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Medicine for a deaf person

Hi

I have a BSc Psychology, MSc Psychology and MSc clinical neuroscience degrees. I am currently working as a healthcare assistant at one of the NHS trust. I have always wanted to study medicine but felt that my people would discriminate me against it because of my deafness. After studying a Masters in neuroscience and working as a healthcare assistant in a ward for 3 years, my passion to study medicine has become more stronger, and I feel frustrated that I can't even fulfill my dream and career goal because of my deafness. I can talk fine and people do understand me, the only downside is telephone conversations which I find difficult to grasp as I rely on lip-reading.

anyway I have started preparing for a GAMSAT exam and going to go for it, but the fear of discrimination is still there. I can't help but feel that all medical school will reject me because of my deafness, I want to know all your opinions on this?

Looking forward to reading all your feedbacks!

Take care :smile::smile::smile:

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Original post by Fizzah
Hi


I have a BSc Psychology, MSc Psychology and MSc clinical neuroscience degrees. I am currently working as a healthcare assistant at one of the NHS trust. I have always wanted to study medicine but felt that my people would discriminate me against it because of my deafness. After studying a Masters in neuroscience and working as a healthcare assistant in a ward for 3 years, my passion to study medicine has become more stronger, and I feel frustrated that I can't even fulfill my dream and career goal because of my deafness. I can talk fine and people do understand me, the only downside is telephone conversations which I find difficult to grasp as I rely on lip-reading.


anyway I have started preparing for a GAMSAT exam and going to go for it, but the fear of discrimination is still there. I can't help but feel that all medical school will reject me because of my deafness, I want to know all your opinions on this?


Looking forward to reading all your feedbacks!


Take care :smile::smile::smile:


Hi there :smile:

Are you clinically deaf or hard hearing? If so, Medical schools do not and are prohibited to discriminate applicants with a disability such as deafness according to the GMC (General Medical Council) Gateways guidance:

Universities, medical schools, postgraduate deaneries and employers have four fundamental duties in relation to disabled people.


1.

1. The duty to avoid types of unlawful discrimination against people with disabilities including:

2.

direct discrimination

3.

indirect discrimination

4.

discrimination arising from disability

5.

failure to make reasonable adjustments (including the anticipatory duty)

6.

victimisation

7.

harassment


8.

Direct discrimination for disability is when a person treats another less favourably because of their disability.

9.

Indirect discrimination occurs where certain provisions, criteria or practices imposed by an employer or education provider have an adverse impact disproportionately on one group or other.4

10.

Discrimination arising from a disability is where a disabled person has been treated unfavourably because of something arising as a consequence of their disability.




Link: http://www.gmc-uk.org/education/undergraduate/4_1_disability_discrimination.asp

I wouldn't worry about this if I was in your position.

Good luck with your application (and your GAMSAT exam :smile:).
Reply 2
oh wow! That is great! Not sure if I'm clinically deaf. I'm not hard of hearing as I can't hear without hearing aids although a lot of people have often assumed that I am partially deaf. I am currently profoundly deaf as my doctor said, although sometimes I don't think I am!

Sigh... The only thing I regretted is wasting my years, i wanted to do medicine straight after I graduated from my neuroscience degree but my self esteem was so low at that time, after working as healthcare assistant for three long years on a medical ward and working with a lot of patients, I believe I can do this and want to pursue this now more than ever! The only thing I am dreading is phone conversations and I am hoping there must be some sort of adjustments, maybe SMS? Argh, I really wish I can hear through phone :frown: I can hear people talking but can't figure out what they are saying on phone, apart from stuff like 'hello' etc..

also, is it possible to do two UCAS applications, one for graduate entry medicine and other for foundation years medicine?
Reply 3
Original post by Fizzah
oh wow! That is great! Not sure if I'm clinically deaf. I'm not hard of hearing as I can't hear without hearing aids although a lot of people have often assumed that I am partially deaf. I am currently profoundly deaf as my doctor said, although sometimes I don't think I am!

Sigh... The only thing I regretted is wasting my years, i wanted to do medicine straight after I graduated from my neuroscience degree but my self esteem was so low at that time, after working as healthcare assistant for three long years on a medical ward and working with a lot of patients, I believe I can do this and want to pursue this now more than ever! The only thing I am dreading is phone conversations and I am hoping there must be some sort of adjustments, maybe SMS? Argh, I really wish I can hear through phone :frown: I can hear people talking but can't figure out what they are saying on phone, apart from stuff like 'hello' etc..

also, is it possible to do two UCAS applications, one for graduate entry medicine and other for foundation years medicine?



