Are you "in" or "out" or "unsure"
Poll
What will your choice be?
Seeing as one side seems to be more vocal (the leave side from what I see, but some say the remain side) I thought a poll might work better rather than having to trawl through lots of arguments and shouting.
You simply can't just reply "I want to leave" or "remain" by the way. Please select one of the options.
If you want to debate also I personally would like to see facts, figures and statistics and qualitative research from credible sources on this thread also instead of just quotes from politicians and links to news websites because personally I think those two have had enough say in the matter.
You simply can't just reply "I want to leave" or "remain" by the way. Please select one of the options.
If you want to debate also I personally would like to see facts, figures and statistics and qualitative research from credible sources on this thread also instead of just quotes from politicians and links to news websites because personally I think those two have had enough say in the matter.
(edited 7 years ago)
Scroll to see replies
dont really care tbh :/
I'm unsure about most aspects of my life but I'm voting to remain
Voting out for independence day.
Still unsure.
Voting to stay in for the following reasons:
1) I live in Northern Ireland and don't want the hassle of border controls when I want to go to the south.
2) A town near me gets loads of shoppers from the South, that will likely reduce if border controls are imposed, leading to job losses and more empty buildings.
3) I don't believe the posters that say the money currently spent on EU membership will go to the NHS. I imagine most of it will be kept in the South of England and the rest of UK will bear the brunt of the loss of EU funding.
4) The EU has a far better track record regarding human rights than Westminster does.
5) I disagree with imposing greater border controls. I think skilled immigration is needed in a society where most people either can't afford to pay tax or hoard their money offshore to get out of paying their share. It's also needed for employers who complain about skill shortages but prefer not to train staff themselves.
6) I live in a town that already suffers from lack of investment. I think that will only get worse if more big companies decide to locate on the other side of the Irish border.
7) EDIT: The young generation has already been screwed over with compulsory education to 18, increased tuition fees, high house prices and low wages so we really don't need the extra uncertainty leaving the EU will bring.
8) I'm planning to go to Australia in September and want the exchange rate to go in my favour.
9) My boyfriend has a British passport which may make planning holidays in the EU a bit more difficult.
1) I live in Northern Ireland and don't want the hassle of border controls when I want to go to the south.
2) A town near me gets loads of shoppers from the South, that will likely reduce if border controls are imposed, leading to job losses and more empty buildings.
3) I don't believe the posters that say the money currently spent on EU membership will go to the NHS. I imagine most of it will be kept in the South of England and the rest of UK will bear the brunt of the loss of EU funding.
4) The EU has a far better track record regarding human rights than Westminster does.
5) I disagree with imposing greater border controls. I think skilled immigration is needed in a society where most people either can't afford to pay tax or hoard their money offshore to get out of paying their share. It's also needed for employers who complain about skill shortages but prefer not to train staff themselves.
6) I live in a town that already suffers from lack of investment. I think that will only get worse if more big companies decide to locate on the other side of the Irish border.
7) EDIT: The young generation has already been screwed over with compulsory education to 18, increased tuition fees, high house prices and low wages so we really don't need the extra uncertainty leaving the EU will bring.
8) I'm planning to go to Australia in September and want the exchange rate to go in my favour.
9) My boyfriend has a British passport which may make planning holidays in the EU a bit more difficult.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Blondie987
I'm unsure about most aspects of my life but I'm voting to remain
Well this is reassuring from the remainer party...(sarcasm).
Anyway I'm sure as hell voting out.
Out, for the simple reason that it's what my heart and life experiences are telling me is the right choice.
If you want a better Britain for British people, then there's only one choice you can make.
Brexit
Posted from TSR Mobile
Brexit
Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by DarkMagic
9) My boyfriend has a British passport which may make planning holidays in the EU a bit more difficult.
9) My boyfriend has a British passport which may make planning holidays in the EU a bit more difficult.
No it won't
Voting out because I'm concerned about how much the EU has changed since we joined in the 70s and I think we should reassert some of our former independence.
Screw the anti-immigration rhetoric, that doesn't matter to me other than I want a fair and meritocratic system which isn't biased in favour of any one group of people.
Screw the anti-immigration rhetoric, that doesn't matter to me other than I want a fair and meritocratic system which isn't biased in favour of any one group of people.
