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Cambridge Economics Students and Applicants

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Reply 1220
Original post by Ray_Han
Thanks for the info :smile:. Yeah they mentioned it on the options day. Is that bad? I imagine Germany would be quite interesting to study, having looked at it from a historical perspective, but not a thorough economic one. Having said that it could be quite like economic history this year, which is proving to be a lot of work. We'll see how next week goes...
Unfortunately I am also slow and easily distracted :frown:. I reckon I would be able to do it though, whereas I need to make sure that I am capable of doing the maths.


It's definitely from an economic history perspective. The main thing for the history exam is doing four decent essays in the time and answering the questions they ask - if you do that, you'll do adequately as a bare minimum.
Talk to your DoS about the maths paper, they can probably let you know whether they've got a good supervisor and whether they think you're capable.
Reply 1221
Short question,
a banking internship in which department is considered most useful to demonstrate strong passion for the subject economics?
Original post by Pandin
Short question,
a banking internship in which department is considered most useful to demonstrate strong passion for the subject economics?


What options (of departments) do you have to choose from?
Original post by Pandin
Short question,
a banking internship in which department is considered most useful to demonstrate strong passion for the subject economics?


Why is daddy letting you choose?


This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
Reply 1224
Original post by Pandin
Short question,
a banking internship in which department is considered most useful to demonstrate strong passion for the subject economics?


I don't think it's hugely necessary - and I'd worry about demonstrating more of a passion for investment banking than economics. My director of studies has joked about asking applicants to name the top five investment banks and then rejecting anyone who can... but he says he'd like to have some students.

I think it's important to distinguish between passion for economics as a subject (which is best shown by additional reading, knowing your maths inside out, knowing what the current issues/debates are and talking about your subject to anyone who will listen) and the career opportunities it brings.

That said, if it's something you want to do in the future, you should definitely do the internship - but I wouldn't attempt to build a personal statement around it and I don't know how much it would help.
Reply 1225
Thank you for your help, although I thought working with economists in a division that predicts the future development of economies and evaluates impacts of different events on them would be really interesting!
The problem is that I'm not quite sure which division does that specific stuff.
But if it's more likely to be a disadvantage for a potential application, then I'll better do some further reading during my vations...
Reply 1226
Original post by Pandin
Thank you for your help, although I thought working with economists in a division that predicts the future development of economies and evaluates impacts of different events on them would be really interesting!
The problem is that I'm not quite sure which division does that specific stuff.
But if it's more likely to be a disadvantage for a potential application, then I'll better do some further reading during my vations...


I'd definitely take the internship, and if that's the description of what you're looking for then it would be good experience. I'm just naturally wary because I've seen too many people who don't actually care about the subject and are just using it as a means to an end to get into investment banking, and I worry that this would come across at interview. I'd be curious to hear Alex's thoughts on this though because I do wonder if it's only me that thinks that!
Original post by lp386
I'd definitely take the internship, and if that's the description of what you're looking for then it would be good experience. I'm just naturally wary because I've seen too many people who don't actually care about the subject and are just using it as a means to an end to get into investment banking, and I worry that this would come across at interview. I'd be curious to hear Alex's thoughts on this though because I do wonder if it's only me that thinks that!


It depends on how you present it, and how much the admissions personnel care about concerns that IB may be the main motivator rather than economics as a subject. I think the latter will vary a lot from person to person - if it was me I would care more about ability than motivation, but that could easily be a minority view.
Original post by lp386
I'd definitely take the internship, and if that's the description of what you're looking for then it would be good experience. I'm just naturally wary because I've seen too many people who don't actually care about the subject and are just using it as a means to an end to get into investment banking, and I worry that this would come across at interview. I'd be curious to hear Alex's thoughts on this though because I do wonder if it's only me that thinks that!


My two cents:

This is an interview with a Cambridge professor on the topic which makes for interesting reading: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/joris-luyendijk-banking-blog/2012/mar/16/voices-of-finance-oxbridge-professor-economics

Anyway I suspect that admissions people's main concern is how well people will do on the course, and commitment comes second. I realise this is quite a cynical view and one that could well be wrong (for one thing commitment and enthusiasm for economics will factor into performance). I've certainly got the vibe that once you get here, they are quite laissez-faire about your career options and are almost solely concerned with your performance on the tripos.
Original post by Ray_Han
My two cents:

This is an interview with a Cambridge professor on the topic which makes for interesting reading: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/joris-luyendijk-banking-blog/2012/mar/16/voices-of-finance-oxbridge-professor-economics

Anyway I suspect that admissions people's main concern is how well people will do on the course, and commitment comes second. I realise this is quite a cynical view and one that could well be wrong (for one thing commitment and enthusiasm for economics will factor into performance). I've certainly got the vibe that once you get here, they are quite laissez-faire about your career options and are almost solely concerned with your performance on the tripos.

