, navy and air force and a judicial system.
Government should be limited to protecting rights to the person and property. This includes a police force, a standing army, navy and air force and a judicial system.
Hmm. Yet after you have the somewhat broader more national areas, I feel that as we are ment to be a rich, powerful society. We should establish are more inside areas making Britain a better place to live in, not just a harder place to invade.
I don't want a government that goes around the world making enemies. I don't want a government that forcibly taxes me, tells me what I can put in my body and tells me what I can own.
I just want to live my life as I see fit. I want the government off my back and a smaller government that doesn't initiate force is the key to that.
I just want to live my life as I see fit. I want the government off my back and a smaller government that doesn't initiate force is the key to that.
LibertineNorth
You can already get charged for using roads... or for going to certain places (London for example). Plus it's simply bad economics for this to happen - a bit like shopping centres offering free parking, business would want a good route to their retail areas.
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
In the US, you have volunteer fire services.
Fire services could be charities. The market would also respond to any demand for fire services. A libertarian society would be a better business environment in which supply could meet demand, since regulations on business would be lesser in number and the self-interest that guides activity in a free market would be maximised.
zooropa
If a neigbourhood is private property, they can set their own rules as to how the property is administered. This would include maintenance of the roads, pavements, etc.
In gated communities, the residents all pitch in to provide upkeep of the roads in that community. They even have their own security forces.
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
In gated communities, the residents all pitch in to provide upkeep of the roads in that community. They even have their own security forces.
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
You're basically talking about Community Burdens on land then? Seems acceptable in a Libertarian world.
LibertineNorth
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
As for the fire service, no reason that the service couldn't respond and then charge afterwards. People with insurance would have it paid for them, people who didn't would simply get billed.
What if I didn't want to pay afterwards? Are the fire service going to come and burn down my house and suffocate my children? If you're going to save people from burning houses you should ask them first if you're planning to charge them.
zooropa
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
This differs from a "social contract" because association in a libertarian society is voluntary. No one would be forced to live in any specific community and could leave at their choosing. A social contract by definition is involuntary. You have to accept that society's contract, simply because you're born or are resident in that country.
You're on a slippery slope from having privately run communities to nation states, in fact if one person decided to buy up all the land they'd be the government of Britain??
homoterror
What if I didn't want to pay afterwards? Are the fire service going to come and burn down my house and suffocate my children? If you're going to save people from burning houses you should ask them first if you're planning to charge them.
Hmm. Well you can already be charged for services you don't desire under the concept of necessity. For example, if your house is flooding while you are away, someone will undoubtedly burst the door down and turn the water off. This is particularly true if you live in a flat.
Hmm... this is becoming rather unsatisfactory. Perhaps some sort of registration system...
homoterror
You're on a slippery slope from having privately run communities to nation states, in fact if one person decided to buy up all the land they'd be the government of Britain??
No one has to sell their land.
And I'm not an anarcho-capitalist so I wouldn't advocate all property being privately owned. A residential community would have the right to set any rules they wanted. The only limit would be respecting rights to the person and property, which would be enforced by the state.
May i join? It's about time we kicked these collectivist, blame-shifting, liberty floundering bastards in the face.
You're a smart, smart man, Beek!
alexanderw
Even with a registration system I think very few people in the world want a situation where people are left to die in burning buildings because they haven't agreed before hand to pay the costs of a rescue.
Rock and a hard place really...
On one side we've got people who're claiming it's wrong to do something to someone's property without their consent, on the other we've got people saying it's wrong to omit to do something...
I'm rather like erring on the side of omission, but even so.
alexanderw
So street lighting wouldn't exist on non private estates.
All estates are private. In a libertarian society, there'd be no 'public estates' (council housing?).
Anyway, it's not like there's street lighting on every street now. The road between one village to mine is not lit at all (much to my city-dwelling grandmother's disdain) and the road up to my house is completely unlit except for one old-style lamp at the end to show where it splits.
I highly recommend you all check out Milton Friedman. Extremely clever guy whether you agree with his politics or not.
He explains a lot about economic libertarianism and can come up with things you've probably never considered.
Check out Free to Choose which is a ground breaking TV series from the 1980s. Full transcripts are available there.
Also check out this facinating video/transcript from Uncommon Knowledge.
Enjoy!
He explains a lot about economic libertarianism and can come up with things you've probably never considered.
Check out Free to Choose which is a ground breaking TV series from the 1980s. Full transcripts are available there.
Also check out this facinating video/transcript from Uncommon Knowledge.
Enjoy!
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