Original post by AnnieGakusei
Voting out because I'm concerned about how much the EU has changed since we joined in the 70s and I think we should reassert some of our former independence.
Screw the anti-immigration rhetoric, that doesn't matter to me other than I want a fair and meritocratic system which isn't biased in favour of any one group of people.
Screw the anti-immigration rhetoric, that doesn't matter to me other than I want a fair and meritocratic system which isn't biased in favour of any one group of people.
Congratulations.
I do not know how old you are, but I believe young people in general fail to see the bigger picture.
The reason why the older generations are mainly voting out is because they've seen the EU's depletion, whilst most people my age haven't.
Dear anyone who's unsure/Brexit:
1. immigration. In the last decade EU migrants paid in £20 billion more in tax than was spent on them on services. £20 billion. Migrants from outside the EU paid in £2 billion more than they took out in services. The British people? Had £600 billion more spent on them than they paid in taxes. Spending more than we have in tax is entirely on UK citizens; we'd be £20 billion more in debt right now without EU migrants.
2. Healthcare. As someone who was treated on holiday in hospital, please don't underestimate the value of free healthcare when you are scared and hurt and don't speak the language. EHIC is hugely important, and we'd have to take out extra holiday insurance if we didn't have it. Which is expensive.
3. Jobs. EU means free trade. It would take two years to leave, and then c.7 years to negotiate a trade deal (that's what it currently takes). So for 9 years at least we'd be without secure free trade. We don't trade as much? Firms struggle. Firms Struggle? Unemployment rises, and both individuals and firms pay less tax. Less tax? Less money for the NHS.
4. Cost. £350 million a week is a lie. The 'rebate', the amount that the UK has 'deducted' from what it pays, is never paid in the first place, the initial cost is revised down. Then the EU invests directly in the UK. Money straight back here. Lowering the expenditure to about £190 million. Which is a lot. But the value of trade far outweighs it. We wouldn't have an extra 190 million a week for the NHS because tax revenue would fall and welfare costs rise with unemployment.
5 Free movement. UK isn't part of Schengen. We DO have borders, we DO check who enters (with the power to stop criminals). Thanks to the EU's European Arrest Warrant, we can deport criminals or get them back for trial in the UK (E.G. After 7/7). With the recent reforms stopping benefits for 4 years for immigrants (incl. EU), this means that the few who would've come here not to work have no reason to, as they'd be unable to support themselves and would have to leave.
6. Cooperation. The EU will affect us, in or out. In Norway, to access trade they're in the common market, which means they have to accept free movement and 75% of EU law. But they're not in the EU, so they can't vote on those laws. We may have to follow EU law, even if we couldn't vote on it. Which is foolish. We need international efforts on terrorism, on development and on the environment. We need to be sat around that table, making the decisions our world needs to deal with its issues.
7. Both campaigns have been negative and have involved scaremongering. We would survive outside the EU, but we would be worse off. Voting out because the EU isn't wholly democratic is myopic; we can only change the EU from the inside, we've made our point with the referendum, and we do have a say. To give up the votes we do have, only to face the results of the subsequent votes is dangerous. EU succession and expansion is paused until at least 2020. And Turkey won't be joining for decades after, because it's taken them 10 years to meet the 1st of 36 criteria. EU membership is Erdogan's reason to end human rights abuses, and we owe it to the oppressed Turkish people to try to promote development and democracy. UKIP's migrants poster is too close to Nazism. We don't need to fear immigration; I salute the thousands of EU migrants, working inside the NHS, doing the agricultural labouring that few Britons would bother with. We need a voice, we need free trade, we need cooperation and the best thing to do is to stay within the group that impacts the world, retaining both the power to influence the EU and the benefits of it. <3
1. immigration. In the last decade EU migrants paid in £20 billion more in tax than was spent on them on services. £20 billion. Migrants from outside the EU paid in £2 billion more than they took out in services. The British people? Had £600 billion more spent on them than they paid in taxes. Spending more than we have in tax is entirely on UK citizens; we'd be £20 billion more in debt right now without EU migrants.
2. Healthcare. As someone who was treated on holiday in hospital, please don't underestimate the value of free healthcare when you are scared and hurt and don't speak the language. EHIC is hugely important, and we'd have to take out extra holiday insurance if we didn't have it. Which is expensive.
