Requirements for Psychology Conversion Courses?

1. Could anybody who has completed the Psychology Conversion course confirm what were the requirements for the course and would a 2.1 LLB degree and Commendation at LLM satisfy those requirements. I am concerned because I did my GCSEs and A levels equivalent in India and the grades are not good enough.
2. Is changing careers at 22 from Law to Psychology a risk worth taking ?
3. How many years will it be after starting the conversion course (full-time) to become a Psychotherapist or Psychologist?
Many thanks in advance.

Reply 1

_Sinnie_

15

Original post by usernameskillful

1. Could anybody who has completed the Psychology Conversion course confirm what were the requirements for the course and would a 2.1 LLB degree and Commendation at LLM satisfy those requirements. I am concerned because I did my GCSEs and A levels equivalent in India and the grades are not good enough.
2. Is changing careers at 22 from Law to Psychology a risk worth taking ?
3. How many years will it be after starting the conversion course (full-time) to become a Psychotherapist or Psychologist?
Many thanks in advance.

Hi,

I can't comment on the course requirements, you are better off contacting courses directly and asking.

22 is not too old to change to a Psychology degree.

A standard route to qualifying as a Clinical Psychologist is:
- 3 year BSC (1 year conversion)
- 2-3 years relevant work experience (typically as an NHS or private Assistant Psychologist, Psychological Wellbeing Practitioner or other care related work)
- A Master's in increasingly common - so one year.
- People can struggle to get on the ladder regarding relevant work experience, so that can add a year or two.

I'd not plan to be on the Clinical training course before the age of 27, expect to be 28+. It's then 3 year course. I graduated my BSc at 21 and if I get on this year, I'll be 27.

Other Psychology routes will vary, but nearly all require a doctorate and will want that prior experience, so the timeframes will be similar.

I'm not sure about Psychotherapy.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 2

usernameskillful

OP

Original post by _Sinnie_

Hi,

I can't comment on the course requirements, you are better off contacting courses directly and asking.

22 is not too old to change to a Psychology degree.

A standard route to qualifying as a Clinical Psychologist is:
- 3 year BSC (1 year conversion)
- 2-3 years relevant work experience (typically as an NHS or private Assistant Psychologist, Psychological Wellbeing Practitioner or other care related work)
- A Master's in increasingly common - so one year.
- People can struggle to get on the ladder regarding relevant work experience, so that can add a year or two.

I'd not plan to be on the Clinical training course before the age of 27, expect to be 28+. It's then 3 year course. I graduated my BSc at 21 and if I get on this year, I'll be 27.

Other Psychology routes will vary, but nearly all require a doctorate and will want that prior experience, so the timeframes will be similar.

I'm not sure about Psychotherapy.

Thank you for your reply.

Just to clarify, the conversion course (1 year) + Masters (1 year) + Doctorate (3 to 4 years) and finally work experience (2 to 4 years) would be 7-10 years in that order, correct?

Thanks again.

Reply 3

_Sinnie_

15

Original post by usernameskillful

Thank you for your reply.

Just to clarify, the conversion course (1 year) + Masters (1 year) + Doctorate (3 to 4 years) and finally work experience (2 to 4 years) would be 7-10 years in that order, correct?

Thanks again.

You get the relevant experience before the doctorate. The doctorate is different to a standard PhD, it actually grants the qualification (similar to nurse, occupational therapist or social work training). The doctorate is 3 years. So if you're lucky and manage to get on to everything one after the other, you could do it in 6 years (1 year of experience + Masters) which isn't impossible, but it is unlikely.

I'd plan for 9-11 years in total, that way you are fully prepared for all eventualities. Though do plan for the one in which you never get on, which is unfortunately a possibility. Though do bear in mind, it's not a race - the courses take people who are ready to train. It's all about gaining experience, developing as a practioner and being able to reflect on all of this.

Reply 4

usernameskillful

OP

"Though do plan for the one in which you never get on, which is unfortunately a possibility". Could you explain that any further? Is finding work experience generally that difficult ? Finally, from your own experience has a career in Psychology been meaningful and rewarding (not monetarily of course). I ask that because its a one of the main reasons I am moving away from a career in law.

Reply 5

_Sinnie_

15

Original post by usernameskillful

"Though do plan for the one in which you never get on, which is unfortunately a possibility". Could you explain that any further? Is finding work experience generally that difficult ? Finally, from your own experience has a career in Psychology been meaningful and rewarding (not monetarily of course). I ask that because its a one of the main reasons I am moving away from a career in law.

Well I wrote a really long piece giving a nice, honest appraisal of Psychology from my perspective and then my computer ate it. I shall do my best to recreate it.