I would broadly agree with this. Of course commitment and enthusiasm are probably beneficial ceteris paribus, but they are compliments rather than substitutes for raw ability.
Original post by Ray_Han
My two cents:

This is an interview with a Cambridge professor on the topic which makes for interesting reading: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/joris-luyendijk-banking-blog/2012/mar/16/voices-of-finance-oxbridge-professor-economics

Anyway I suspect that admissions people's main concern is how well people will do on the course, and commitment comes second. I realise this is quite a cynical view and one that could well be wrong (for one thing commitment and enthusiasm for economics will factor into performance). I've certainly got the vibe that once you get here, they are quite laissez-faire about your career options and are almost solely concerned with your performance on the tripos.


"We will ask students, why economics? The English-born Asian and Chinese ones appear pretty programmed. They don't admit directly to wanting to go into finance. They will tell me that they won't mind being a teacher, 'give something back', work against world poverty The truth is that their parents will throw them out of the window if they do that. They are expected to make it in the City and increase their parents' status in the community. Many hopes are pinned on them and they know that."




Quite a sweeping statement from a Cambridge professor!

although admittedly true in many cases
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by alex_hk90
I would broadly agree with this. Of course commitment and enthusiasm are probably beneficial ceteris paribus, but they are compliments rather than substitutes for raw ability.


Spoken like a true economist :tongue:.
Reply 1232
Original post by Ray_Han
My two cents:

This is an interview with a Cambridge professor on the topic which makes for interesting reading: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/joris-luyendijk-banking-blog/2012/mar/16/voices-of-finance-oxbridge-professor-economics



Depressing stuff...
Reply 1233
Original post by alex_hk90
I would broadly agree with this. Of course commitment and enthusiasm are probably beneficial ceteris paribus, but they are compliments rather than substitutes for raw ability.


Original post by Ray_Han
My two cents:

This is an interview with a Cambridge professor on the topic which makes for interesting reading: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/joris-luyendijk-banking-blog/2012/mar/16/voices-of-finance-oxbridge-professor-economics

Anyway I suspect that admissions people's main concern is how well people will do on the course, and commitment comes second. I realise this is quite a cynical view and one that could well be wrong (for one thing commitment and enthusiasm for economics will factor into performance). I've certainly got the vibe that once you get here, they are quite laissez-faire about your career options and are almost solely concerned with your performance on the tripos.


I think it's mainly the performance thing rather than anything else (though I'm attempting to read the mind of my director of studies here, and it's been a few years since I got my psychic's licence renewed...) - there's probably a small marginal effect where you're a better person to teach if you care about the subject than if you're just doing it to get your 2.1/2.2, your graduate scheme, and then your gold-plated yacht. This is presumably why people switch to land economy/management/PPS after getting their offers - and fair play to them, because I'd do exactly the same in their position.

Probably a bigger effect - and I apologise for dashing the hopes and dreams of any future Cambridge applicants, please still apply - is that a Cambridge degree is really ****ing difficult. It's not clear that you can make it through three/four/six years without having some kind of interest in the subject itself, especially if you're only in it for the cash. I suspect they're already very good at screening these people out and the ones who get through are actually pretty motivated with the subject but are also chasing the money. I don't know that this would be any worse than somebody "pure" in that regard - in fact it's probably better if you've got something significant to shoot for at the end of the degree...

I'd like to do some reporting on why exactly people go into banking at some point soon, but for now this is entirely befuddled conjecture. Sorry about that.
Original post by lp386
Probably a bigger effect - and I apologise for dashing the hopes and dreams of any future Cambridge applicants, please still apply - is that a Cambridge degree is really ****ing difficult. It's not clear that you can make it through three/four/six years without having some kind of interest in the subject itself, especially if you're only in it for the cash. I suspect they're already very good at screening these people out and the ones who get through are actually pretty motivated with the subject but are also chasing the money. I don't know that this would be any worse than somebody "pure" in that regard - in fact it's probably better if you've got something significant to shoot for at the end of the degree...