3. Jobs. EU means free trade. It would take two years to leave, and then c.7 years to negotiate a trade deal (that's what it currently takes). So for 9 years at least we'd be without secure free trade. We don't trade as much? Firms struggle. Firms Struggle? Unemployment rises, and both individuals and firms pay less tax. Less tax? Less money for the NHS.
4. Cost. £350 million a week is a lie. The 'rebate', the amount that the UK has 'deducted' from what it pays, is never paid in the first place, the initial cost is revised down. Then the EU invests directly in the UK. Money straight back here. Lowering the expenditure to about £190 million. Which is a lot. But the value of trade far outweighs it. We wouldn't have an extra 190 million a week for the NHS because tax revenue would fall and welfare costs rise with unemployment.
5 Free movement. UK isn't part of Schengen. We DO have borders, we DO check who enters (with the power to stop criminals). Thanks to the EU's European Arrest Warrant, we can deport criminals or get them back for trial in the UK (E.G. After 7/7). With the recent reforms stopping benefits for 4 years for immigrants (incl. EU), this means that the few who would've come here not to work have no reason to, as they'd be unable to support themselves and would have to leave.
6. Cooperation. The EU will affect us, in or out. In Norway, to access trade they're in the common market, which means they have to accept free movement and 75% of EU law. But they're not in the EU, so they can't vote on those laws. We may have to follow EU law, even if we couldn't vote on it. Which is foolish. We need international efforts on terrorism, on development and on the environment. We need to be sat around that table, making the decisions our world needs to deal with its issues.
7. Both campaigns have been negative and have involved scaremongering. We would survive outside the EU, but we would be worse off. Voting out because the EU isn't wholly democratic is myopic; we can only change the EU from the inside, we've made our point with the referendum, and we do have a say. To give up the votes we do have, only to face the results of the subsequent votes is dangerous. EU succession and expansion is paused until at least 2020. And Turkey won't be joining for decades after, because it's taken them 10 years to meet the 1st of 36 criteria. EU membership is Erdogan's reason to end human rights abuses, and we owe it to the oppressed Turkish people to try to promote development and democracy. UKIP's migrants poster is too close to Nazism. We don't need to fear immigration; I salute the thousands of EU migrants, working inside the NHS, doing the agricultural labouring that few Britons would bother with. We need a voice, we need free trade, we need cooperation and the best thing to do is to stay within the group that impacts the world, retaining both the power to influence the EU and the benefits of it. <3
Original post by DarkMagic
Voting to stay in for the following reasons:
1) I live in Northern Ireland and don't want the hassle of border controls when I want to go to the south.
2) A town near me gets loads of shoppers from the South, that will likely reduce if border controls are imposed, leading to job losses and more empty buildings.
1) I live in Northern Ireland and don't want the hassle of border controls when I want to go to the south.
2) A town near me gets loads of shoppers from the South, that will likely reduce if border controls are imposed, leading to job losses and more empty buildings.
There won't be border controls. Agreements guaranteeing free movement between the Republic of Ireland and the UK have existed since long before the EU was concieved, Britain leaving the EU will have no effect on this.
Original post by Wōden
There won't be border controls. Agreements guaranteeing free movement between the Republic of Ireland and the UK have existed since long before the EU was concieved, Britain leaving the EU will have no effect on this.
Do you really believe that? How do you propose keeping immigrants out of the U.K. if all they need to do is come over to Ireland and get in that way? It makes no sense to vote for greater controls over immigration if no steps are taken to control the only land border there will be between the UK and the EU.
Original post by DarkMagic
Do you really believe that? How do you propose keeping immigrants out of the U.K. if all they need to do is come over to Ireland and get in that way? It makes no sense to vote for greater controls over immigration if no steps are taken to control the only land border there will be between the UK and the EU.
I don't think you've properly read what Woden said:
"Agreements guaranteeing free movement between the Republic of Ireland and the UK have existed since long before the EU was conceived"
If you live in NI and want to cross over to EIRE, you won't have any problems.
The UK isn't seeking to close itself off from Europe as a whole, it's removing itself from the Union and taking back complete control of its laws and interests.
Remainers are blowing this all out of proportion.
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