There are three main types of experience (for Psychology):
- General, irrelevant experience (McDonald’s, bars, leisure centres)
- Care orientated roles (Nursing assistants/support workers, volunteering and similar)
- Psychology (Assistant Psychologists, Research Assistants, Psychological Well-being practitioners and similar)

Getting the care orientated roles is quite easy and will build your experience base for getting the Psychology ones. However there is a massive bottleneck here, consider that there are thousands of Psychology graduates and you'll be competing with those who already have Psychology based roles and are moving jobs. I've known 250 people to apply for one role and at the start, you're the bottom of that pile as many have more knowledge and experience than you.

The next bottleneck is for the Clinical Doctorate, if you choose that route. A typical intake is ~450 applicants, ~45 interviews and ~14 places. They say that if you have the ability to be a Clinical Psychologist then you will get on, but there have been people who applied for 10 years and never managed it. It all depends on where you draw the line in how long to wait – can you justify spending 5 years in a holding pattern for a career you may never have. Of course, in theory, your supervisors should give you some indication on whether they think it is right for you.

Ready for some harder truths?

Is it meaningful? Yes. Though it is likely to be more meaningful to you than it is to people in other professions (just as they see their own profession) and will often be more meaningful to you than how the patient or client sees it. Forget the idea that you're going to learn and be able to 'cure' people (there's no cure for being a human I'm afraid) and forget the idea that you're going to spend some sessions talking with someone and then offer a startling revelation that leaves them bounding out of your office a changed person. Change is 45% motivation to change, 45% from the individual and 10% your guidance. It's a job consisting of small steps, encouraging people to turn up, talk to you, have the courage to recognise they have a problem (how often do you recognise crippling problems with your life or personality, rather than bury that knowledge?), develop insight into that problem, arrive at an effective solution that they are happy with, formulate a plan for instigating the change, keeping the motivation to alter deeply habitual behaviours and replace it with the new and unknown (one of the biggest barriers in all of Psychological practice, we all have our routines for a reason) and then stick to the change. It all depends on your client group, Learning Disability is a career of seeing minuscule change over years for example, as the individuals have such difficulty in understanding their thoughts and feelings. Other areas may have higher levels of motivation and engagement. The plague of ineffective leadership, pointless targets, lack of funding and lack of clinical direction can make a lot of the work I, and others do, pointless. It's a real frustration to see a good plan not implemented or someone to come in and out of your service with the exact same difficulties. I learned to accept the limits of the role, what I could do and achieve and it was a big and disappointing realisation.

Is it rewarding? You may guess my answer from above. Yes and no. The single best thing to happen in 3 years? A young girl saying thank you. It's only happened once and from talking to other people, it's going to be a rare event indeed. I've never had that breakthrough moment, when it all clicks into place and genuine change occurs, there have been glimmers but never the whole thing. It happens, but again, its rare. Bear in mind, I'm an Assistant Psychologist and only been working for 3 years, over a career, where you have much more clinical contact, you'll no doubt have many more 'successful' cases. A lot of my role is inputting data, scoring assessments, writing reports, is that rewarding? Not especially. It's nice when an idea or piece of work you do is praised, but that isn't really above what you'd get elsewhere. Having said that, if I could pick any other career in the world, would I change? Probably not. I work with some of the most vulnerable young people there are in Britain and there is something to be said about knowing you're working to help them, improve their lives and make a difference of some kind. Adolescents like to tell you they don't care, but they are lying, they do care and they see you as someone who is there to help them and they often want your help – it does build a bond. Their successes become your successes and you grieve at their failures, I've found myself becoming angry on their behalf. I think there is always something in knowing that you're doing the right thing as well.

There's some brutal honesty in there, perhaps not enough? There is one thing that has annoyed me to no end since signing up to TSR (but really lies at the door of Colleges and Universities) and that is the lack of truth in the teaching of Psychology. Lots and lots of lovely theory and absolutely nothing to tell you about what it is actually like to be a Psychologist and deliver therapy. I didn't find this stuff out until I got my first AP role.

I don't write this to put you off, as someone said the other day, I'm here because I like the challenge – they are probably right. It's a wonderful job, a wonderful career and if you take to it, you'll do wonderful things in it. But the reality of it shouldn't be hidden for you to find out in your first month on the job (and I'm not even joking).

Does that answer your question at all? If nothing else it was cathartic for me, even with the rage induced by losing it all and having to re-type it.

Reply 6

usernameskillful

OP

Yes, it does answer my question. I appreciate your honesty and thank you again for taking the time to share your experience. Your response definitely didn't put me off and although I won't be able to confirm to you anytime soon if I have taken any steps towards a career in Psychology, I am happy to report that your response has motivated me 93% to change from a career in law to Psychology.

Genuinely, thank you.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 7

wanderer12

If you do the masters conversion course in psychology do you still have to do another masters on top? how did you pay for this do you fund it yourself?

thanks if you can reply

Reply 8

phantompain

1

Original post by wanderer12

If you do the masters conversion course in psychology do you still have to do another masters on top? how did you pay for this do you fund it yourself?

thanks if you can reply

Hi, did you ever receive a reply on this question? I'm currently trying to find out whether there is a necessity to do another MSc on top of the conversion course.