Although the Economics Tripos is difficult, I don't think it is really that difficult - for instance, when I compared the pure Maths we did in the 2nd year option to Mathmos' 1st year linear algebra and calculus the stuff they were doing was on a different level. Of course they didn't do so much of the stats but conceptually that isn't too bad (just too much stuff to remember).

Original post by lp386
I'd like to do some reporting on why exactly people go into banking at some point soon, but for now this is entirely befuddled conjecture. Sorry about that.

Isn't it pretty obvious that people go into it for the money? I was tempted just for that but have so far managed to avoid it. :h:
Reply 1235
Original post by alex_hk90
Although the Economics Tripos is difficult, I don't think it is really that difficult - for instance, when I compared the pure Maths we did in the 2nd year option to Mathmos' 1st year linear algebra and calculus the stuff they were doing was on a different level. Of course they didn't do so much of the stats but conceptually that isn't too bad (just too much stuff to remember).


Isn't it pretty obvious that people go into it for the money? I was tempted just for that but have so far managed to avoid it. :h:


Sorry, I should have been clearer - I meant that it was very hard work. Three years of the academic equivalent of hard labour (maybe not for you so much as others) which requires a heck of a lot of motivation to get through. If they think it's a quick and easy way to having money thrown at them, they may be disappointed.

As for whether it's just the money - I've seen some suggestions otherwise (the ease of application, the number of jobs and the opportunity to be around other smart people) but all of these presume that people aren't intending to go into the industry when they arrive at university. That clearly isn't the case with the Cambridge econ course, so I don't know to what extent that would hold.
Original post by lp386
Sorry, I should have been clearer - I meant that it was very hard work. Three years of the academic equivalent of hard labour (maybe not for you so much as others) which requires a heck of a lot of motivation to get through. If they think it's a quick and easy way to having money thrown at them, they may be disappointed.

I agree with the last sentence, and should also clarify. The work is not easy, it requires you to have a wide variety of skills: conceptual understanding, processing of large amounts of information, rote learning of facts, etc. But my point was that it is not the hardest in any individual one of these skills - there are subjects which are more conceptually difficult, require more reading, and have more things to remember. What is likely to be true though is that there isn't a subject that is more difficult in all of these things together, and maybe not even in more than one of them.

That probably wasn't best explained so as an illustrative example, if the above-mentioned 3 are the measures of difficulty, then if Economics rates as 8-8-8, then there are subjects that could be 10-5-5 / 5-10-5 / 5-5-10, but no subjects would be 9-9-8 or similar.

Original post by lp386
As for whether it's just the money - I've seen some suggestions otherwise (the ease of application, the number of jobs and the opportunity to be around other smart people) but all of these presume that people aren't intending to go into the industry when they arrive at university. That clearly isn't the case with the Cambridge econ course, so I don't know to what extent that would hold.

I guess being around other 'smart' people might be an incentive, though how 'smart' bankers really are (apart from in maximising their own personal profit) is rather questionable.
Reply 1237
Original post by Groat
I remember the question: why do you want to read a degree in Economics?

It seems an age ago now, but I can still remember going off on the route of saying how I'd had personal success at school and enjoyed the applications of mathematics in the subject!


Just to add to the discussion: my interview last December seemed to be a pure assessment of my academic ability -- there were no questions at all about why I'd applied or even why I was interested in the subject, though I suppose that the latter could be gleaned through the discussions we had.
I think there is some merit in looking for candidates who are interested in economics as an academic discipline, but it's also easy to underestimate the ability of those 'in it for the money', as it were, to power through the degree regardless of how much they dislike the work.
I find it interesting that there are instances of people that aren't really interested in Economics actually getting in.
Original post by Pensive
Just to add to the discussion: my interview last December seemed to be a pure assessment of my academic ability -- there were no questions at all about why I'd applied or even why I was interested in the subject, though I suppose that the latter could be gleaned through the discussions we had.
I think there is some merit in looking for candidates who are interested in economics as an academic discipline, but it's also easy to underestimate the ability of those 'in it for the money', as it were, to power through the degree regardless of how much they dislike the work.

Init mine was really impersonal, they just banged through questions intensely. It actually struck me that they didn't want to get to know me, but remain objective and try to guage ability rather than anything less easily observable like interest.

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