You only have the 4 ucas choices for medicine, but you can do a mix of 4 and 5 year courses if you want. You're massively overqualified for the 6 year foundation medicine though. If you can do well in gamsat and/or ukcat I would think you would stand a good shot at the 4 yr GEM
Reply 4
Thank you :smile:

I know, I thought it will be easier to get into the foundation course, I've heard a lot about the graduate course and how highly competitive it is! Scary! So instead of wasting time, for example if I don't get into the graduate entry course, I might get into the foundation one, which is one year, so I'll be learning either way! Obviously it's more expensive this way...
Reply 5
Original post by Amyk89
You only have the 4 ucas choices for medicine, but you can do a mix of 4 and 5 year courses if you want. You're massively overqualified for the 6 year foundation medicine though. If you can do well in gamsat and/or ukcat I would think you would stand a good shot at the 4 yr GEM



Oh that's how you do it... Sorry! I'm new to this student room! I'm liking this website, it's nice to share
Reply 6
Original post by Fizzah
Thank you :smile:

I know, I thought it will be easier to get into the foundation course, I've heard a lot about the graduate course and how highly competitive it is! Scary! So instead of wasting time, for example if I don't get into the graduate entry course, I might get into the foundation one, which is one year, so I'll be learning either way! Obviously it's more expensive this way...



Like I said with your qualifications (as long as your bsc wasn't a 2.2) you should stand a very good shot at GEM. The foundation courses are competitive themselves and are aimed at people without a science background or with slightly lower grades.
Reply 7
Not being able to talk on the phone might be a little bit difficult :/ It is the current mainstay of hospital communication - how else to answer bleeps etc.? Maybe it would be worth approaching the hospital you're currently a healthcare assistant at and just asking what sorts of adaptations they know of & what could be put in place etc.

Absolutely I don't think you should be discriminated against because of your deafness, but I do know of people who have made it all the way through medical school with a disability and basically found themselves qualified but unable to advance. If there's something that prevents you from doing the job properly and acquiring competencies etc. then it might limit your future options. For instance somebody with essential tremor getting all the way through and then being unable to pass the practical competency of taking blood and suddenly basically facing a choice which includes none of the specialties they were interested in. This does and has happened to people, and whilst medical schools cannot discriminate at the end of the day if you can't meet job requirements you can end up at the world's most frustrating dead end that nobody ever told you about until you found yourself holed up there. There may be no actual limitation re: phone deafness and these core tasks (I have no idea) in which case there's nothing to worry about, but it might be worth doing some digging.

Good luck!
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 8
Original post by seaholme
Not being able to talk on the phone might be a little bit difficult :/ It is the current mainstay of hospital communication - how else to answer bleeps etc.? Maybe it would be worth approaching the hospital you're currently a healthcare assistant at and just asking what sorts of adaptations they know of & what could be put in place etc.

Absolutely I don't think you should be discriminated against because of your deafness, but I do know of people who have made it all the way through medical school with a disability and basically found themselves qualified but unable to advance. If there's something that prevents you from doing the job properly and acquiring competencies etc. then it might limit your future options. For instance somebody with essential tremor getting all the way through and then being unable to pass the practical competency of taking blood and suddenly basically facing a choice which includes none of the specialties they were interested in. This does and has happened to people, and whilst medical schools cannot discriminate at the end of the day if you can't meet job requirements you can end up at the world's most frustrating dead end that nobody ever told you about until you found yourself holed up there. There may be no actual limitation re: phone deafness and these core tasks (I have no idea) in which case there's nothing to worry about, but it might be worth doing some digging.

Good luck!



That's what I was worried about! The bleeps, I've often relied on my work colleagues to make a phone call for me while I'm on my ward. They are very nice and friendly, but I do worry about being put in an emergency situation where I have to make a phone call, which I can do, I can call and say there's an emergency and tell them to come over ASAP, if the person on the other end say ok, I'm saved, if that person carries on talking, I might be in trouble!

I'm hoping to go into neurology speciality as I have a MSc in clinical neuroscience and I loved studying it, want to become a neurologist, and my long term career goal is research in neurology. I am sure I will be okay with this, I'm just a little worries about the foundation years training where I know I will have to deal with phone calls etc... Ahhh I wish life is as easy as you people have it... Be grateful that u r not in my situation :frown:
Reply 9
Contact the admissions teams of the Universities you are applying to and ask for clarification that it is not a barrier. There are deaf doctors out there, and I don't imagine they are allowed to discriminate, plus you have the advantage of empathising with deaf patients :smile: Good Luck!
Reply 10
Original post by inversus
Contact the admissions teams of the Universities you are applying to and ask for clarification that it is not a barrier. There are deaf doctors out there, and I don't imagine they are allowed to discriminate, plus you have the advantage of empathising with deaf patients :smile: Good Luck!


