Gerry Adams arrested! Breaking News!

If they started off using violence? Yes. But if they were peaceful and protested etc, no. I don't escalate things on a personal level or when talking about politics. It would be proportional, so if they started using batons against us, the maximum limit we should use it batons against them. If they start killing our citizens, we return the favour with killing IRA members.

From my understanding during the Easter rising, they shipped in arms and ammo. So it was right we did the same. Personally, I would of invited them to take part in elections to see what the people of Ireland wanted, and not enforce a form of martial law. That way they had the choice of peaceful or military means. They would choose, and we would be in the right either way.

If they started off using violence? Yes. But if they were peaceful and protested etc, no. I don't escalate things on a personal level or when talking about politics. It would be proportional, so if they started using batons against us, the maximum limit we should use it batons against them. If they start killing our citizens, we return the favour with killing IRA members.

From my understanding during the Easter rising, they shipped in arms and ammo. So it was right we did the same. Personally, I would of invited them to take part in elections to see what the people of Ireland wanted, and not enforce a form of martial law. That way they had the choice of peaceful or military means. They would choose, and we would be in the right either way.

They did take part in elections; Ireland had been sending large majorities of pro-devolution MPs to Westminster since the 1870s, and got nothing. In 1918 Ireland elected a large majority of pro-independence MPs, who subsequently declared an independence that the British refused to recognise.

You do know the Stormont government also actively supported the UVF shipping in weapons but attempted to shutdown IRA attempts? Just a thought.

It was a reaction to the IRA. Completely legitimate.

The same UVF, who, under their leader Spence said

"At the time, the attitude was that if you couldn't get an IRA man you should shoot a Taig, he's your last resort"

I wasn't talking about elections at Westminster, I was talking about an election for just the Irish over devolution and Independence, with the north probably voting to stay. I would of had it (the south) become Independent much earlier. It would be county elections, with each county voting whether to **** off or stay.

Whether or not this would have been a good idea, it isn't what happened.

I thought you were asking me on what we should of done?

I asked how we should have reacted to the original IRA when they first appeared in the 1910s and 1920s, not what we should have done to avoid the rise of the IRA in the first place. Yes, it would have been better if we'd dealt with the problem before it reached that point, but the fact remains that it did reach that point.

To phrase it another way, were the original IRA justified in taking up arms against Britain given the fact that conventional democratic means had yielded nothing?

It was a reaction to the IRA. Completely legitimate.

So fighting terrorism by means of terrorism is legitimate?

In short no. Democracy had not been given a chance. If they decided, which they did, to use violence, I fully expect us to return in kind.

Mass peaceful protests/ Boycotts/ March on Westminster, yes. Violence, no.

So they should have just sat and waited while the British continued to ignore them?

I'm pretty sure I just added things what they could of done instead.

It's not terrorism since it would be official and authorized by Westminster. Do you mean fighting a war? Yes, I'd say so.

the Good Friday Agreement essentially involved an amnesty for crimes that were committed under the banner of Republican or Loyalist militant groups.

Yes, and when the British would have inevitably ignored them, what then?



Stormont, not Westminster.

So any state-sanctioned violence is perfectly legitimate in your eyes, whereas any non-state violence is not, regardless of the methods of violence or what the respective sides stand for?

The original IRA were authorised by the Irish Dail, did that make them 'official'? If the Provisional IRA had been authorised by Dublin, would that have made them 'official'?

Yeah, I thought we were pretty much OK with all that now.

I think a great many of us assume automatically that Gerry Adams, Martin McGuinness and all that were, on some level, involved in murder. But I suppose the point of a peace process is that we substitute justice for peace.

Precisely. I'm no fan of Peter Hain, but he was essentially right that if you want peace, to some degree you must accept that there will be no justice for many. Peace is its own form of justice.

That's why you won't see prosecutions of soldiers involved in Bloody Sunday, or Loyalists involved killings, and Republicans involved in bombings. This was why you saw absolutely repulsive criminals like Michael Stone (who attacked a funeral with grenades, killing three and injuring sixty) released after only 13 years in prison.