Reply 9

_Sinnie_

15

Original post by wanderer12

If you do the masters conversion course in psychology do you still have to do another masters on top? how did you pay for this do you fund it yourself?

thanks if you can reply

Getting an MSc is not essential, unless you wish to become a Health Psychologist (where the MSc grants stage 1 of your chartership) - you can also do an MSc in Forensic Psychology to grant you stage 1. Other areas may require an MSc, I'm not sure. For Clinical, it is not required but is increasingly common

It is a really interesting question. The core role of the BSc is to grant GBC (BPS accreditation), with the conversion MSc providing GBC for those that completed a different BSc.

The Clinical Doctorate courses like you to have an MSc as it a) makes you stand out from those with just a BSc and makes it easier to shortlist and b) it is evidence of working at a 'higher' level. I would imagine that the conversion MSc is of an equivalent academic rigour to a typical MSc and therefore would be afforded the same weight - but I don't know for sure.

I wouldn't say that getting a second MSc would boost your credentials over and above having the conversion; my gut feeling would be that the conversion MSc would be rated the same as any other masters.

Reply 10

phantompain

1

Original post by _Sinnie_

Getting an MSc is not essential, unless you wish to become a Health Psychologist (where the MSc grants stage 1 of your chartership) - you can also do an MSc in Forensic Psychology to grant you stage 1. Other areas may require an MSc, I'm not sure. For Clinical, it is not required but is increasingly common

It is a really interesting question. The core role of the BSc is to grant GBC (BPS accreditation), with the conversion MSc providing GBC for those that completed a different BSc.

The Clinical Doctorate courses like you to have an MSc as it a) makes you stand out from those with just a BSc and makes it easier to shortlist and b) it is evidence of working at a 'higher' level. I would imagine that the conversion MSc is of an equivalent academic rigour to a typical MSc and therefore would be afforded the same weight - but I don't know for sure.

I wouldn't say that getting a second MSc would boost your credentials over and above having the conversion; my gut feeling would be that the conversion MSc would be rated the same as any other masters.

It is indeed an interesting question, especially for people like myself who pursued a BA in the arts. And then graduate with the wish to change career paths. I'm currently under the impression that I'll need to a BPS accredited course, such as the Psychology conversion MSc before I can even consider any other further education?

Which is somewhat unfortunate for me, as I have a deep interest in pursuing work in Psychological Trauma, and there is actually a MSc (only one of its kind) that I'd actually prefer to take but I don't think it is BPS accredited, therefore, it wouldn't give me much to run with when pursuing a PhD.

Sinnie, if you have a moment could you enlighten me on something? As far as I can see there seems to be this progression route:

-Undertake a Bsc (or do a conversion MSc)
-Get experience
-Pursue a further MSc
-Apply for a PhD
-Then apple for a Clinical Doctorate training programme

How do you differentiate a PhD from a Clinical Doctorate?

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 11

spidersax

Original post by phantompain

It is indeed an interesting question, especially for people like myself who pursued a BA in the arts. And then graduate with the wish to change career paths. I'm currently under the impression that I'll need to a BPS accredited course, such as the Psychology conversion MSc before I can even consider any other further education?

Which is somewhat unfortunate for me, as I have a deep interest in pursuing work in Psychological Trauma, and there is actually a MSc (only one of its kind) that I'd actually prefer to take but I don't think it is BPS accredited, therefore, it wouldn't give me much to run with when pursuing a PhD.

Sinnie, if you have a moment could you enlighten me on something? As far as I can see there seems to be this progression route:

-Undertake a Bsc (or do a conversion MSc)
-Get experience
-Pursue a further MSc
-Apply for a PhD
-Then apple for a Clinical Doctorate training programme

How do you differentiate a PhD from a Clinical Doctorate?

I think a PhD and a Clinical Doctorate are at the same level, it just depends what route you want to go down. If you want to do academic research, then take the PhD. If you want to become a clinical psychologist, then take the Clinical Doctorate.

Reply 12

Lord Asriel

11

-Undertake a Bsc (or do a conversion MSc)
-Get experience
-Pursue a further MSc
-Apply for a PhD
-Then apple for a Clinical Doctorate training programme

How do you differentiate a PhD from a Clinical Doctorate?

Most trainees on a clinical doctorate will not have a PhD, but several do. I was one who did a PhD before doing their DClinPsy. The two doctorates are very different.
A DClinPsy is a professional training course where you get a mix of academic lectures, tutorials and workshops where you learn skill. You learn to apply psychological theory around assessment, formulation and treatment in a variety of contexts including adult, child, learing difficulty and older adult services learning from a number of tutors and supervisors. You complete a medium size research project along side this and the whole thing is heavily scheduled.

A PhD is a research focussed degree, where you just do one massive project for 3+ years. You don't learn about treatment, have to attend lectures or do placements- you just do research. You typically have 1 or 2 supervisors but it is very self guided and open ended.

Requirements for Psychology Conversion Courses?

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