Of course they aren't. It would be illegal (Equality Act 2010, previously Disability Discrimination Act 1995)
Original post by River85
Of course they aren't. It would be illegal (Equality Act 2010, previously Disability Discrimination Act 1995)


But you might say that it's essential to be able to reliably understand spoken instructions on the ward. Still, I'm certain it can be done OP
Why was my post deleted? -_-
Reply 13
Original post by scrotgrot
But you might say that it's essential to be able to reliably understand spoken instructions on the ward. Still, I'm certain it can be done OP


If rejection can be objectively justified it wouldn't be discrimination, would it?

Besides, even if unable to lip read there is something called sign language. To me it would seem a reasonable adjustment to allow a deaf person to have access to a sign language interpreter when on the wards.
Original post by River85
If rejection can be objectively justified it wouldn't be discrimination, would it?

Besides, even if unable to lip read there is something called sign language. To me it would seem a reasonable adjustment to allow a deaf person to have access to a sign language interpreter when on the wards.


Definitely a question to the universities there :smile: Most of us here would only be able to speculate. Of course they cannot discriminate against you, but I would imagine they are many obstacles (which they would discuss and always try to overcome). There are some deaf doctors so by no means is it impossible.

Good luck though :smile:
Reply 15
Original post by Lionheartat20
Definitely a question to the universities there :smile: Most of us here would only be able to speculate


It's not speculation. It's the truth. Universities cannot discriminate and are legally obliged to make reasonable adjustments. As you admit yourself, there are deaf doctors. As the OP is hearing impaired, and can listen with hearing aids (I think), there shouldn't be a reason why she or he can't do medicine. At least when it comes to deafness.
Reply 16
I know a couple of doctors with significant hearing impairment. They all use hearing aids + lip-reading rather than signing; I'm not sure if NHS trusts would consider a permanent sign interpreter as a reasonable adjustment! I don't know what sort of involvement they have had from occupational health at various points in the course/career afterwards, but I think it's more than average.

Other things that I have heard them report as being more difficult are working in theatres, because most people are wearing masks (though one has become an anaesthetist so has obviously found a way of coping!), and working in very busy environments like A&E because there's so much distracting background noise.
Original post by River85
It's not speculation. It's the truth. Universities cannot discriminate and are legally obliged to make reasonable adjustments. As you admit yourself, there are deaf doctors. As the OP is hearing impaired, and can listen with hearing aids (I think), there shouldn't be a reason why she or he can't do medicine. At least when it comes to deafness.


I read it originally as they cannot hear whatsoever even with hearing aids - only lip reading. Admittedly with hearing aids it would be more straight forward.

Whilst they cannot discriminate, potentially a sign interpreter would be needed for a large period of time throughout the persons career (depending on hearing impairment). All depends on whether it is a reasonable adjustment - and therefore we are only speculating.

However we all agree there are deaf doctors but I do think it's certainly worth discussing with an individual university.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 18
Thank you so so much for all these replies! You guys are giving me the drive to succeed! :biggrin: :biggrin: I got 2:1 in my BSc Psychology, a Merit in MSc Psychology and a Pass in MSc Clinical Neuroscience (I could have achieved higher in this one but due to a very unexpected death in my immediate family, I could not concentrate properly/fully and when I did, I ended up with a Pass). I actually wanted to be a doctor since I was in high school but teachers often told me that 'it was impossible for someone like me' or 'What if they can't understand you?'. But I've never come across anyone not understanding me at my current workplace as a healthcare assistant, and if they don't, I kindly repeat and they do understand. I have to admit I have a habit of talking fast!

To my excitement, I have found a stethoscope aimed for deaf doctor/nurses, known as an amplified stethoscope and this made me so happy! To be honest, I think everything will be heavily technology based in the future, so I am pretty sure I will be alright. Just need to talk to individual university and ask about foundation year training programmes where I will be on call and how I can manage with on call in my situation. Perhaps I can ask for everyone's mobile numbers and send them an SMS! I WISH! :smile:
Reply 19
Original post by Acylation23
Why was my post deleted? -_-



Your post was not deleted....I think it's in the other forum with the same title...I accidentally created two forums with same title....Sorry! I'm very new to this! I should have come across this site sooner, I love this studentroom, it's pretty cool to be able to share whatever concerns you have with everyone else! :biggrin:

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